Question System is running, but won't post or make any sound beyond fans running

[McHrodik]

Hello everyone, this is my first post here, and if I'm writing this is because I ran out of options with mi issue.

So, I was having problems bringing back my PC after hibernation. In fact, I had problems even putting it to hibernation. The screen will shut down but fans will keep running. Usually, after a hard reset everything will go back to normal. However, a couple of days ago, the system refused to launch anymore. PC is running, because lights are on and fans are running. However, it won't post. The MB speaker also doesn't make any sound anymore. I swapped EVERYTHING: CPU, GPU, RAM, Power Supply, SDDs and HDDs... and nothing. I tried everything written in this posts, because the authors seemed to had similar problems to my own:

Desktop won't boot after hibernation

I have googled around, but can't seem to find similar issues, so I am going to ask here. Some background information: My desktop is a few years old, but when I built it the components were all brand new and have worked quite well. Motherboard: Asus Z77 Sabertooth CPU: i7-3770k with Corsair...

forums.tomshardware.com

No BIOS, no POST, but Power and Fans are on

Hey guys, been working on this the last two days. I have been working on recovering data from my SSD on a different computer, and since I had the case open to put it back, I decided I'd reapply the thermal paste on my processor/heatsink (CoolerMaster hyper 212+). Once I plugged everything in...

forums.tomshardware.com

Currently, the only explanation I have left is that MB is dead. I have a theory: weeks ago, I bought an audio interface to plug in external speakers. The AU is powered via USB, but the speakers get their power from the wall. Is it possible that, leaving the speakers on during computer's power-off and power-on, the motherboard has been fried?
Thank you very much, here are the specs of my PC:

MB: MSI Bazooka B350M
CPU: AMD Ryzen 3700X
GPU: Asus Stryx GTX 970 OC
RAM: 2x8gb G.Skill Aegis DDR4 3200Mhz CL16
SSD: Patriot M.2 NVMe 512GB
HDD: Western Digital Blue 2TB 7200RPM
PSU: Gigabyte Technology P650B 650W 80+ Bronze

​

 

[Aeacus]

I swapped EVERYTHING: Power Supply,

What PSU you had and what you have now?

Was the Gigabyte P650B earlier and also the current PSU? E.g replaced it but got the same model PSU?

Is it possible that, leaving the speakers on during computer's power-off and power-on, the motherboard has been fried?

Everything is possible but answer my above question prior.

 

[McHrodik]

What PSU you had and what you have now?

Was the Gigabyte P650B earlier and also the current PSU? E.g replaced it but got the same model PSU?


Everything is possible but answer my above question prior.

I had a NOX Urano VX 650W 80+ Bronze: https://www.amazon.es/dp/B076D1WYM9?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

I installed the Gigabyte -new- this morning, just to see if it's a PSU problem. Still the same issue.

 

[Aeacus]

Currently, the only explanation I have left is that MB is dead.

This is true.

So, look at new MoBo.

However, underlying issue was this:

NOX Urano VX 650W

That PSU is terrible quality unit and should never be used, at any circumstances.

This is especially evidenced by:

So, I was having problems bringing back my PC after hibernation. In fact, I had problems even putting it to hibernation. The screen will shut down but fans will keep running. Usually, after a hard reset everything will go back to normal. However, a couple of days ago, the system refused to launch anymore.

Good quality PSU has 0 issues bringing PC back from sleep/hibernation. But since you used the doorstop from NOX, it ended up killing your MoBo.

That being said, besides new MoBo, you're also looking towards new PSU.
And No, your Gigabyte unit isn't good enough either. At best, it's mediocre quality unit. While for PC with dedicated GPU, i won't use anything short of good quality PSU, while great quality PSU is preferred.

Good/great quality PSUs to go for are: Seasonic Focus/PRIME and Corsair RMi/RMx/HX/HXi/AX/AXi.
(All 3 of my PCs are also powered by Seasonic, full specs with pics in my sig.)

