To grease or not to grease?!

[DrAmar]

I just ordered the parts for my new comp., and I was wondering about my upcoming CPU installation.

I will be installing an Athlon 2500+ XP and I am planing to overclock it to 3200+ speeds using the standard AMD fan(+ Asus A7N8X_E Deluxe MB with nForce2 Ultra 400 Chipset + 512Mb Corsair XMS ram; 2x256 dual channel)
Originally I was planing on puting a small amount of thermal grease between the heatsink and CPU, but then I went to the AMD site and watched their CPU installation guide.
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/TechnicalResources/0,,30_182_869_4348^6678,00.html

Basically they explicitly suggest not to use any grease but instead to stick with the Thermal Pad that I assume will be provided with the heatsink. Furthermore, they clearly state never to use the grease together with the thermal pad.

Toms Hardware Guide however seems to clearly prefere using the paste, so my question is whether to stick with the pad or buy some paste/grease and remove the pad, or even use both (Which doesn't seem to be a good idea according to AMD,but just checking 😛 )
http://www.tomshardware.com/howto/20020918/diy_2-04.html

Thanks,
DrAmar

Ps. Also if grease is better solution, should I go and buy the 10$+ Antec silver paste, or is 2-3$ generic (packed in some bags) sufficient?


I don't even believe in JEBUS!
Homer, you are on the flight to a remote island where you will be doing some missionary work.
SAVE ME JEBUS!!!!!!

 

[Johanthegnarler]

For oc'ing i would say get AS, just make sure it's legit AS and not some generic fake AS. Some people have reported a 3c drop in tempatures, on a p4 2.6c it dropped 4c just using the AS. I was originally using the pad and it was running real hot and i had that laying around so i gave it a try.
But if you can't scrape up the ten bucks it wont make a huge difference.


<A HREF="http://arc.aquamark3.com/arc/arc_view.php?run=1752623717" target="_new">http://arc.aquamark3.com/arc/arc_view.php?run=1752623717</A>
45.5k mark? 85 dollars went a long way. So did that extra 15 dollars for cooling my video card.

 

[Crashman]

Actually the "Pad" isn't a pad at all, it's just a thermally softened version of the paste! Basically it's like a wax that softens when the CPU gets hot. The thermal conductor is similar to that of some thermal paste/greases. But unlike a grease, it's only soft when warm.

<font color=blue>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to a hero as big as Crashman!</font color=blue>
<font color=red>Only a place as big as the internet could be home to an ego as large as Crashman's!</font color=red>

 

[P4Man]

If I remember correctly, using certain types of grease (including AS!) even voided warranty for AMD processors. I'm not sure if its still the case, but I remember reading some articles on this, that clearly concluded using AS in theory voids your warranty (as does overclocking obviously, so no need to worry about it). There was a good reason for this, but I am not sure I remember it. I think it has something to do with the grease drying up over time, and becoming uneffective, but maybe someone else remembers the details or has a link.

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =

 

[P4Man]

oh here is the link with details:
<A HREF="http://www.xtremetek.com/info/index.php?id=14" target="_new">http://www.xtremetek.com/info/index.php?id=14</A>

= The views stated herein are my personal views, and not necessarily the views of my wife. =

 

[DrAmar]

Thanks a lot for your answers guys, especially you P4Man (The link you gave me is really great!!!)
Unfortunately, both AMD's as well as AS views make a lot of sense, and I am still not sure what to do

Is it really very difficult to overclock with the "pad" as AS claims, or is 3-4C decrease the best I can get from AS (Which doesn't seem a whole lot when speaking about the 50-60C range)
What would you do if you had to choose right now?

Thanks,

Ps. Consider also that I am a newbie in com. building (but I hope a very well informed one ) and that taking off the pad properly and putting just the right amount of AS is by no means a given in my case.

Ps. Is it possible to use both, or would that be the worst thing I could do?


I don't even believe in JEBUS!
Homer, you are on the flight to a remote island where you will be doing some missionary work.
SAVE ME JEBUS!!!!!!

 

[beigeboxer]

what will you do if you have to remove the heatsink
i.e. new motherboard don't work
guess you'll be using the grease?

 

[Coyote]

Do not put both on.

