System for gaming and HDTV

highkftj · Sep 14, 2009

Hi,
I need a pd desktop around 600-900 bucks which is able to handle entry level/old games (old car simulators) but mostly which is able to output any video I have on my hd to my HDTV via hdmi. Thus I am looking for a video card with at least 1) DVI for connecting the monitor and 2) HDMI with audio support for sending the video+audio to my hdtv

I read that ge force need to have the audio hooked up via spdif with the mobo or audio card in order to have audio over hdmi output. that's why I was thinking to move more to a radeon system which seems to handle better the problem. I saw that 4350 or 4550 have good gaming entry level with a good hdmi support, up to 1080p.

at the moment, after reading all the possible combination I found two system which satisfy my needs, but I am not sure if they would really work and if there is any better possibility:

a) pc: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229117 with monitor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824009157

this system sounds pretty good and it would be perfect if it had a firewire support...(needed to edit some video). is there any possibility to have a front panel multi card reader/usb/firewire to connect to the pc (also with pci connection to the mobo if the mobo does not support directly the connections)

b) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883113106

this also look a pretty nice system but I am not sure if the g210 worked for streaming audio + video over hdmi. why gateway is not more specific about this point and doen't say if the system has the audio connection via spdif.

Any helps, comment or advice on above or other system would be really appreciated!

Thanks

build · Sep 15, 2009

The picture was too small for me so I didn't bother looking at it. My bad

Anyway, gotta go to sleep.

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

^ You can always Right-Click "View Image".

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

build · Sep 15, 2009

Sorry

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

I Didn't mean anything

highkftj · Sep 15, 2009

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

The PSU you specified isn't trusty for me.
The GPU i listed has a $10 MIR and life-time warranty.
The SAMSUNG SpinPoint F3 is better than the WD Black due to the new single 500GB Platter.
Everything else is a personal preference and demands.

Medo

build · Sep 15, 2009

How about this for case + PSU then?

Rosewill Wind Ryder RZLS142A-P BK Dual 120mm Cooling Fans $29.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147114

COOLER MASTER eXtreme Power RS550-PCARE3-US 550W $59.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171038

Total = $90

It's cheaper than that Antec bundle and includes a larger PSU for a nice safety buffer. I trust Coolermaster since I have one in my gaming rig

By the way, that GPU you listed doesn't have native HDMI, which the OP needs.

I agree about the HDD though

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

How about.. this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161290&cm_re=hd_4850-_-14-161-290-_-Product
Or this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161296&cm_re=hd_4850-_-14-161-296-_-Product
The same company with life-time warranty and native HDMI
About the PSU i can't find any info about its A output

Medo

highkftj · Sep 15, 2009

Hi Guys,

so I added everything as from your advice (and the coolmaster which Psycho likes a lot LOL) and my budget is stretched to the limit

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

Link?

highkftj · Sep 15, 2009

http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0315153

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

I linked you to http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161296&cm_re=hd_4850-_-14-161-296-_-Product
It has lifetime warranty, better cooling, native HDMI port and $10 cheaper

Is there any particular concern about it to get ignored?? Or do you need something else?

About the DELL:
1. You don't know what motherboard and whatever it is it won't let you OC.
2. The GPU is HD4670.
3. It includes TONS of trial software pre-installed as a bonus for who buys from them :kaola:

4. It doesn't include a Win7 Upgrade.

PS: Why is this thread marked as UK site one?!!

Medo

highkftj · Sep 15, 2009

I changed the video card, but I hope this one has no issues to output audio over hdmi. the sapphire specificaly said audio over hdmi and I read that a lot of people have troubles to try to have a decent pc to output video. Anyway, I know that this system is far better and you can do whatever you want with it, especially the monitor (dell monitors are so crap...) but on the other hand I was thinking to save money, instead I am going to spend the same or a little more
also I have to consider the possible issues that people can have when the assemble pcs, like incompatibility, missing drivers (remember I am going to use win xp x64 which is not the more spread all over...)
anyway I like your ideas about building a very good system. it's like a racing car versus a production car....
do you think that these money are well spent??

I don't know why there is this uk stuff, I live in chicago and i started the post from toms USA... weird things LOL

psycho sykes · Sep 15, 2009

^ Actually it doesn't even include a monitor!!