For 2nd opinion about PSU quality, check out PSU Tier list,
link: https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...er-list-rev-14-8-final-update-jul-21.3624094/
Your NOX is Tier E.
Your Gigabyte is Tier C.
While what i suggest, would be anything from Tier A.

Life lesson: Do not cheap out on PSU.
Since PSU powers everything, it is the most important component inside the PC.

 

[McHrodik]

This is true.

So, look at new MoBo.

However, underlying issue was this:


That PSU is terrible quality unit and should never be used, at any circumstances.

This is especially evidenced by:

Good quality PSU has 0 issues bringing PC back from sleep/hibernation. But since you used the doorstop from NOX, it ended up killing your MoBo.

That being said, besides new MoBo, you're also looking towards new PSU.
And No, your Gigabyte unit isn't good enough either. At best, it's mediocre quality unit. While for PC with dedicated GPU, i won't use anything short of good quality PSU, while great quality PSU is preferred.

Good/great quality PSUs to go for are: Seasonic Focus/PRIME and Corsair RMi/RMx/HX/HXi/AX/AXi.
(All 3 of my PCs are also powered by Seasonic, full specs with pics in my sig.)

For 2nd opinion about PSU quality, check out PSU Tier list,
link: https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...er-list-rev-14-8-final-update-jul-21.3624094/
Your NOX is Tier E.
Your Gigabyte is Tier C.
While what i suggest, would be anything from Tier A.

Life lesson: Do not cheap out on PSU.
Since PSU powers everything, it is the most important component inside the PC.

Thank you vey much, you are absolutely right. I've already purchased a new MB (MSI B550M PRO-VDH) and I will look onto a new PSU. I was blinded by the 80+ certificate and the fact that the NOX was the 'Amazon Choice'.

Anyway, I now have the proper push to completley overhaul my system... If life give you lemons... I only hope for the HDD and SSD to be fine.

Thanks again

 

[Aeacus]

I was blinded by the 80+ certificate

Few things about 80+ certificate;
* 80+ only tells PSU's efficiency and that's it.
* There are fake 80+ labels out there, especially with cheap/crap quality PSUs. E.g this "90+ Gold" unit, amazon: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09J876ZWR
* PSU's efficiency tells 0 about it's build quality. E.g there are 80+ Titanium efficiency units out there, that are complete crap (Silverstone Strider Titanium 1100W and up).

About PSU's in general;

Anyone can take metal box, throw in some capacitors, mosfets, ycaps, transformers etc and call the result as a "good PSU". That doesn't mean the PSU is actually good. What it takes, is reputable reviewer, e.g our own in-house PSU reviewer: Aris Mpitziopoulos, who has written PSU reviews for Tom's Hardware and who is also founder of Cybenetics (https://www.cybenetics.com/), which puts PSUs through far more in-depth testing than ATX PSU standard specifies.
Or Jon Gerow (aka jonnyguru), who is the de facto guy when it comes to PSUs. jonnyguru has reviewed loads of PSUs in his years and he is currently working at Corsair as director of PSU engineering.
Other reputable PSU reviewers include, but are not limited to, are: Steve Burke (GamersNexus), Hardware Secrets, PC Perspective, [H]ard OCP, AnandTech, KitGuru, Tech Power Up.

So, when it comes to PSU, it must have:
* official specs site
* review by reputable reviewer (preferably several reviews by several reputable reviewers)

Good to haves are:
* cybenetics report
* long warranty
* high efficiency
* good standing in PSU Tier list (https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...er-list-rev-14-8-final-update-jul-21.3624094/)
* good PSU brand reputation
* good PSU OEM (the one who made the PSU)

the fact that the NOX was the 'Amazon Choice'.

Amazon's choice which pushes people to buy that crap, since else-ways, no-one would buy it? If so, then yes.
How else would Amazon get rid of the crap?

