TEC build log start

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toolmaker_03

toolmaker_03

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Mar 26, 2012
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http://imgur.com/cd15M1a
ok so I have finished all my testing and decided on a general build for this unit.
this build will be sealed inside of a chest so I will not have physical access to the computer case, I would like some input on the general idea that I am presenting, I use antifreeze so freezing the coolant is not a issue, and seeing as I am increasing the cooling capacity of my water cooling system, I have also chosen new clocks for my hardware, the CPU clock will run at 5Ghz, and the GPU's will be running at 930Mhz, I have already tested theses clocks and found them to be stable for my hardware.
 
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Congrats man, you are a perfect example of an enthusiast, you do what you do because you want to, not because you have to. Any chance you can post a pic of the inside of the chest? It must be jam packed. Could you please explain what you just said about fans please? Fans on the res? Sorry, but I don't understand what you mean. Anyway, nice progress and looks awesome.

P.S. what is the simbol for the laughing face? I can't find it.
 
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(lol) but replace the () with ::

yea I have some pics of the inside of the chest with some reservoirs kind of dropped in there, but they are not piped yet, and yes I got creative and attached my fans to my reservoirs.
I have fans in there because well I think it helps to move the coldness around.

about the coldness inside the case, every time I turn my vacuum pump on for that 3 min, the case temps go up and reach around 25C, so not only does it keep the inside of the chest dry, but it sucks the cold out of the case. :lol:
it takes about 20 min for the temps inside the chest to drop back to 15C after I turn the vacuum pump off.
 
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I should not need any insolation on the inside of the chest.
all of the clay is on the outside of the chest, it is on the tubing between the chest and the TEC assembly, and all over the cold side CPU's, the fittings connecting them, and the tubing to the pumps. at this point, the only thing on the cold side, that is on the out side of the chest not covered in clay, is the reservoir.(that may change).
 
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7 Water Blocks, 6 Radiators, 5 Power Supplies, 4 Reservoirs, 3 Water Pumps, 2 GPU Water Blocks, 1 Vacuum Pump, and a Partridge in a Pear Treeeeeeeee! :)

Ooops, after the last sketch that is 5 reservoirs, Cha Ching, Cha Ching, Cha Ching, the sound of the cash register singing Thank You very much!

Did you win the lottery?

Minimum: $900 in water blocks, $800 in power supplies, $700 in radiators, $400 in peltiers, $300 in reservoirs, plus many other overlooked and not listed items, comes to around a minimum spent of $3,300 ~ $3,500 of cooling hardware, you could duplicate my entire cooling setup for less than a $1,000.

It has supported a 5ghz overclock rock solid since it was put into service and in 8 days will be operational for 3 full years.

Also it is fully capable of sub zero temperatures, I do not allow it to go that low because that was not it's purpose or goal, it's goal is Below Ambient Cooling not Sub Zero Cooling, but it absolutely has the capability of going well below zero.

I did not take it down to sub zero levels, because I did not want to have to insulate the motherboard from moisture, and suffer the consequences of what will happen when the machine is shut down and all the built up ice melts.

I seriously doubt your vacuum idea is going to completely eliminate ice, because there is still air in a vacuum, not enough you can breath, but none the less, still there.

But what happens when the vacuum is released, because you will have to access the PC, and all that moist outside air rushes back into the cabinet, it is far away from a set it and forget it idea, which by the way mine is.

You have a lot to learn the hard way!

I was hoping one day someone would undertake another similar TEC cooling project here at Toms, but your build proposal is going way too far, spending way too much money, and possibly scaring away those that could actually benefit from TEC cooling for the higher overclock range.

For that reason, and for any readers of this thread, here's my link to my build, which I always thought was extreme overkill but compared to your proposal is much more reasonable.

Plus mine is not a dream, it is fully operational! :)

Good Luck!
 
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Hey ryan, was wondering when you would show up :)
I agree that it is a flippin' LOT of cash, but not really as much as you said, at least I don't think so. He already had some water cooling stuff, the biggest psu, and some other stuff. And 400$ in peltiers? Is that a typo or something, because the peltiers I am planning to get for my own setup (the one that is at least a year away) are only like 10$ each :lol:
I think it is just like taking what you started and adding some of his own. And it's his cash really, so if he really wants to do this, then that's his choice. I am in no way trying to offend you, I completely agree with you (apart from maybe that 400$ price tag for peltiers, shees that seems steep). Yeah, no way I will ever even contemplate something like this, but still, some people have more than that tied up in gpus alone. Besides, this build log and the idea behind it are awesome.
 