For the Audio over HDMI I'll see what i can find.
You won't regret it

:lol:

Medo

lunyone · Sep 15, 2009

highkftj :

Well this is why I suggest the AMD route. You save >$200 over your final build and my original build had the monitor and the OS included. If you want to spend that much on a system than you should state that in the beginning. I still think my Antec Case/PSU combo is the best buy, but whatever you want to spend its up to you.

Unfortunately my links were all screwed up, so I'll try and replecate the build again

lunyone · Sep 15, 2009

~$187 - $10 MIRc = $177!
AMD PhII x3 720 Black Edition w/AMD 770 mobo

$100 shipped!! Hard to beat at this price and has NATIVE HDMI!!
SAPPHIRE 100245HDMI Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail

$80 shipped!!!
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-4GBRL - Retail

$70 shipped! One of the better HD's out on the market for the $!
Western Digital Caviar Blue WD6400AAKS 640GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive - OEM

$90 shipped! Has a >80% efficient PSU and also has 30A on the combined 12v rails, which is plenty for the 4850 GPU!
Antec 300 case w/Antec 430w Earthwatts PSU!

$31 shipped! Basic DVD burner, you can use whichever one you like here, just a suggestion.
HP Black 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 12X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 12X DVD-RAM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM SATA 24X Multiformat DVD Burner LightScribe Support - Retail

$150 shipped! Nice LCD and has HDMI input if you want to use it!!
Acer X213Hbid Black 21.5" 5ms HDMI Widescreen LCD Monitor 300 cd/m2 20000:1 (ACM) - Retail

$110 shipped! Yeah it's Vista, but you get the free upgrade to Win7, which you want!
Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit for System Builders w/ Tech Guarantee - OEM

Total ~$818 - $10 MIRc = $808!! Now I think this is the best compromise between a performance and cost. If you want to raise your budget to $1k your chomping into the i7 range there and that is what I'd do if I was going to spend $1k on a system. The i5 is nice, but I believe the i7 is going to have better upgrades down the road over the i5. The i5 is just a system to battle AMD in the midrange market, so AMD will have to combat this sooner than later.

highkftj · Sep 16, 2009

So far we have three systems:

Psycho and build: i5 @ 1000$ without OS

microncenter: i7 @ 800 + monitor and peripherals = 1000$ with OS

lunyone: amd @ 850 (if you add remote, keyboard, mouse, same stuff) with OS

I would like to show you this combination I just made valid only for today and tomorrow on DELL. Studio xps with i7, 6 ram three channels, 1 T raid 0 performance 940$ + monitor = 1100$ with OS

Module Description Description Product Code & SKU Product Code & SKU
Studio XPS Studio XPS featuring Core i7 processors 435MTH [224-3607]
Operating System Genuine Windows Vista® Home Premium Edition SP1, 64-Bit VHP61E [330-2980][420-6436][420-7938][420-8873][420-8874][421-0084][421-0092][421-0323][421-0427][421-0530][421-1183][463-2282]
Processors Intel® Core™ i7-920 Processor(8MB L3 Cache, 2.66GHz) MI7920 [311-9770]
Memory 6GB Tri-Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1066MHz - 6 DIMMs 6G1066D [311-9800]
Keyboard Logitech Cordless Desktop S 510 Keyboard and Mouse - Arctic Silver 1307990 [310-3798][310-3799][A1307990]
Monitor No Monitor N [320-7706]
Video Card nVidia GeForce GT 220, 1024MB GT220 [320-8270]
Hard Drives 1TB Performance RAID 0 (2 x 500GB SATA 3Gb/s 7200 RPM HDDs) 1000R0 [341-8295]
Floppy Drive or Media Card Reader Dell Media Card Reader included in Dell Bluetooth Package NMEDCRD [341-5593]
Mouse Mouse included with Keyboard purchase NONE [310-5678]
Network Card Integrated 10/1000 Ethernet IE [430-3347]
Modem (External) No Modem Option N [313-3607]
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0 Multi-Language AAREAD [410-1867]
Optical Drives Dual Drives: Internal Qflix-enabled DVD Burner and DVD-ROM INTQFXD [313-7821][420-8149][421-0524][421-0525][421-0997]
Sound Card Soundblaster X-Fi Xtreme Audio XFIB [313-7358]
Speaker No speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system) N [313-4514]
Office Productivity Software (Pre-Installed) No Productivity software pre-installed MSONO [412-1397]
Security Software Norton Internet Security™ 2009 Edition 15-months NIS915M [410-2156]
Hardware Support Services 2Yr Ltd Hardware Warranty, InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis S222OS [412-0360][902-0931][950-3338][960-8700][985-7631][991-7130][992-9668][992-9687]
Service 1 Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year DOB2GB [420-9518][988-0099][988-7707]
Labels Windows Vista™ Premium VPD [310-8626]
Dell Remote Access Dell Remote Access, free basic service DRAFB [420-9800][993-1919]
Bluetooth Options Dell 19 in 1 Media Reader with Bluetooth