Btw, 3rd party sellers can also highlight their crap with "Amazon Choice" tag, so that people would actually buy that junk.

 

[McHrodik]

EDIT: It is doing the same with my old R5 1400. Could it be also fried? I've tried it when my system died with the faulty PSU... -didn't know at the time It was the issue- That, or my new MoBo is also faulty and I'm in an incredible bad-luck run...

Hello again,

I purchased a new MB and GPU and everything, almost a whole new system except for the RAM and CPU. My issue now is that the PC shuts down during boot. I only managed to get into the BIOS for 5 seconds before it turned off itself. I'm afraid I already know the answer but... could it be that the processor was damaged? Because I tried with another one and it booted into the BIOS no problem...

I'm just trying to confirm it, maybe there is still hope for my 3700X

 

[Aeacus]

Because I tried with another one and it booted into the BIOS no problem...

If 2nd compatible CPU works just fine, but original CPU won't, there are 2 causes:
* Not compatible BIOS on MoBo (you need latest beta BIOS when running Ryzen 3000 series CPU on B350 chipset. Ryzen 2000 and 1000 series CPUs work off the bat.).
* CPU is toast.

So, update the BIOS to the latest one by using your R5 1400 and then try your R7 3700X. If R7 3700X still doesn't work, CPU is toast.

 

[McHrodik]

If 2nd compatible CPU works just fine, but original CPU won't, there are 2 causes:
* Not compatible BIOS on MoBo (you need latest beta BIOS when running Ryzen 3000 series CPU on B350 chipset. Ryzen 2000 and 1000 series CPUs work off the bat.).
* CPU is toast.

So, update the BIOS to the latest one by using your R5 1400 and then try your R7 3700X. If R7 3700X still doesn't work, CPU is toast.

It is happening now also with the 1400...

EDIT: It is doing the same with my old R5 1400. Could it be also fried? I've tried it when my system died with the faulty PSU... -didn't know at the time It was the issue- That, or my new MoBo is also faulty and I'm in an incredible bad-luck run...

 

[Aeacus]

or my new MoBo is also faulty

You did get it working with R5 1400, right?

Start the troubleshooting fresh:

* breadboard the MoBo
* use only 1 RAM stick
* clear CMOS before trying to boot with R5 1400

Also, what MoBo you did got and also which PSU?

 

[McHrodik]

Yes, or I thought so. However, I think that maybe I spoke too soon. With the 1400 it will also reboot itself, just that, instead of doing it within the first ten seconds after powering up the PC -which is what happens with the 3700x-, it will take a couple of minutes. I was even able to get to the bios with the 3700x and the system detected it correctly. But it lasted only a couple of seconds before rebooting itself.

Now I'm using a MSI B550-M PRO-VDH, and I was doing my testing with the Gigabyte P650B. I know that it is a Tier-C PSU, but it's BRAND NEW. However, I'm expecting a better one.

 

[Aeacus]

but it's BRAND NEW.

Doesn't matter.

Crap is crap, regardless if it's month old, year old or day old.
Or do you want to say that your P650B is better than my now 7 years old Seasonic PRIME TX-650?

Also, Gigabyte's PSU track record is poor.

For example:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aACtT_rzToI


And those GP-P750GM and GP-P850GM were also BRAND NEW.

However, I'm expecting a better one.

By that time, you'd be looking towards 3rd MoBo or new CPU.
But it's your money. Maybe, one day, you'll listen the advice. Or perhaps not.

 

[McHrodik]

Or do you want to say that your P650B is better than my now 7 years old Seasonic PRIME TX-650?

Man, I never said that. I only used the Gigabyte for troubleshooting. I know it's a Tier C unit, I was not going to put it in my system, thanks to your advice, for which I am truly very grateful. However, it shouldn't malfunction specially because it wasn't under any heavy load, and there wasn't any king of power surge or anything. Neither was any strange sound or smell coming from the power suppley. Nevertheless, as I said, I'm returning it and I bought a Seasonic B12 650W. I will clear the CMOS and carry more tests with the new PSU in hope that I can salvage the CPU.

