News Trump: No Tariff Waivers for Mac Pro Components

JoBalz

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Maybe if they hadn't just offshored their Mac Pro production from the US to China, they might have had a chance. But they blew any chance they had, shipping off jobs from here to China just to cut their labor costs (but I doubt they would have reduced the Mac Pro price to reflect the savings). Typical Apple Arrogance(tm).
 
I'm with the rest of you, Apple does not deserve tariff relieve, since I also agree they would not lower the prices to consumers to match the commonly found inferior Chinese workmanship. Also what id10t at Apple thought it was a good idea to move production of any sort from the US to China during a trade war? Who ever that bean counter is and the people that approved it need to be fired.

I'm not saying all products from China are poor quality but its pretty easy to find higher quality components almost anywhere else in the world at this time. Also if quality is the same I'd rather support a rational player in the World economy rather then a country that artificially adjust the value of its currency in order to have an unfair advantage.

China in a lot of industries is basically a monopoly and should be treated as such.
 
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mihen

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I'm sure the Taiwan psu makers are trying to move manufacturing to Taiwan. I'm not sure if they completely stopped manufacturing in Taiwan since it's difficult to research.
 

bloodroses

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Ninjawithagun

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Apple is just pissed because they can no longer blindly extort child labor laws (or lack thereof) in China. Ultimately, Apple's greed is there own limitation. But don't worry, the Orange Man is Bad, thus the liberal media will find a way to label this as another 'racist' act.
 
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Yea i really can't stand chinese manufacturing.

I don't know what the proper way to improve conditions is, but something needs to change.

In the 1800s USA we had child labor in unsafe working conditions. We have since fixed this, but china is even worse. They force kids to work with all of the modern chemicals and things without any modern safety measures.

I say stopping supporting chinese manufacturing untill they change their ways would be a good way. A boycott of sorts.
 
Reactions: bigdragon
Regardless of the merits, or lack thereof, of Apple's actions, does anyone really labor under the delusion that Trump's decision is based on any logic or fairness?

It's highly unlikely that it's anything more than "Apple is a tech company that doesn't sing my praises, so screw them!"

That's the decision-making going on, if Trump's the one making the decisions.
 
Its simply that Apple can make their mac pro with parts not from China. My guess is they agreed to a China only parts deal for low prices and now are stuck. Apple pay the tariff or buy parts from other places its as simple as that.

Given Apple has most of congress in their back pocket this may be the company's only real tax.
 
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TJ Hooker

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As much as most maxintoshes cost, id assume Apples margin has plenty of padding to absorb the tax.

They arent going to be unprofitable from theses taxes.
Yeah, was thinking the same thing. Apple's margins are probably plenty high enough to absorb at least some of the costs, and their customers are generally already used to paying the 'apple tax' premium for their products so if Apple's prices go up a bit it probably wouldn't make a big difference to them.
 
Yeah, was thinking the same thing. Apple's margins are probably plenty high enough to absorb at least some of the costs, and their customers are generally already used to paying the 'apple tax' premium for their products so if Apple's prices go up a bit it probably wouldn't make a big difference to them.
I'm sure Apple profits even more due to bundled accessories and or bundled AppleCare.
 

bit_user

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Apple is just pissed because they can no longer blindly extort child labor laws (or lack thereof) in China.
Hasn't that been debunked?

china is even worse. They force kids to work with all of the modern chemicals and things without any modern safety measures.
Call me skeptical, but I would like to know more. Got any sources?

I mean, China doesn't have the best labor laws, but I think they're not so bad by comparison with many countries. In fact, in recent years, they've been suffering labor shortages, causing them to move manufacturing to even lower-cost countries.

If you're concerned about labor conditions, I'd be a lot more wary of Bangladesh. I'm also not too sure about India and Vietnam (where a lot of manufacturing is going to get around Trump's tariffs).

If you want to bash China for human rights issues, there's no shortage of concerns:
  • no free press
  • internet censorship
  • imprisonment of human rights and defense attorneys
  • no free practice of religion
  • massive "re-education" camps in Xinjiang
  • ongoing cultural destruction and resettlement in Tibet
  • not to mention the ongoing efforts to clamp down on the freedoms and rights enjoyed by residents of Hong Kong.
I'm sure there are more, but that's just what comes to mind.
 
Reactions: TJ Hooker

bit_user

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Regardless of the merits, or lack thereof, of Apple's actions, does anyone really labor under the delusion that Trump's decision is based on any logic or fairness?
As noted in the article, it's not actually his decision. It's the USTR's call, and they've been denying a lot of requests for exemptions. So, I don't expect Apple will receive special treatment. I think his tweet was just pointing out that they won't get special treatment, so they'd be better off focusing on shifting their manufacturing if they don't want to be subject to the tariff.

