Static pressure fans

[kikutix84]

Hi,

I recently bought kraken x62 aio and have some serious issues with airflow. Using 2 included fans (atm in push/pull config - fans on top of the rad) and want to increase airflow in the case as push configuration resulted in 0 airflow (in silent mode). CPU reaches 73 in stress and GPU 70 - ryzen5 1600 and gtx 1080 msi gaming x plus.

I read a lot about static pressure fans etc. Wanted to buy noctua industrial fan 2000rpm pwm, thought about corsair ml series. I really dont understand why some "static pressure" fans are called that with sp around 1mm h2o. What would be the real difference between 1, 2 or 3mm? Is ot worth to pay double to increase this value by 1mm ? Can you recommend some 140mm fans to mount on radiator ?

Thanks a lot

 

[jtabb1256]

Noctuas are pretty good and these EK ones are what Jay'sTwoCentz uses sometimes: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/radiators-fans/fans/140mm

 

[jtabb1256]

2.08mm H2O for Noctua: http://noctua.at/en/products/fan/nf-a14-pwm

vs.

up to 5.28 for the biggest EK vardar.

vs.

Corsair's newest entry: http://www.corsair.com/en-us/ml140-pro-140mm-premium-magnetic-levitation-fan

All three are great options. PWM allows your computer's fans to be quiet when they can be and loud when they have to be. Non-PWM is offered by some of these companies and is cheaper, but too loud in my opinion.

 

[jtabb1256]

P = F/A
A of 140mm fan is PI*(70mm)^2 = 15,393.804mm^2 = .0154m^2
P = 1mm H2O * (m H2O / 1000mm H2O) * ((1.01325 x 10^5 N/m^2)/10.333m H2O)) = 9.81 N/m^2 or 9.81 Pa
F = P*A = 9.81 N/m^2* (.0154 m^2) = .151 N


So, an increase of 1mm H2O of pressure on a 140mm fan is an increase of about .151 N of force blowing through your radiator.

Seems like a small amount, but you can look at it another way. 3mm H2O is three times as much as 1 mmH2O. That's a huge difference. (Think about driving at 100 mph vs. 300mph)

 

[Paperdoc]

Wait! Your post says. "...push configuration resulted in 0 airflow (in silent mode)." Does that mean that you set the fans on your rad to "Silent Mode"? Do you realize that what you did was force the fans to run very slow (so they would be quiet) and give you VERY poor air flow and cooling? That might explain why you got "0 airflow" and high temperatures. Set the fans to use a normal automatic Mode so that the system can change the fan speeds according to the cooling needs. of your system.

 

[kikutix84]

Noctuas are pretty good and these EK ones are what Jay'sTwoCentz uses sometimes: https://www.ekwb.com/shop/radiators-fans/fans/140mm

EK are unavailable in my country. Not all but the ones you mentioned about.

2.08mm H2O for Noctua: http://noctua.at/en/products/fan/nf-a14-pwm
vs.
up to 5.28 for the biggest EK vardar.
vs.
Corsair's newest entry: http://www.corsair.com/en-us/ml140-pro-140mm-premium-magnetic-levitation-fan

All three are great options. PWM allows your computer's fans to be quiet when they can be and loud when they have to be. Non-PWM is offered by some of these companies and is cheaper, but too loud in my opinion.

To be honest, I read about ML140 series but found some info that they are loud, even at medium RPM. I even ordered two (not obligated to purchase). Twinpack costs about 35EUR which is a bit more than one Noctua iPPC 2000.

P = F/A
A of 140mm fan is PI*(70mm)^2 = 15,393.804mm^2 = .0154m^2
P = 1mm H2O * (m H2O / 1000mm H2O) * ((1.01325 x 10^5 N/m^2)/10.333m H2O)) = 9.81 N/m^2 or 9.81 Pa
F = P*A = 9.81 N/m^2* (.0154 m^2) = .151 N

So, an increase of 1mm H2O of pressure on a 140mm fan is an increase of about .151 N of force blowing through your radiator.

Seems like a small amount, but you can look at it another way. 3mm H2O is three times as much as 1 mmH2O. That's a huge difference. (Think about driving at 100 mph vs. 300mph)

This is the thing I don't know. I found some tests like THIS where Antec TQ 140mm is the most efficient SP fan with 0.05mm H20 - lol. Corsair SP140 is called "high static pressure fan" with 1,17 mmH20. Then, is it high enough or not?

Wait! Your post says. "...push configuration resulted in 0 airflow (in silent mode)." Does that mean that you set the fans on your rad to "Silent Mode"? Do you realize that what you did was force the fans to run very slow (so they would be quiet) and give you VERY poor air flow and cooling? That might explain why you got "0 airflow" and high temperatures. Set the fans to use a normal automatic Mode so that the system can change the fan speeds according to the cooling needs. of your system.