Thank you again

 

[Aeacus]

I only used the Gigabyte for troubleshooting. I know it's a Tier C unit, I was not going to put it in my system, thanks to your advice, for which I am truly very grateful. However, it shouldn't malfunction specially because it wasn't under any heavy load, and there wasn't any king of power surge or anything. Neither was any strange sound or smell coming from the power suppley.

While PSU may not be under any meaningful load, cheaper PSUs have other issues, besides blowing up. One such issue is keeping voltages within ATX PSU standard, which are:
+12V DC rail - tolerance ±5% ; +11.40V to +12.60V
+5V DC rail - tolerance ±5% ; +4.75V to +5.25V
+3.3V DC rail - tolerance ±5% ; +3.14V to +3.47V
-12V DC rail - tolerance ±10% ; -10.80V to -13.20V
+5V SB rail - tolerance ±5% ; +4.75V to +5.25V

If PSU isn't able to keep the voltages within spec, it will fry the hardware or damage it, by reducing it's performance. Proper PSU will keep the voltages tight regardless the load, while cheaper ones have issues even when you turn the PSU on.

Do you have concrete evidence that your Gigabyte PSU voltages won't go out of spec while you're testing your system? I don't think so.

thanks to your advice, for which I am truly very grateful.

That, i'm actually doubting now.

I'm returning it and I bought a Seasonic B12 650W.

Okay, now i have to ask:

What is it with you and cheaping out on PSUs? Do you really not care about your PC?
Also, it's clear that you didn't read the part about PSU suggestions in my 2nd reply.

Seasonic B12, despite having Seasonic name on it, is not made by Seasonic itself. Instead it is outsourced to Helly and thus, is only "slightly" better than your Gigabyte unit. Seasonic B12, while being Tier B, is low-priority unit, borderline Tier C.

You have money to buy new MoBo, new GPU, new PC case, new CPU cooling, new case fans, new Gigabyte P650B and new Seasonic B12 but for some reason, you do not have money (or will) to buy proper PSU?

I can not fathom, why would anyone waste $165 for a Gigabyte P650B,
amazon: https://www.amazon.com/80plus-Bronze-Non-Modular-Supply-GP-P650B/dp/B09KCMZ1JQ
While for less money, one can buy far better PSU, e.g Seasonic Focus GX-650 for $137,
amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Seasonic-SSR-650FX-Modular-Warranty-Compact/dp/B073H33X7R

And this is not the only option for better PSU, others are,
pcpp: https://pcpartpicker.com/products/compare/qbK2FT,Wfvqqs,Yp3mP6,WJM48d/

...

Different persons have different standards (some have higher standards while others have lower standards) and it's up to every person to decide how good of a build quality components are safe to use in their PC. But keep in mind that PSU is the most important component inside the PC since it powers everything.

Since i care a lot about all my PCs, i won't put a mediocre quality unit into my PC that fails to meet ATX PSU standards set in place for all OEMs to follow, so that the PSUs are safe to use and doesn't damage other components. In fact, i've gone above and beyond regarding PSUs in my PCs.
Some may call me nuts that i payed €206.80 for a PSU that sits in my Skylake build (Seasonic SSR-650TD) and my latest PSU purchase for Haswell build costed €205.50 (Seasonic SSR-650TR), while i would've been safe with a PSU that costs €80.50 (Seasonic GX-550). While that can be true and i could've saved a lot of money, i feel safe and comfortable that my two main PCs are powered by the best offered by Seasonic. Only for my 3rd PC, old AMD build, i slightly reduced my PSU quality standard and bought a PSU that costed €101.50 (Seasonic PX-550). Still, all 3 of my PSUs are Tier A quality.

I won't suggest expensive PSUs in builds when the budget is way restricted. But i still suggest getting a PSU that at least meets all the ATX PSU standards, even if it's semi-modular (like Seasonic FOCUS-GM-650).

