SSD size, Raid0 and Win8 install

[A_noob]

Some of my parts are on their way, others have yet to be ordered, so I do have additional time to read these forums & digest the information http://pcpartpicker.com/p/3ck8b

I've been reading so many threads about win8 installation, raid configuration & such, I feel as if my eyes are beginning to bleed

all this information has lead me to a couple questions which I hope you can be of assistance with:

1) if I use 2 SSD's in Raid0, and strictly use them for the OS, with everything else going on a HDD, is it necessary to "go big" with respect to the SSD size? Win8 only requires 20GB of space, so why not simply use a couple 25GB SSD's "just to be sure"? (my intentions are to use a pair of 240GB SSD's in Raid0, but this question, in particular, has my head spinning)

2) For just general use, I've read anything from 512MB to 4KB for stripe size, depending on what article & by whom: for general use, with added .jpg viewing/sorting, & occasional video editing (more along the lines of home videos & the like), what would your recommendation be as to the size of the stripe?

3) it appears as though there is no "full version" of Win8 available: anything win8 has to be in the form of an upgrade, which, in fact, was confirmed by the MS store....or are they full of BS?

4) will setting up raid, installing win7 & then using the win8 upgrade make much of a significant difference as far as speed or general performance?

5) most of the Raid stuff I'm reading all mention having the raid drivers on a flash drive: is this added step of copying the files from the MoBo disk to the flash drive really a necessary evil & if so, why? why not simply locate the files on the dis & use that; or am I being extremely dense?

 

[Someone Somewhere]

RAID0 SSDs is to be avoided if at all possible. You're doubling failure rates for fairly mild benefits.

You can definitely get Win8 full versions, though MS makes it tough to get the ISOs. I'd go for 7, personally.

I'd go for something that doesn't have a Sandforce controller.

I'm not sure if the mobo disk has them in the right format; they're usually executables whereas the installer wants INF files.

Also, the build has a whole pile of stuff I'd consider overkill, overpriced, or unnecessary. What's it for?

 

[Alec Mowat]

1) I use 2 RAID0 SSD's with no issues. Both 120, so I get about 220 GB of C: disk space. This is using the onboard RAID controller.
I also have a 360 GB disk for backups. I can quickly format and copy Windows from an image level backup.

2) Leave it at default; not much difference really http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/RAID-SCALING-CHARTS,1735-6.html

3) You can buy Win 8. It's generally boxed as Windows 8.1 now, 8 is the older version. The service pack will be released in April.

4) The RAID is setup through the RAID controller, Windows won't know it's a RAID. It just sees one disk.
Just find a Windows 8 DVD in a retail store, they are around. Once you insert the Upgrade Disk, it should give you a full installation option though.

You can actually setup a RAID in the Windows Disk Manager. I got fairly good performance from 2 150 WD Raptors in a RAID0, better than the RAID controller itself.

5) Back in the day, the RAID drivers for the disk needed to be installed during the Windows installation. On a modern motherboard, this won't be the case.

 

[A_noob]

Also, the build has a whole pile of stuff I'd consider overkill, overpriced, or unnecessary. What's it for?

to be completely honest, I tend to "overbuild" or "overspec" all my systems....in my crazy, OCD mind, it makes them last a bit longer until I have to upgrade

again, with honesty as the culprit, I really don't NEED 1/2 of the speed & power, but it's the WANT that causes me to over build..if for no other reason than "it's gotta scream"

 

[Someone Somewhere]

The issue is that it really doesn't make it much faster. Overhead will probably eat into your speeds a lot.

It's usually a lot more cost effective to put some money aside now, then upgrade more often. Particularly with GPUs and SSDs, as prices for both have been nosediving over the last few years.

If you want to overbuild, though, get something more than a 770.

Also, drop the velociraptor. Their day is gone.

 

[Technocaveman]

no point in raiding 2 ssd's for startup, you want time to sit down after you hit the power button. i'm running win 8 from 1 60g vertex, the post screen takes longer then the startup.

i wouldn't bother with the raptor, that will get you 2 nice 1 gig drives you can raid together if you really must raid something. or a 3 gig hdd if you shop around.

 

[Alec Mowat]

The issue is that it really doesn't make it much faster. Overhead will probably eat into your speeds a lot.

It's usually a lot more cost effective to put some money aside now, then upgrade more often. Particularly with GPUs and SSDs, as prices for both have been nosediving over the last few years.

If you want to overbuild, though, get something more than a 770.

Also, drop the velociraptor. Their day is gone.

Depends on the SATA controller more than anything. A weak SATA controller won't give much performance gain over a single disk, but it will give some.
It's only as fast as the controller.

You could buy a $500 PCIe SATA controller.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

In response to a PM for my suggestions:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i7-4930K 3.4GHz 6-Core Processor (Purchased For $589.99)
CPU Cooler: Corsair H110 94.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler (Purchased For $119.99)
Motherboard: Asus P9X79 LE ATX LGA2011 Motherboard ($229.79 @ Amazon)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance 16GB (4 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($169.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Crucial M500 480GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($229.99 @ Amazon)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 3TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($109.40 @ Amazon)
Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 780 3GB Video Card ($499.99 @ Amazon)
Case: Thermaltake Urban S31 Window ATX Mid Tower Case (Purchased For $84.99)
Power Supply: SeaSonic M12II 850W 80+ Bronze Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($119.99 @ Amazon)
Optical Drive: Asus DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS DVD/CD Writer ($22.95 @ Amazon)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8 Professional (OEM) (64-bit)
Monitor: Asus VS239H-P 23.0" Monitor (Purchased For $168.98)
Monitor: Asus VS239H-P 23.0" Monitor (Purchased For $168.98)
Case Fan: Corsair Air Series AF120 Performance Edition (2-Pack) 63.5 CFM 120mm Fans (Purchased For $28.00)
Keyboard: Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 Wired Ergonomic Keyboard ($36.82 @ Amazon)
Other: Akasa 3.5" USB 3.0 SuperSpeed Memory Card Reader (Purchased For $29.99)
Total: $2609.84
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-03-19 00:51 EDT-0400)

If you do really want stupidly fast storage, go for a PCIe SSD or something. But IMO it's not worth it, once you've got an SSD storage is very rarely a bottleneck.

 

[Alec Mowat]

PCIe SSD are not good for OS installations, better for large file storage.

http://www.tweaktown.com/reviews/5921/asus-rog-raidr-express-240gb-pcie-ssd-review/index9.html

 

[Someone Somewhere]

Actually, that article's out of date. There wasn't a standard when it was running, but SATA Express is out now.

 

[Alec Mowat]

Dec 6, 2013 3:04 pm is out of date?

March 15, 2014
http://www.extremetech.com/computing/178481-sata-express-new-storage-standard-promises-dramatically-faster-performance

It's certainly announced, but it's far from "standard"

 

[Someone Somewhere]

Somewhat. M.2 is reasonably prevalent, now.

You'll note that their bootup time measurement is for Vista.

Thanks, I'd forgotten the name of the exact bit I wanted. NVMe is the important standard.

 

[Alec Mowat]

In that case, you have SATA6 and PCIe, but for which PCIe SSD's you find on the market, the results are compatible.

"Ultimately this has been one of my biggest issues with these multi-controller PCIe SSDs, they rarely offer a tangible benefit over a DIY RAID setup."
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0AJ14N6007

Quoted: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4470/ocz-revodrive-3-x2-480gb-preview/7


You are going to get a performance gain from a RAID0, and it will be less expensive. This is the most expensive drive on the newegg, and it's just as old.

 

[Someone Somewhere]

NVMe is native PCIe, no SATA involved. That's the point of it.