I don't know the exact terms under which exemptions are granted, but they are being pretty strict and there are laws preventing arbitrary and capricious action by the government. I cannot quote you chapter and verse, but it would be grounds for Apple to sue, if they felt they were unduly singled out.

That's the decision-making going on, if Trump's the one making the decisions.
I worry about a lot of his decisions. I'm not worried about this case, and not just because I don't buy Apple stuff.
 
Reactions: King_V

bit_user

Splendid
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As much as most maxintoshes cost, id assume Apples margin has plenty of padding to absorb the tax.

They arent going to be unprofitable from theses taxes.
It's funny though. These companies don't only care about being profitable - they care about showing good trends to Wall St. So, they don't like to show declining sales numbers or reduced margins from one quarter to the next, or year-on-year. When the trend lines start going the wrong ways, executives and even CEOs start getting replaced. These guys aren't going to wait for a full-on crisis to react, or to start doing damage-limitation.

And, in fact, their iPhone sales have been in significant decline, for at least a couple quarters. Part of that, they blame on decreased consumption in China. The Chinese economy was already in decline prior to the trade war, though the trade war is certainly amplifying that and probably also stoking nationalistic sentiment. I'm sure they have "buy Chinese" campaigns, sort of how you used to here a lot of "buy American" slogans, in previous decades.
 
Reactions: TJ Hooker
Foxconn, the company that makes iphones, had to put anti-suicide nets out of the windows since the workers are in such bad conditions.
Source:https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jun/18/foxconn-life-death-forbidden-city-longhua-suicide-apple-iphone-brian-merchant-one-device-extract


"Most of the (foxconn) workers have no comments about the popular Apple products since they have never dreamed of owning the gadgets since their salaries are only enough to buy a knockoff version."

https://www.businessinsider.com/the-shocking-conditions-inside-chinas-brutal-foxconn-factory-2010-5

This reminds me very much of the lives of ex slaves in the late 1800s. They werent enslaves, but they were forced to work for very little money and be treated like animals.
 
And, in fact, their iPhone sales have been in significant decline, for at least a couple quarters. Part of that, they blame on decreased consumption in China
And they dont blame it on the fact they cost more than what people can afford.

My $120 lg stylo 4 has an 18x9 fhd screen, no notch, facial unlock, a fingerprint scanner, 8 core cpu, usb-c, wireless charging (although this feature isnt advertised) and more.

I'm not saying my phone is better (my lg packs pretty weak specs internally and has plenty of cost cutting measures like poor camra and speaker), but rather that iphones are vastly overpriced.
 

bit_user

Splendid
Ambassador
"Most of the (foxconn) workers have no comments about the popular Apple products since they have never dreamed of owning the gadgets since their salaries are only enough to buy a knockoff version."
Well, at least that part makes sense. I never felt rich enough to buy an iPhone. The phone I have now (the most expensive I've ever bought) still didn't cost as much as the original iPhone did, 11 years ago!

And they dont blame it on the fact they cost more than what people can afford.
Except, the thing is that they're selling worse than they previously did, in China. Some of that might be due to price increases on recent models, but I think they're experiencing a genuine sales decline, even after accounting for that. China has long been a big market, for them.

I'm sure some of it is also just Chinese waking up to the fact that the competition has caught up, and is a lot more compelling than it used to be.
 
I actually owned 2 ipod touch devices and then an iphone 5s.

Now i looked to get a new one and the most i could afford was a 3 gen old 6s.
Or for less money I could get a brand new model android (released like 3 months before) with a lot more features and more power than the 6s. Ill admit i lost some things going out of apples eco system, but it was worth it.

The only things i mossed were the fact i couldnt facetime or imessage friends and family who owned apple anymore.
 
Oh, also, apple supports child labor. (Im sure its not just apple, but apple isnt a kind american company that deserves to be exempt from anything)

They hire foxconn to build their iphones. At one point foxconn had 14 year old students assembling iphones. Not ok.

 

mihen

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I think the worst offense by China is the organ harvesting of political prisoners. Right now those are the Tibetans, Uyghurs and Christians. A lot of things are about to change in China with or without US involvement. The issue with Hong Kong, the growing middle class, and the consolidation of power in the leader for life. The only way to address those things are by decreasing the power of the Communist Party which in turn helps stop many of the human rights abuses by China and push China into a 1st world country.
 

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