News The Commodore 64 Ultimate computer is the company's first hardware release in over 30 years — pre-orders start at $299

[GideonZ]

What is the use case of having 2,000 times more RAM than the original? I imagine some interesting things could be done with that, if you allow applications to use more than original limits, or have "save states" for the operating system where you can swap another program in quickly wherever it was running.

16 MB of that RAM is allocated for the original Commodore RAM Expansion Unit (REU); 16 MB can be used as an alternative RAM expansion (GeoRAM). Other blocks of memory are used for stuff like cartridge ROMs. Those are like hardware buffers. Then there is software running to manage the machine, to be able to access the network, USB sticks and have bitmap buffers for the emulation of matrix printers. 16 MB is allocated as RAM disk for downloading temporary files from the internet. Adding all up, you'll get to approx. 64 MB, so there is some room for future needs.

 

[ManDaddio]

I doubt that very much, if commodore kept existing there would be no need for this product, they would bring out a c64 mini just like nintendo did (and just like whoever made the thec64)

Commodore would sell their old games on a digital store front of their current console/computer, again just like nintendo.

And also just like nintendo they would just take a generic or maybe slightly custom arm cpu and make cheap consoles that people can afford.

(All this assuming that they would not have become a PC only brand, since the home computer of the 80-90 became the PC later on, but in that case they would not have lasted)

Nintendo was/is a console company. Commodore was a computer. Not exactly the same things. Therefore I don't think the goals would be similar.

 

[TerryLaze]

Well, that's the beauty of FPGAs. They allow you to create your own digital logic circuits. So for people that have a bit of skill in this area (e.g. me ;-), a 6510 can be part of this digital design. In fact, I placed three of them in this implementation; one for the C64 part, and two for the floppy drives, as the original 1541, 1571 and 1581 had their own CPUs. It differs from a software emulation in that it is not 'executed' by another CPU, but it truly behaves like a 6510 due to the logic gates.

Since we have the horses mouth here...
Do you guys, fpga devs in general, have access to the actual blueprints of these old CPUs? And if so up to what level, as I understand it if the original blueprint doesn't exist or if it includes something that's not possible with FPGA then you have to best-guess it.

 

[TerryLaze]

Nintendo was/is a console company. Commodore was a computer. Not exactly the same things. Therefore I don't think the goals would be similar.

Not for a lack of trying....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_64_Games_System
Commodore would try really really hard to get into the console market, they would probably have failed but they would have tried.

 

[GideonZ]

Since we have the horses mouth here...
Do you guys, fpga devs in general, have access to the actual blueprints of these old CPUs? And if so up to what level, as I understand it if the original blueprint doesn't exist or if it includes something that's not possible with FPGA then you have to best-guess it.

Fortunately, because of the popularity, nearly every expected and unexpected behavior of the chip has been documented. This was a great basis for implementation. Yes, there are things that can be done on a chip, which cannot be done on an FPGA, such a internal bidirectional signals, or buses with multiple drivers. These things can cause unexpected behavior in the original chips, which has to be mimicked with point-to-point, unidirectional signaling. There is a great graphical transistor level emulator, though, which has helped with some corner cases: http://www.visual6502.org/JSSim/index.html

 

[Steel579]

Where's the Amiga 2000 or 3000 ultimate with a badass Motorola 68030? I had a Commodore 64 too. Yeah, that's nice nostalgia for the 40- and 50-year-olds, "Peri Fractic", but the Commodore 64 sucked.

The Amiga at least gave me a few fun point-and-click games before the NES and SNES got all my attention. And at least I could write a few essays for school on a graphical word processor on my Amiga, and at least I could play some cool music on my Amiga.

But the Commodore 64?! The C64?! Come on, man. That's junk.

 

[TerryLaze]

Yeah, that's nice nostalgia for the 40- and 50-year-olds,

The last c64 was produced in 1994 the same year the A400T was introduced, they made the c64 until they went bankrupt.
That's 30 years ago which means that plenty of people that are 25-30 now had a c64 in their home when they were very little.

 

[BaloneyPoney]

You know, I see all this hype about people buying remakes of older games, movies, and other things. And when the remakes come out, the price gets gouged way up there, and people buy them and resell them on eBay for way more than they bought it for. What's wrong here?!?! Does no one else see that these are just schemes to make money for the companies that already have lots of money? I mean, obviously, no 3rd party will pick this up to make peripherals, because, obviously, no new games will be released on this platform. And there's really nothing "collectible" about a new outdated PC. You are just handing these people money. I guarantee you will get one, play it for maybe an hour or so, then slide it back in the closet never to be used again. This is really the dumbest thing I have ever seen.

 

[iguanac64]

You know, I see all this hype about people buying remakes of older games, movies, and other things. And when the remakes come out, the price gets gouged way up there, and people buy them and resell them on eBay for way more than they bought it for. What's wrong here?!?! Does no one else see that these are just schemes to make money for the companies that already have lots of money? I mean, obviously, no 3rd party will pick this up to make peripherals, because, obviously, no new games will be released on this platform. And there's really nothing "collectible" about a new outdated PC. You are just handing these people money. I guarantee you will get one, play it for maybe an hour or so, then slide it back in the closet never to be used again. This is really the dumbest thing I have ever seen.

The people behind this latest push aren't soulless "companies that have lots of money." They are known people with a long history behind both the original hardware and the modern C64 retro community. If the project falls apart, it's not because they were all grifters...it's because monetizing projects like this is hard. There are a lot of third parties still making peripherals for the original C64 hardware. It seems like a LOT of projects have recently made huge leaps in the past few years. The Ultimate II cartridge, a bluetooth board you can add to your C64 to use any bluetooth controller or keyboard, userport Wifi cartridges, HDMI output upgrades, mechanical keyboard...etc...etc...etc. These projects are just the tip of the iceberg...there's a lot of cool hardware being developed for the original C64. Within the last couple of years, it's been possible to make a brand new C64 from all new parts (with the custom chips being replaced by similar looking PCBs that have FPGA's emulating the specific chip). There are ALREADY people buying these parts to make their own reproductions...this just mostly unifies all these efforts. Did you know there's a C64 motherboard reproduction that costs probably $1k if you buy all the bells and whistles for it (EVO64 motherboard with integrated tube amps)?

Chris Simpson's (Perifractic) vision seems to be to unify a lot of these projects and resources as much as possible under one umbrella. You'd probably also be surprised that people are STILL making new games for the C64. Some are just remakes (which are still pretty impressive), such as Sonic the Hedgehog, Empire Strikes Back, and Eye of the Beholder. Some are brand new completed games. There are even STILL people who do yearly competitions to make new demos for the C64 and they are mind blowing if you grew up with the machine and understand how impressive the effects are considering the limitations.