...

And this is where i end it. I gave you ample options regarding solid, good quality PSUs (easy 50+ different models all within Tier A), you do have the money to buy one, yet, you chose not to. I can not help if one doesn't want to be helped.

As long as you keep using mediocre or lower quality PSUs, there is always a high chance that PSU is the issue or it kills something, regardless the load on it or how new it is. Only with great quality PSU, you could rule out issue being PSU, since chances, that the well made, great quality PSU having an issue, are slim to none.

 

[McHrodik]

Okay, now i have to ask:

What is it with you and cheaping out on PSUs? Do you really not care about your PC?
Also, it's clear that you didn't read the part about PSU suggestions in my 2nd reply.

Seasonic B12, despite having Seasonic name on it, is not made by Seasonic itself. Instead it is outsourced to Helly and thus, is only "slightly" better than your Gigabyte unit. Seasonic B12, while being Tier B, is low-priority unit, borderline Tier C.

You have money to buy new MoBo, new GPU, new PC case, new CPU cooling, new case fans, new Gigabyte P650B and new Seasonic B12 but for some reason, you do not have money (or will) to buy proper PSU?

Okay, I'm sorry, I saw the B12 on the Tier B and I thought it was fine. And that doesn't mean that I didn't search for anything else, but here in Spain our options are a little more limited, and also the prices wildly differ from what you have in the US.

I could buy the Seasonic because both the NOX and the Gigabyte were on warranty and, therefore, I had my money back, but not because I have a lot of money, trust me. My mistakes are honest here, I assure you. In fact, before buying the Seasonic (I will now ask Amazon to cancel the shipment) I saw this Cooler Master unit:

Amazon.es

The MWE 650 Gold V2, which I didn't buy because we only have available the modular version and the tier list SPECIFICALLY called for a non-modular version. As you can see, I can't afford anything worth more than a 100€

I will keep searching. And please, do not think that I'm not trusting you. The last thing I want to be with my questions is a waste of your time. I appreciate every comment, that's why I bought the Seasonic. You now make me realize that I made another (honest) mistake.

EDIT: Found an open-box Corsair RM 650x 80 PLUS Gold Black Label for 100 euro. Do you think this will be a good choice?

 

[Aeacus]

but here in Spain our options are a little more limited, and also the prices wildly differ from what you have in the US.

I'm not from the USA either. But since bulk of the people who ask help in TH are from the States and Amazon is also #1 choice where to buy when in the States, i thought you'd be in USA also.
Btw, i also live in Europe (Estonia to be exact).

As you can see, I can't afford anything worth more than a 100€

Seasonic Focus GX-550 at €99.99,
link: https://www.pccomponentes.com/seasonic-focus-gx-550-550w-80-plus-gold-modular

Solid PSU. Unsure why you go with 650W unit. Unless... you have beefy and expensive GPU.

€6 cheaper is Seasonic Core GM-650,
link: https://www.pccomponentes.com/seasonic-core-gm-650-650w-80-plus-gold-semi-modular

Core series is solid Tier B, so, i suggest going with Focus instead (Tier A).

EDIT: Found an open-box Corsair RM 650x 80 PLUS Gold Black Label for 100 euro. Do you think this will be a good choice?

Never buy a used PSU. No matter how good/great it is. Since you have 0 telling what kind of abuse it has seen and if it even operates within ATX PSU standard.

 

[McHrodik]

I'm not from the USA either. But since bulk of the people who ask help in TH are from the States and Amazon is also #1 choice where to buy when in the States, i thought you'd be in USA also.
Btw, i also live in Europe (Estonia to be exact).



Seasonic Focus GX-550 at €99.99,
link: https://www.pccomponentes.com/seasonic-focus-gx-550-550w-80-plus-gold-modular

Solid PSU. Unsure why you go with 650W unit. Unless... you have beefy and expensive GPU.

