"I think spud was referring to intergrated mainboards, the low-end type sh!t"
Like ALL Intel integrated boards?
Aklein
It's raining outside, and my lawn has grown a foot overnight!
Like ALL Intel integrated boards?
Aklein
It's raining outside, and my lawn has grown a foot overnight!
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Calm Down! Ok, now to begin with, most of us have seen shared memory integrated video before. Usually you can set the amount of dedicated memory in BIOS. The advantage nVidia gets in their integrated video is that it also has a 128-bit memory pathway. This means that as long as you use TWO dimms, you get 128-bit SYSTEM ram, which is a godsend in itself! But you also get 128-bit DDR VIDEO RAM at the same time, which is better than the Geforce 2 MX has ever had before. So the increased memory bandwidth for video should make it outperform any previous MX card! BUT you also get a 128-BIT DEDICATED VIDEO PIPELINE, which is FAR superior to what the AGP slot provides. If everything works as it's supposed to, we are probably looking at an integrated MX that can outperfrom the GTS! BUT it still lacks the major advantage of the X-Box, from which this chipset was derived-it has MX architecture instead of GF3. Let's wait for the reviews on this one-it might just be the best thing since sliced bread! OH, and nVidia likes to release new products quickly, so I expect we might see a new version of this chipset with an even better graphics core in 6 months!
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
AmdMELTDOWN
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yeah, and like all intergrated duron and athlon boards ;-)
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
somerandomguy
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Speaking theoretically, could the crossbar memory technology from the GeForce 3 be included in a future nVidia chipset?
"Ignorance is bliss, but I tend to get screwed over."
"Ignorance is bliss, but I tend to get screwed over."
Kelledin
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Perhaps you should drop into threaded mode and see exactly what post Spud was <A HREF="http://forumz.tomshardware.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=faq¬found=1&code=1" target="_new">replying to</A>. It's the simplest thing to do (it's a button on the upper right of the forum toolbar), and it may help keep you from looking like a fool next time. Just a thought...
Kelledin
"/join #hackerz. See the Web. DoS interesting people."
calm down? wtf?
anyway, it might just be the best thing since sliced bread. My point is of what we KNOW of it, there is no reason to have a cow and praise nVidia or preorder one.
we know very little about this board or chipset that can be verified.
sit back, have a beer, and wait.
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Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
anyway, it might just be the best thing since sliced bread. My point is of what we KNOW of it, there is no reason to have a cow and praise nVidia or preorder one.
we know very little about this board or chipset that can be verified.
sit back, have a beer, and wait.
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Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
I believe MX cards have 128 bit memory, unless they are DDR then they are 64 bit, making the SDRAM versions slightly faster. Furthermore the MX can use RAM at over 180 Mhz.
RAM for the graphics is probably piped, so how wide and fast is the pipe? This is probably better graphics than offered by the competition, but probably worse than what you get from a good addon. Like a real Geforce or Kyro.
Unless onboard graphics are virtually free, I would rather not have it!
Same goes for onboard Audio. A high quality Audioboard is good for years, and can survive several mobo changes! Onboard Audio is terrible!
Onboard Audio and Graphics is just to make it possible for vendors to make the cheapest possible system. It doesn't matter that audio has terrible output quality and CPU load, and that graphics sucs, because of noise on the video signal. Load on the RAM bandwidth, Eating your free RAM.
Both are useless and are doing no good when you finally realise this and upgrade.
Onboard this and that is okay for cheap office machines, but for enthusiasts its useless, and cost you extra money in the end.
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Engage!
RAM for the graphics is probably piped, so how wide and fast is the pipe? This is probably better graphics than offered by the competition, but probably worse than what you get from a good addon. Like a real Geforce or Kyro.
Unless onboard graphics are virtually free, I would rather not have it!
Same goes for onboard Audio. A high quality Audioboard is good for years, and can survive several mobo changes! Onboard Audio is terrible!
Onboard Audio and Graphics is just to make it possible for vendors to make the cheapest possible system. It doesn't matter that audio has terrible output quality and CPU load, and that graphics sucs, because of noise on the video signal. Load on the RAM bandwidth, Eating your free RAM.
Both are useless and are doing no good when you finally realise this and upgrade.
Onboard this and that is okay for cheap office machines, but for enthusiasts its useless, and cost you extra money in the end.
