Spell Resolving question

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Another one I should know the answer to but am blanking on:

I know targets and costs are set when a spell is played. But when
are other variables set?

Specific example:

Riptide Survivor
{2}{U}
Creature -- Wizard
2/1
Morph {1}{U}{U} (You may play this face down as a 2/2 creature for {3}.
Turn it face up any time for its morph cost.)
When Riptide Survivor is turned face up, discard two cards from your
hand, then draw three cards.

Rush of Knowledge
{4}{U}
Sorcery
Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents you
control.

I have Riptide Survivor in play, face down, and no other
permanents other than lands in play.

I have Rush of Knowledge as my sole card in hand.

A) I play Rush of Knowledge for {4}{U}.

B) I turn Riptide Survivor face up for {1}{U}{U}.

C) I have no cards in hand so discard none, then draw three.

D) Rush of Knowledge resolves.

With Rush of Knowledge give me three more cards based on
Riptide Survivor's converted mana cost of three?
(That's how it was ruled the other night, and what I believed
was correct.)

Or will it only give me zero cards as that was my highest converted
mana cost when I played it?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:

> Another one I should know the answer to but am blanking on:
>
> I know targets and costs are set when a spell is played. But when
> are other variables set?

When they are used.

413.2f If an effect requires information from the game (such as the
number of creatures in play), the answer is determined only once, when
the effect is applied. The effect uses the current information of a
specific permanent if that permanent is still in play, or of a specific
card in the stated zone; otherwise, the effect uses the last known
information the object had before leaving that zone. The exception is
that static abilities can't use last known information; see rule 412.5.
If the ability text states that an object does something, it's the
object as it exists (or most recently existed) that does it, not the
ability.

(Note that rule 409 has an explicit list of decisions that are made when
a spell is played.)

> With Rush of Knowledge give me three more cards based on
> Riptide Survivor's converted mana cost of three?
> (That's how it was ruled the other night, and what I believed
> was correct.)
>
> Or will it only give me zero cards as that was my highest converted
> mana cost when I played it?

Which of the following looks more like the effect of Rush of Knowledge?

Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents you
control.

Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents you
controlled when Rush of Knowledge was played.
--
Daniel W. Johnson
panoptes@iquest.net
http://members.iquest.net/~panoptes/
039 53 36 N / 086 11 55 W

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> writes:
> Another one I should know the answer to but am blanking on:
>
> I know targets and costs are set when a spell is played. But when
> are other variables set?

Everything done as the spell is being played (section 409.1 in the
Comprehensive Rules (http://www.wizards.com/magic/comprules)) is set
at that time. Everything else is done on resolution.

Quick summary of things done/set while spell being played: Modes, X,
alternative/additional/special costs, targets, division of effect
between targets, paying the cost.

> Specific example:
>
> Riptide Survivor
> {2}{U}
> Creature -- Wizard
> 2/1
> Morph {1}{U}{U} (You may play this face down as a 2/2 creature for {3}.
> Turn it face up any time for its morph cost.)
> When Riptide Survivor is turned face up, discard two cards from your
> hand, then draw three cards.
>
> Rush of Knowledge
> {4}{U}
> Sorcery
> Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents
> you control.
>
> I have Riptide Survivor in play, face down, and no other
> permanents other than lands in play.
>
> I have Rush of Knowledge as my sole card in hand.
>
> A) I play Rush of Knowledge for {4}{U}.
> B) I turn Riptide Survivor face up for {1}{U}{U}.
> C) I have no cards in hand so discard none, then draw three.
> D) Rush of Knowledge resolves.
>
> With Rush of Knowledge give me three more cards based on
> Riptide Survivor's converted mana cost of three?
> (That's how it was ruled the other night, and what I believed
> was correct.)
>
> Or will it only give me zero cards as that was my highest converted
> mana cost when I played it?

It will give you 3 cards. Calculations done on what's in play aren't
on the list of things set on playing the spell, so they are calculated
on resolution.

--
Peter C.
"Never eat more than you can lift."
-- Miss Piggy

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules (More info?)

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 11:10:51 -0400, Sorcier <sNoErMcOier@cavtel.net> wrote:
>Another one I should know the answer to but am blanking on:
>
>I know targets and costs are set when a spell is played. But when
>are other variables set?

The ones noted in 409.1a-1i are set on announcement; anything else is
read in on resolution only.

>Specific example:
>
>Riptide Survivor 2U Creature -- Wizard
>2/1 Morph 1UU (*) When ~ is turned face up, discard two cards from your
> hand, then draw three cards.
>Rush of Knowledge 4U Sorcery
> Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost among permanents you
> control.

Rush of Knowledge asks for the information about converted mana costs only
once it's resolving; nothing in 409.1* says to read in converted mana costs
of anything at all on announcement.

>I have Riptide Survivor in play, face down, and no other
>permanents other than lands in play.
>
>I have Rush of Knowledge as my sole card in hand.
>
>A) I play Rush of Knowledge for {4}{U}.
>B) I turn Riptide Survivor face up for {1}{U}{U}.
>C) I have no cards in hand so discard none, then draw three.

Right.

>D) Rush of Knowledge resolves.
>
>With Rush of Knowledge give me three more cards based on
>Riptide Survivor's converted mana cost of three?

Yes. It had no particular reason to 'lock in' the converted mana cost
Riptide Survivor had back on announcement of the RoK, so it didn't do so.

Dave
--
\/David DeLaney posting from dbd@vic.com "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.