Sub Total $948.00 + acer monitor = 1100$

The question is: is DELL so crappy which gives you a i7 system full memory and hd for 1000 or 1100 depending on the configuration?
I mean if you build your own system you are going to spend much more or if you want to stay on the same budget you are going to get a lower processor??

Also if anything goes wrong, you can just return the whole system to dell, if you are not satisfied... drivers are all presents, no conflicts, and you can format the pc and install just the stuff you want (thing that I always do)

if you build your own system and anything goes wrong (incompatibility, driver issues...) it's just your problem. also people of a big chain like dell can try different peripherals until they don't find the better mix for that system. a single person cannot afford to buy a bunch of different parts and try which is the best one. any peripheral can be the best by itself, but give bad results if doesn't match well enough with the whole system.

I thought I could have saved a lot of money rather than buying a major seller system, but I feel very uncomfortable and kind of risky in spending the same amount of money, having a system which has less processor power and the unpredictability of the real performances.

lunyone · Sep 16, 2009

Okay you need to look at what your getting into a bit.

Self build pros:
* You select which parts you want with what option you want.
* You have the same 1 yr. warranty that Dell/HP/Gateway/etc. offer on parts.
* The parts that you buy fit your needs. You can add/subtract things that you don't need.
* You pay the street price for the parts, not the inflated prices from Dell/HP/etc.
* You get experience building your own system, so if you have problems later on ANY build you will have a better idea on how to fix the problems.
* Your upgrade paths are usually much bigger. You can upgrade your BIOS usually more often and you usually have OC'ing options in the BIOS that Dell/HP won't allow to happen!
* You still have hardware support on your parts. You just have different ones to deal with.

Self build cons:
* You have to troubleshoot your problems, which isn't a bad thing. You usually end up learning something and also usually don't get the shaft if your part is out of warranty.
* There is more work to build the system than if you had one built for you, so to some people that is a con. For me, I'd rather put in the time and effort and know what I'm dealing with.
* Sometimes your similiar build is less than/equal too/or even a bit more than a pre-built system from Dell/HP/etc.

Pre-built pros:
* Easy to setup, since it's already to go for you.
* You don't have to worry about what you need to order, just what options that you want to pay for.
* The prices can be cheaper than a Self-built system.

Pre-built cons:
* You have NO control over the BIOS!!! This means no OC'ing, no voltage regulation, etc.
* Your stuck with whatever support they offer whether it's good or bad or out of this country (good or bad).
* Your upgrade options are going to be expensive if you buy from said vendor.
* You don't know your system that well, since you didn't put it together.
* You don't know how to troubleshoot your problems, your usually stuck waiting on the phone for someone to go through a list and tell you that it's this or that problem.

I don't know which way your considering going, but you have several options that have been laid out by quite a few people. I know that there has been alot of effort from several people to help you out, so your going to need to make a decision on what you want to do. There are certain situations where buying a pre-built system makes sense, but I think your not in that situation. Just let us know what you want to do and which way your going so we can put this thing to rest.

psycho sykes · Sep 16, 2009

As lunyone said these are SOME of the cons add to them:
You can't control the motherboard brand (not only the BIOS it may be any brand there)
You can't control the brands of: - HDD - CD/DVD D - Case (only crappy cheap DELL [want good need expensive!] ) - RAM

In short you can only control the numbers, nothing else and I'm definitely not on that side!!

About my build I don't know how it got to $1000+! It's supposed to be $888 after MIRs and without combos ($853 with) and it contain EVERYTHING, So please explain me maybe we'll be able to make something "more" suitable without breaking the bank.

Medo

highkftj · Sep 16, 2009

Guys,

I want to really thank you for your help. I know you all put a LOT of effort in helping me out and probably to make me learn something valuable for my future. I really would like to build my system according to my needs

I am pondering right now the final decision. I am really temped for a dell 9000 which has a better mobo and a system more similar to a professional one similar to the ones you propose me, but Dell has such crappy videocard (and you cannot even waive this option)

Anyway I will get back to you today. For the videocard, in case in which I select Dell, do you think it's better radeon 4350 or geforce gt220??