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not a dream ryan I told you years ago that I was building up to this and you should know by now that I like to do things a little extreme.

now about that idea about ice forming on the components, you bring up a valid point I should place a humidity gage in the case and show how to dry the chamber for first time use. I do have a little camera that I will use to take snap shots, of the inside of the chest while it is running.

I did not use a humidity gage for my test build I used time to dry my chamber before I started to run the cold water into the vacuum chamber. this is how I did it I sealed the chamber and turned the pump on for 3 hours the first time than 3 min a day every day there after for two weeks. when I did start running the cold water into the chamber I never got any condensation or freezing on the blocks or tubes.
but with a humidity gage I could show the drop in humidity each time I vacuumed the chamber out until the humidity is all gone.
the water vapor present in the air will not return to the vacuum chamber after it is dried, unless I open the chest.
I hope this clears up any misunderstandings about the system and please ask questions this is meant to be a full system solution for me, I want to clock my hardware further without getting the hardware hotter than it is now.

I do not recommend this kind of build for anyone, as it is time consuming, lots of tools are needed, and expensive, but if your hobby is water cooling, and looking to take that hobby to the next level in performance, I would say this is it, TEC's are lots of fun to play with and provide hours of tinker time.

I do not intend on asking anyone to build this.
 
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now for set it and forget it operation, there are two upgrades I intend on placing on this system after it is fully operational, to make it trouble free operation first I will use a simple wall timer to activate the vacuum pump for the 3 min that it needs to run each day
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-Plug-In-Extreme-Weather-Outdoor-Mechanical-Timer-49813/203687958
second I will use a micro controller to control the activation and deactivation of the TEC's based on the temps of the components.
http://www.amazon.com/Arduino-Ultimate-Starter-page-Instruction/dp/B00BT0NDB8/ref=sr_1_3?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1450796329&sr=1-3&keywords=arduino+starter+kit
right now I have manual switches for this.
http://www.amazon.com/HOT-SYSTEM-ON-OFF-Rocker-Motorcycle/dp/B00RZ4YTCO/ref=pd_sim_422_77?ie=UTF8&dpID=41lxh3PWcVL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160%2C160_&refRID=0K8CVQ4CDHX7CG8BXMWN
 
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as far as cost,

well lets review some of my builds
https://imageshack.com/i/120plbJ
https://imageshack.com/i/f7ervgj
https://imageshack.com/i/ipfs287aj
https://imageshack.com/i/ezPiu5JIj
water cooling and other upgrades for it around $4500

https://imageshack.com/i/0mghscj
https://imageshack.com/i/j5kch7j
water cooling and upgrades for it around $5500

this build water cooling, TEC's and other upgrades for it around $6500

so no its not cheap to do at all. :lol:

none of them have been cheap.

to give a idea of how close I am to completion, I still need two power supplies, I am using the powermax 12V 45A power supply units, one for each TEC, I have one now, I still need 2 X 360mm radiators, I have 4 now, and I still need some fittings for the water loops, I have most of them already
 
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Wow dude. That is a LOT of tech porn. Do you recycle (use parts in other builds, not throw away :lol:)your old builds or just sell them on?
Is there a face with dolar simbols for eyes, because that's what it makes me feel like to see stuff like that.
(Bear in mind I'm still a kid with no job, so income = housework = 3€ a week, if I'm lucky)
Big price tags, but so worth it :)
 
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I try to reuse as much as I can from build to build, but after 20 years of doing this as a hobby, I have a lot of parts that I will never use again, so they sit in a box.
or if damaged, I throw them away.
I have sold a radiator and fans for it once, but that's it.

 
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First off, Price out 410w capable peltiers yourself, that is not a typo.

That information came from the top of his first picture of his proposal sketch.

http://imgur.com/cd15M1a

It's his money, he can, and will do what he wants with it!

I'll advise if asked.

I found 400w capable at 24.8 volts DC for around 57 Dollars US plus Shipping , but that would only be 200w at 12v DC? so I'll concede that for 3 is an over estimate at $400, maybe $200 don't forget shipping charges, any other challenges?

 
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You are definitely in my territory now, I've learned a lot the hard way, if you need or want any advice just ask. Ry

 
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Sorry, I wasn't trying to offend you or belittle you. I was just a bit confused. It's all cleared up now, thanks.