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Engage!
there's another area of question.
128 pathway on my MX, 32 megs 166mhz ram.
ok, 128 bit pathway to lower latency 100 or 133mhz DDR ram.
if I remember correctly, the Geforce 2 MX has something like 2.7 GBps bandwidth, that's not bad.
not enough either.
also, ladies and gents, remember, this is suppose to be the same( I think) sound chip as the Xbox uses, I doubt its a low quality integrated system, I just have my doubts its the <b><i>SAVIOR OF AMD</i></b>
lets see how it does against the new bad boy on the block.
I'm waiting on several articles pertaining to Sis 735 vs Nforce. 12 rounds of kick ass, knock down, drag out fighting.
although, if all goes well, I'll let you know how the Micro ATX version of Nforce works out. Little bro needs a system upgrade...
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Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
128 pathway on my MX, 32 megs 166mhz ram.
ok, 128 bit pathway to lower latency 100 or 133mhz DDR ram.
if I remember correctly, the Geforce 2 MX has something like 2.7 GBps bandwidth, that's not bad.
not enough either.
also, ladies and gents, remember, this is suppose to be the same( I think) sound chip as the Xbox uses, I doubt its a low quality integrated system, I just have my doubts its the <b><i>SAVIOR OF AMD</i></b>
lets see how it does against the new bad boy on the block.
I'm waiting on several articles pertaining to Sis 735 vs Nforce. 12 rounds of kick ass, knock down, drag out fighting.
although, if all goes well, I'll let you know how the Micro ATX version of Nforce works out. Little bro needs a system upgrade...
----------------------
Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
AmdMELTDOWN
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hey numbskull, integrated anything = low cost, low cost = low-end sh!t!
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
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NOT necessarily. When Aureal folded, nVidia recruited a bunch of their engineers to work on the audio end of this (and the X-box) chipset. Now most of us know that Aureal carried a far superior product to anything Creative produced (driver problems aside-they went bankrupt before they could revise them). So IF the engineers did an equally good job on this integrated audio, you get the convenience of NOT using a PCI slot, plus the quality of a good sound system.
As far as integrated video, their are many design advantages available to it. The only reasons it has performed so poorly in the past are that 1) former designers restricted themselves to the standard AGP architecture instead of taking advantage of the greater bandwidth available 2) the graphics core they used has always been low-end, and 3) Memory bandwidth using standard SDR arhcitecture. nVidia has sought solutions by 1) providing a wider path to the graphics engine than AGP normally provides 2) using a higher quality graphics core and 3) offering double bandwidth (as long as you use two DIMMs) using double data rate modules. These advantages can make the integrated solution perform MUCH better than the MX-AGP on which they were based. So we can only hope they did an excellent job of execution, and anxiously await the first reviews.
One more thing-I think they should have gone with a ZIF socket for the chipset so you would have the choice of upgrading the integrated video simply by replacing the northbridge, instead of the whole damned board.
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
As far as integrated video, their are many design advantages available to it. The only reasons it has performed so poorly in the past are that 1) former designers restricted themselves to the standard AGP architecture instead of taking advantage of the greater bandwidth available 2) the graphics core they used has always been low-end, and 3) Memory bandwidth using standard SDR arhcitecture. nVidia has sought solutions by 1) providing a wider path to the graphics engine than AGP normally provides 2) using a higher quality graphics core and 3) offering double bandwidth (as long as you use two DIMMs) using double data rate modules. These advantages can make the integrated solution perform MUCH better than the MX-AGP on which they were based. So we can only hope they did an excellent job of execution, and anxiously await the first reviews.
One more thing-I think they should have gone with a ZIF socket for the chipset so you would have the choice of upgrading the integrated video simply by replacing the northbridge, instead of the whole damned board.
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
AmdMELTDOWN
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lol Chicken-Wuss is that your real name? go read what I posted in the mobo section.
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
AmdMELTDOWN
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hey Chicken-wussy stfu already it's pass your bedtime.
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
"AMD/VIA...you <i>still</i> are the weakest link, good bye!"
Kelledin
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Well, if you want to pay more for a processor that does less (and puts out about the same amount of heat), that's your business. *shrug*
Plus, you still missed the point. By Spud's logic, a lot of the nice CPU features you Intel junkies keep harping on suck. But he said it, not me!