Thanks!

psycho sykes · Sep 16, 2009

Both are crappy!!
DELL doesn't have a better main-board! Just a better CPU.

highkftj · Sep 16, 2009

psycho sykes :

ok but in case you have to select the less bad, which one???
Remember I am mainly focused on HDTV than games, and radeon should handle it better for the native hdmi with audio
geforce has 1 gig but 50 bucks more. I may just get this pc with radeon and in 6 months replace with a 4850 which will be really cheap then

psycho sykes · Sep 16, 2009

The GT220 is much better
- 128Bit vs 64Bit
- GDDR3 (both)
- DX10.1/SM4.0 (both)
- More shader.

Summery: If you can upgrade in a month time you should be able to pick up a $199.99 (at release) HD5770 which should come down like 2 weeks after release (Oct. 15th, 2009~)

highkftj · Sep 17, 2009

End of the story, I bought a Dell xps 9000.
Reasons why I decided this way:

- the system is powerful (besides the video card which I will replace in few months)
- It's a full HD system which fits the need of my home entertainment
- I personally like and trust Dell from previous experiences, also I love this PC!

the technical reasons which drove me here were:

- i7
- 6 gigs three channels
- 1T hd with Raid 0 (very important for me)
- radeon system 4350: although it's not the best for gaming, it's for sure very good as a media center and connection with a hdtv. I will replace with a more powerful video card in few months. Just to let you guys know, I play car simulator of 2k like ColinMcrae2 and GP2000, so this system will totally handle that. I don't like gaming or overclocking a pc. I hate when the temperature goes up and my fan starts spinning like crazy... I need just a car simulator to practice when I am out of the real tracks.
- has a blu ray and a 23'' monitor
- w7license

most importantly the total price was 1800$ but I used the last offer of these days and I saved 500bucks. the budget is not everything, I can stretch it if I believe I am doing a good deal

Also, if I don't like it I will just send it back. Easy huh??

configuration in detail:

Catalog Number: 29 DXDNPW2
Module Description
Studio XPS 9000 Studio XPS 9000
Operating System Genuine Windows Vista® Home Premium Edition SP1, 64-Bit
Processors Intel® Core™ i7-920 processor(8MB L3 Cache, 2.66GHz)
Memory 6GB Tri-Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1066MHz - 6 DIMMs
Keyboard Logitech Cordless Desktop S 510 Keyboard and Mouse - Arctic Silver
Monitor Dell 23 inch S2309W Widescreen Flat Panel
Video Card ATI Radeon HD 4350 512MB
Hard Drives 1TB Performance RAID 0 (2x500GB SATA 7200 RPM HDDs)
Mouse Mouse included in Wireless, Laser or Bluetooth Package
Modem No Modem Option
Adobe Software Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0 Multi-Language
Optical Drives Single Drive: Blu-ray Disc (BD) Combo (Reads BD and Writes to DVD/CD)
Sound Card Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio
Speaker No speakers (Speakers are required to hear audio from your system)
Network Integrated 10/1000 Ethernet
Office Productivity Software (Pre-Installed) No Productivity software pre-installed
Security Software Norton Internet Security™ 2009 Edition 15-months
Hardware Support Services 2Yr Ltd Hardware Warranty, InHome Service after Remote Diagnosis
Datasafe Dell Online Backup 2GB for 1 year
LABELS Windows Vista™ Premium
Dell Remote Access Dell Remote Access, free basic service
Sub total:$1,228.00
Additional Discounts and Coupons
Free ground shipping on all systems, electronics and accessories !
Expires Thursday, September 17, 2009
Sub Total $1,228.00
Shipping & Handling $39.00
Shipping Discount -$39.00
Tax $76.76
State Environmental Fee --
Total $1,304.76

I would like to tank psyco, build and luidlm (sorry for the spell) for your efforts and good advices. I would like to let you know that your effortss weren't vanish because it's thanks to your considerations which I enforced my conviction that this is the right pc for what I need.

I am glad I found you guys in this forum and although I came up with a different combination than the one you advised me, you really made me understand what I wanted.

Thanks again and see you soon in this amazing forum!

System for gaming and HDTV

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