--update--
Looked it up. Where did you buy your 410W peltiers, can't find prices for them anywhere. Nearest I could find was a 350W (yes, I know toolmaker is using 410W modules, but as I said, I can't find a price for them. Note: I'm not in the US, I reside in Italy. The peltier I saw was 35.99 when converted into U.S. dollars, not including IVA). Yeah, 200$ sounds about right. Again, I was not challenging you or trying to offend you, I just didn't understand how they could be so expensive when a 100W peltier is less than 20$, everything included. Sorry if you took it the wrong way. It was just a misunderstanding, and I apologise if I came off as a know-it-all, it wouldn't be the first time 🙁
 
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You don't have to apologize, I used you to make a point!

:) Actually I could not find any 410w 12v DC peltiers online anywhere, maybe tm_03 will be kind enough to link to where he got or is getting those peltiers along with their specs?

It is nice to see you actually did look yourself, from my own experience any peltiers that powerful run off of 24v DC, cutting that supply voltage in half also cuts the wattage in half as well?

 
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yes, I would like to present this build when finished in way that makes since.
the only thing that I am really presenting here is the vacuum chamber, as a way of preventing ice from forming on the blocks.
I will have a little camera in the chamber and I will add a humidity gage to the bottom of the case so that one can see how low the humidity levels really do stay.
is there anything else that I should be showing or considering?
 
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Thanks TM_03 I bookmarked those peltiers.

They are the same dimensional size I use with my water blocks, 50mm x 50mm but they are more powerful, mine are somewhere around 260w, I just may upgrade to those bad boys, since I already have the power to push them.
 
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cool, I am using the powermax PS there are designed for small travel trailers or pop ups. but supply good constant amps at 13.7V. they say 12V but this is the reality, the nicer models can have the voltage adjusted a little from as low as 10V to as high as 16V, I have one of the 75A models and played around with it, but I found that the TEC's run real nice at the 12V to 14V range so the cheaper PS models work fine for this.

Max mine had a 65C drop in water temps, from the water temp on the hot side with nothing running on the loop, the hot side water temps are at 30C so the cold side water temps got down to -35C.
at the 13V, 19A, it still has a 55C drop in water temps on the cold side, from the water temp on the hot side, so the cold side still got to -25C.

with the CPU running at 5Ghz, the hot side water temps are at 40C, but the cold side water temps where at 0C, with the CPU holding at load 38C. If I had my standard water cooling rig, I could only get to my CPU up to 4.8Ghz and my CPU would be at load 70C.

the heat added to the loop on the cold side alters the loop dynamics drastically, it will be interesting to see how the added GPU heat load will affect the loop, and if I have properly figured the amount of TEC power I will need to over come them.

I think that if I had more reservoir in my test loop the loop might have had more stable water temps on the cold side.
what do you think?

that is why I am looking at 4 X 250mm reservoirs, but that is a chunk of change.
I will go to home depot and look at building a couple of reservoirs like the one you built, to fit in side of the cheat.
 
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My experimentation with coolant volume ended choosing about 1/2 of a gallon or almost 2 liters, that's why I used 4" PVC Schedule 40 pipe and made my own reservoir, so I could make it the best functional size.

That's in my Chilled Water Thread, with pictures.
 
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yes, I saw that you where able to keep much more stable temps on your cold side loop with that large reservoir, than I was with two 250mm tube reservoirs, I do not have a lot of room left in the chest, but I will try to get as much reservoir space in there as I can, the space I have left is a 13" X 15" area, giving enough space for tubing, and 6" thick, I know I could fit two of the style you built, a little shorter then the one you built, but I am also going to see if three is possible.
I do think that a good size cold bank of water is the key to the system running well.
 
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http://imgur.com/a/wUMXv
ok so what is happening here?
I am cutting 3" off the length of the PC case all the way around then I will reattach the front of the case 3" closer to the video card.
this will give me the room I need to have all of the wires from the I/O panel, video cards, motherboard, and the tubing, all going through only one hole in the chest.
it will be to tight on the I/O panel wires and the video card connectors if I do not shorten the case.
there is no PS going in the PC case so all of the wires and tubing will be going out of the case where the PS should be.
well I will have pics up soon.

on a side note this is how I messed up the last case, so I will be more careful this time.
 
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ok so the new case dimensions after the modifications are 14 3/8" high X 11 5/8" wide X 6 1/2" thick(deep)

it is just a little larger than the motherboard a DX79SR and a little thicker than the video card a GTX580 with the water block.
 
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