If worried about the warranty, you have the option of using the thermal pad initially, cuz your going to use the stock HSF initially. If your chip is bad out-of-the-box, you will not have voided the warranty

When you overclock, you may be lucky and find your chip will do 11 x 200 (3200+ speeds) without a volt mod. If so, all things being equal (case fans, reasonable cool ambient tempurature etc.) you will not need "extra" cooling. At 1.65 vcore, the temp will not get high.

If must increase the vcore, your temps will climb. At that point even a $22 aftermaket HSF (ex. Vantech Aeroflow) will be a good improvent. When you install, the thermal pad will be history, use AS5 then. Since you've now overclocked and used an aftermarket HFS, technically your warranty's already voided.


For what it's worth, when I went through this decision last year, I scraped off the pad anyway, applied AS5. If my chip was bad? I'd just clean it up good and RMA anyway. I suspect AMD thinks the thermal pad is more "idiot proof" and doesn't want to say so out of fear of insulting consumers. Take a look at some photo's posted of excessively applied paste and you get the idea.

Taking off the pad is easy, I put the HS in the freezer for a while. Then used something like an credit card to scrape it off.

To apply paste,I cut the plastic retail cpu box and used it like a mini putty knife to apply paste smoothly and evenly. Think "very thin layer" and you should be fine.

btw, it takes longer for me to type this than actually doing it. It's easy

Barton 2500+
Abit NF7-S v 2.0
Maxtor 60GB ATA 133 7200RPM
512MB Corsair Twinx 3200LL
9600 Pro
Enermax Noisetaker 420 watts
Win98SE

 

[DeEvolution]

Basically it goes like this:

1. Never mix thermal interface materials unless you <i>really</i> know what you are doing or do not care about what happens. So do not grease and pad.

2. If you overclock your processor then your warranty is void. Period.

3. Just like everyone else, even if you knowingly voided your warranty that will not stop you from trying to return it anyway should something go wrong because god gave up trying to smite everyone who ever tried to break a contract and get away with it a long time ago.

4. However apparently god still tries to smite those who make blasphemous movies about killing Jebus, so pick your battles with god or you just might find yourself at the wrong end of a lightning bolt.

5. Even then god still failed to smite. Personally I think he has lost his touch. 😱


"Sad is the elephant upon the ice who went to put on his wooly coat only to realize that he left it in his other trunk." - DeEvolution

 

[DrAmar]

Thanks a lot guys,

"When you overclock, you may be lucky and find your chip will do 11 x 200 (3200+ speeds) without a volt mod. If so, all things being equal (case fans, reasonable cool ambient tempurature etc.) you will not need "extra" cooling. At 1.65 vcore, the temp will not get high"

That was exactly what I was hoping to hear Coyote, I will probably stick with the original Thermal Pad for the beginning, and if I need to raise the vcore I will consider buying the paste + new hs.

Regarding the warranty per se, or even being smiten down by Jebus (that was very funny DeEvolution)for ignoring some arbitary rules of greedy cooporations, I actually couldn't care less.
I was actually more concerned about the question WHY they are trying so badly to discourage it, and if it is really bad for their cpu's, or are they just doing some beaurocracy. The consensus seem to be though that Thermal Paste is actually better, even though not really neccessary.

Anyhow, the reason why I am probably still going to go with the stock solution (unless temp. goes over 60*) is simply because it seems more convinient (no driving to store, buying HS+AS, removing pad etc.) and it looks like it has a good chance of succeeding. (+ More importantly, for the beginning I don't like thinkering with the original stuff unless I really have to)

Once again,
Thank all of you guys for you imput and please feel free to add anything you like

DrAmar aka. Jebus was a good man



I don't even believe in JEBUS!
Homer, you are on the flight to a remote island where you will be doing some missionary work.
SAVE ME JEBUS!!!!!!

 

[SpaceDonkey]

To grease or not to grease?!

Use grease man, *always*. I personally recommend <A HREF="http://www.drugstore.com/products/prod.asp?pid=38702&catid=21302&trx=GFI-0-EVGR-11695&trxp1=21302&trxp2=38702&trxp3=1&trxp4=1&btrx=BUY-GFI-0-EVGR-11695" target="_new"> Astroglide</A>

---------------------------------------------------
I am severly limited in what my mind can perceive.

 

[JoeB]

LOL!!

_____________
whompiedompie