Oh, and I'll point out that some of Intel's top-of-the-line ATX boards (like the L440GX) have "integrated everything"--video, LAN, SCSI, everything. Wow, I guess that's just "low-end sh!t" too! Man, Intel makes such low-end sh!t! Thanks for letting us know!
Kelledin
"/join #hackerz. See the Web. DoS interesting people."
Plus, you still missed the point. By Spud's logic, a lot of the nice CPU features you Intel junkies keep harping on suck. But he said it, not me!
Oh, and I'll point out that some of Intel's top-of-the-line ATX boards (like the L440GX) have "integrated everything"--video, LAN, SCSI, everything. Wow, I guess that's just "low-end sh!t" too! Man, Intel makes such low-end sh!t! Thanks for letting us know!
Kelledin
"/join #hackerz. See the Web. DoS interesting people."
It would appear these folks just don't seem to get it. Sure, you will be able to get better video graphics out of a Add-on AGP card...thats just not the point! This is going to make AMD systems very very attractive to OEM's ( ie. gateway, compaq, Dell maybe?) The fact is this will rock the socks of of any other onboard graphics solution and totally anihilate the likes of the onboard graphics of the I815. As for the audio, not everybody needs all the bells and whistles of the soundblaster live series and this will suit them just fine. I wonder if you will be able to install a AGP card and still use the onboard for dual monitor's? Now that would be cool! Look folks, this is the first of more to come from Nvidia....more will surely follow? Why did they first release an integrated board? Well, quite honestly because this is what AMD needs more than anything else to sell more chips! Think about it! Even with the the onboard graphics and audio, we get the expertise of nvidia, who has a driver team second to none, more expereirance with DDR memory controllers than anyone bar none, and perhaps, if rumours are true, the first chipset with the crossbar memory controller! ( btw crash, you seem to be the only one here that can grasp this)
A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!
A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing!
I hope your just being facetious.
otherwise, you are truly dumber than I thought you were.
Even counting the 810 as a low end POS, and the 820 utter frugg up, Intel has a better stabilty and performance record than ANY other chipset company.
the 440 BX has yet to be beaten by ANY chipset running the same speed, the 815 is better in the respect it can clock higher, other than that, there is no Intel processor compatible chipset to dethrone it.
If AMD could run on Intel chipsets, honestly, the world would be a better place... cure for cancer, emissions, etc... lol
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Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
otherwise, you are truly dumber than I thought you were.
Even counting the 810 as a low end POS, and the 820 utter frugg up, Intel has a better stabilty and performance record than ANY other chipset company.
the 440 BX has yet to be beaten by ANY chipset running the same speed, the 815 is better in the respect it can clock higher, other than that, there is no Intel processor compatible chipset to dethrone it.
If AMD could run on Intel chipsets, honestly, the world would be a better place... cure for cancer, emissions, etc... lol
----------------------
Independant thought is good.
It won't hurt for long.
HEEEYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!
that was a great post coming from you!!!!!!!
Join the power(AMD) and the stabilty(Intel), then you get the comp of the GOD!!!!!!
Hey then the flame war would be over, but wait a sec... wath do we do with all those proud fighter????? ;o)
that was a great post coming from you!!!!!!!
Join the power(AMD) and the stabilty(Intel), then you get the comp of the GOD!!!!!!
Hey then the flame war would be over, but wait a sec... wath do we do with all those proud fighter????? ;o)
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If the Athlon would have fit a BX board I would have built an AMD system. As it was, when I finally got completely fed up with the problems I had with my AMD/VIA system, I built a system with, what was at the time, the new kid on the block-an Asus CUSL2. Now my wife has that board, and I'm using a BX, simply because she needed a desktop case, and I wanted a tower. The BlasterPC I bought as a second system has all the extra Platinum features built into the case, and becuase she couldn't use it, I am. It simply wouldn't fit into the entertainment center where she has hers.
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
Cast not thine pearls before the swine
Wow all i meant was intergrated boards suck. Man oh man what has this forum become? Geeze.
SPUDMUFFIN
<font color=red>Being Evil Is Good. Cause I Can Be A Prick And Get Away With It.</font color=red> :lol:
SPUDMUFFIN
<font color=red>Being Evil Is Good. Cause I Can Be A Prick And Get Away With It.</font color=red> :lol:
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