Here is initial configuration - https://imgur.com/a/YC5BW
I used kraken fans in push configuration (silent mode) - fans are running on 50% so I can barely hear them. Their parameters are:

Fan Airflow - Aer P140: 27.27~98.17 CFM
Fan Air Pressure - Aer P140: 0.21~2.71mm-H2O (not sure if the graph of static pressure/RPM's is a straight line but at 50% speed it should be around 1,8mm H20)
Fan Noise Level - Aer P140: 21~38dBA

I changed config to push/pull with two fans only - that's why I'm looking for additional fans.

I'm also aware of the fact I won't have dead silence and low temps but 37C in idle is even too high.

edit: I went back to initial config (push/pull on half of the rad resulted high liquid temps and therefore higher fan speed).

 

[chegalhavara]

All I can say is that I got 2x ML140 and they are brutal. They can be loud at 2000 rpm but they are very silent even at 50% with a lot of airflow.
Every fan is loud at high rpms.

 

[jtabb1256]

I don't know if I would trust that source for the fan comparison. That one guy in the comments is right in saying their methodology must not be very consistent.

Here is one that looks better, but is only for 120mm fans. I think you could make an analogy though by seeing that a 120mm fan from x brand with a pressure listed as y is actually z. Therefore, their 140mm fan's actual pressure will differ by a similar amount... http://www.overclockers.com/pwm-fan-roundup-twenty-four-120-mm-case-fans-tested/

 

[jtabb1256]

All I can say is that I got 2x ML140 and they are brutal. They can be loud at 2000 rpm but they are very silent even at 50% with a lot of airflow.
Every fan is loud at high rpms.

That's awesome. I may get some for a future water - cooled build.

 

[kikutix84]

I did some reseach with Noctua iPPC fans and push/pull config. It has no sense...

With two NZXT AER P 140 fans in push config (front intake / top, back exhaust)

IDLE:
CPU: 32 / GPU: 40 (fans 50%)
CPU: 32 / GPU: 43 (fans 25%)

CPU LOAD:
CPU: 64 / GPU: 40 (fans 50%)

CPU & GPU LOAD:
CPU: 64 / GPU: 73 (fans 53% - speed has increased due to higher liquid temp)



With two Noctua iPPC 2000 PWM fans in push config (front intake / top, back exhaust)

IDLE: 32 / GPU: 37 (fans 50%)

CPU & GPU LOAD:
CPU: 66 / GPU: 73 (fans ~55%)


With two Noctua iPPC 2000 PWM + NZXT Aer P 140 in push/pull config (front intake / top, back exhaust)

IDLE: 32 / GPU: 35 (fans 50%)

CPU & GPU LOAD:
CPU: 66 / GPU: 73 (fans ~55%)


### NOTICE: Speed of exhaust fans didn't affect the result ###
### NOTICE: Stress test was AIDA's system stability test ran for 10mins / ambient temp: 23-24C ###

### CONCLUSION ###

In this scenario adding two noctuas into push/pull config didn't make a big difference - sometimes it's even worse. In my subjective opinion noise is preety the same as before adding fans.
Hope this will help someone

I don't know if I would trust that source for the fan comparison. That one guy in the comments is right in saying their methodology must not be very consistent.

Here is one that looks better, but is only for 120mm fans. I think you could make an analogy though by seeing that a 120mm fan from x brand with a pressure listed as y is actually z. Therefore, their 140mm fan's actual pressure will differ by a similar amount... http://www.overclockers.com/pwm-fan-roundup-twenty-four-120-mm-case-fans-tested/

I found some 120mm fans which have good parameters (high SP, CFM etc.) but their 140mm versions are not that good. Sometime's much worse.

 

[krells]

Is your case the Phanteks P400? If so have you tried removing the front panel and testing? If the front panel is restricting airflow changing the fans won't change much.

 

[kikutix84]

Is your case the Phanteks P400? If so have you tried removing the front panel and testing? If the front panel is restricting airflow changing the fans won't change much.

Yes, P400s. I removed front panel but with "old" fans. Going to do some additional tests.

 

[kikutix84]

I tested the system w/o front panel. Removing it resulted only in a bit lower CPU temps - GPU temps remained the same.
Anyway, it make no sense to remove it.

 

[chegalhavara]

Im not shure if anyone asked this, but, what are your ambient temps? If they are like 28C I wouldnt wonder your cpu was like 37 at idle.
Not to mention that mounting your radiator on top, you are cooling it with hot air from inside the case.
Just a thought.

 

[kikutix84]

Im not shure if anyone asked this, but, what are your ambient temps? If they are like 28C I wouldnt wonder your cpu was like 37 at idle.
Not to mention that mounting your radiator on top, you are cooling it with hot air from inside the case.
Just a thought.

Ambient temp is about 23-24C

I kept Noctua fans to have push/pull config.