€6 cheaper is Seasonic Core GM-650,
link: https://www.pccomponentes.com/seasonic-core-gm-650-650w-80-plus-gold-semi-modular

Core series is solid Tier B, so, i suggest going with Focus instead (Tier A).


Never buy a used PSU. No matter how good/great it is. Since you have 0 telling what kind of abuse it has seen and if it even operates within ATX PSU standard.

I have an RX 5700 XT, which I bought second hand last week. I guess I just wanted to have a little bit of headroom with a 650W PSU but, if you think that a 550W will do, I will bought It.

Thank you again, you have been priceless.

 

[Aeacus]

I have an RX 5700 XT

Let's run some numbers:
GPU is 225W (243W peak at gaming), R7 3700X is 65W (90W at max load), add the rest of the system to it at ~100W and total (when considering peaks/max load) would be: ~433W.

550W unit would give ~117W headroom, IF you use your CPU and GPU 100% at once (e.g run CPU and GPU benchmarks, both at the same time). Everyday utilization is less, whereby you could average ~300-350W at most. Also, Seasonic Focus GX-550 is good quality PSU and i wouldn't worry about it not being able to handle the build.

 

[McHrodik]

Let's run some numbers:
GPU is 225W (243W peak at gaming), R7 3700X is 65W (90W at max load), add the rest of the system to it at ~100W and total (when considering peaks/max load) would be: ~433W.

550W unit would give ~117W headroom, IF you use your CPU and GPU 100% at once (e.g run CPU and GPU benchmarks, both at the same time). Everyday utilization is less, whereby you could average ~300-350W at most. Also, Seasonic Focus GX-550 is good quality PSU and i wouldn't worry about it not being able to handle the build.

All right then, I'm going for the Focus GX550. Thank you very much again, I will try it next week when it arrives.

 

[McHrodik]

Hello again, I just received the SeaSonic and already tried it. The problem persists, I mean, the system powers on and I can get into the BIOS but, after a few seconds, It reboots itself. I have the same issue with both of my processors, however, the R5 1400 holds on for a couple of minutes.

Maybe the motherboard is now the issue? I cleared CMOS and everything...

 

[Aeacus]

Did you breadboard your MoBo?

Also, possible culprits are 4 (if you'd have Intel build, there would be 3). These 4 are: CPU, RAM, MoBo and GPU.
(Most Intel CPUs have iGPU, where you can easily rule out GPU issue).

Only way to tell which of the 4 is culprit (some of them or all of them), you need 2nd, compatible system, where to test out each and every component. This way, you can see what works and what doesn't.

I have an RX 5700 XT, which I bought second hand last week.

Buying used hardware has only 1 good thing: cheap price. On all other aspects, brand new hardware is better.

For example:
IF your GPU is toast (which it could be, since you bought it used and powered it with questionable PSU(s), if it ever worked), you have 0 warranty with it. Meaning, that you will have to suck up it's cost and buy new GPU. Preferably brand new this time, which does come with a warranty.

Overall with PC hardware;
NEVER buy used PSU.
It's bad idea to buy used GPU. Cryptomining craze is over and 2nd hand market is flooded with used mining GPUs, that are on their last leg (if not outright dead).
Buying used RAM and CPU is fine, since they have great durability. Same goes with PC cases and case fans.
Buying used MoBo is iffy. You could get working board or you could get a dead one.
Also, avoid used disk drives (SSD/HDD) since there's no telling what kind of malware lives on them and how much wear is on them.

 

[McHrodik]

It was the MoBo. I got a new one today (Gigabyte Aorus B550 Elite) and immediately tested it. It runs like a charm again.

Knowing now that the most expensive component in my system (the R7 3700x) is fine, I'm now more relaxed. I will test now the original boot drive, but I don't have much hope for it to be running again.

Thank you very much, Aeacus

EDIT: The boot drive works!!! I can't honestly believe how lucky I got.