Question Underclocking an AMD Ryzen 5900X ?

[cgash3]

Hello, I've had my Ryzen 5900X for a while now and I'm happy with its capabilities. However, the CPU keeps fairly high temps while idle or not doing much. This is very uncomfortable to me since most of my day passes in work using remote desktops and I only load the CPU (either for work or games) in my free time.

I know that it's better to do this kind of work in the BIOS, however, I prefere the dynamic nature of doing it in Windows, especially when I'm not trying to overclock anything. For this sort of work, I'm currently using ASUS ROG's AI Suite 3, as my MB is from ASUS.

I have 2 built-in profiles - the default one where the CPU frequency is dynamic in range 3.7-4.8GHz, and another one fixed at 4.2GHz that I mostly use as it's quieter and cooler and I rarely need the extra power.

I have no experience at all in the field of Over/Underclocking and I need some help with a solution for a stable profile that I can use for my daily needs (remote desktop, youtube videos, browsing, etc). I tried searching for one on the web but couldnt find anything.

Can anyone help me with this? Maybe at least point me to something or give me a link if they know of a place where I can find such profiles?

 

[a39232]

Well its usually a better option to do this in the BIOS because there is a high possibility if it shutting down since you would be manually adjusting voltage and clock speed. That and those chips are designed to boost as high as possible as long as it doesn't hit the power or thermal limit.
But essentially you would use whatever setting to keep the clocks the same speed and then lower the voltage and testing to see where its stable.

 

[cgash3]

Thanks for answering!

Honestly, I don't really care about the clock speeds. I'm just looking for a hot switch between "power" mode and "office computer" mode without needing to actually buy an office computer.

The way you say it sounds very easy. However, when I get into the BIOS there are possibly 100+ settings for all kinds of controls that I don't really understand. Thant's another reason I prefere doing this in the AI Suite app. However, the settings in the app are extremely limited and I'm not even sure if what I'm trying to achieve is even possible there.

 

[Crosslhs82x2]

I used this video as a guide and dropped 10c and gained performance.

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nvVs_6Sr3wU&feature=shared

 

[Bob.B]

Thanks for answering!

Honestly, I don't really care about the clock speeds. I'm just looking for a hot switch between "power" mode and "office computer" mode without needing to actually buy an office computer.

The way you say it sounds very easy. However, when I get into the BIOS there are possibly 100+ settings for all kinds of controls that I don't really understand. Thant's another reason I prefere doing this in the AI Suite app. However, the settings in the app are extremely limited and I'm not even sure if what I'm trying to achieve is even possible there.

Could you set up 2 power plans say balanced for office work and high perf for gaming?

Within each plan you can adjust min and max cpu power.

 

[CountMike]

In a Power Plan settings, Less than 100% of maximum processor state forces CPU to run up to it's Base Clock frequency, in your case 3.7GHz. As you go less than 99%, it progressively lowers maximum frequency all the way down to what is set as Minimum state.
If you look here
https://superuser.com/questions/957500/easy-way-to-switch-power-plan-in-windows-10
there are several ways to switch plans on the fly wit one mouse click.

 

[cgash3]

In a Power Plan settings, Less than 100% of maximum processor state forces CPU to run up to it's Base Clock frequency, in your case 3.7GHz. As you go less than 99%, it progressively lowers maximum frequency all the way down to what is set as Minimum state.
If you look here
https://superuser.com/questions/957500/easy-way-to-switch-power-plan-in-windows-10
there are several ways to switch plans on the fly wit one mouse click.

I'm sort of doing the same with the AI Suite. I have the 4200MHz profile which fixes both minimum and maximum clock to be 4200MHz. I tried to "beat the system" by lowering the clock to 3700MHz fixed and using all the lower settings from the 2 built-in profiles. However, this approach backfired for some reason and kept my temps ~15C higher than the 4200MHz profile.

I'll try your way now to see if I can get better results. Sadly, I have a similar issue with my GPU and it seems that one is harder to fix: GPU high temps issue

 

[CountMike]

I'm sort of doing the same with the AI Suite. I have the 4200MHz profile which fixes both minimum and maximum clock to be 4200MHz. I tried to "beat the system" by lowering the clock to 3700MHz fixed and using all the lower settings from the 2 built-in profiles. However, this approach backfired for some reason and kept my temps ~15C higher than the 4200MHz profile.

I'll try your way now to see if I can get better results. Sadly, I have a similar issue with my GPU and it seems that one is harder to fix: GPU high temps issue

AI Suite is garbage, Go to BIOS and do it from there or at least Ryzen Master.

 

[wyliec2]

Have you tried undervolting?? I did this with my 5950X quite successfully - use the Offset voltage with a negative value.

It allowed me to reduce temps while keeping an all-core overclock of 4200 MHz. Of course, you can reduce the clock value too but for me, the best results came with undervolt. I disabled PBO too as my use involved CPU-intense multi-thread workloads. The all-core OC still works well for daily driver office work too.

I was able to accomplish the same result with both BIOS and with AI Suite 3.

 

[cgash3]

In a Power Plan settings, Less than 100% of maximum processor state forces CPU to run up to it's Base Clock frequency, in your case 3.7GHz. As you go less than 99%, it progressively lowers maximum frequency all the way down to what is set as Minimum state.
If you look here
https://superuser.com/questions/957500/easy-way-to-switch-power-plan-in-windows-10
there are several ways to switch plans on the fly wit one mouse click.

I tried this way. I successfully brought down the clock to 1.7GHZ (30%, just for testing). This method achieved temps ~47-48C. This is serious underclocking next to the built-in 4.2GHz which gives 50-51C. In this case 3C is not worth it.

Have you tried undervolting?? I did this with my 5950X quite successfully - use the Offset voltage with a negative value.

It allowed me to reduce temps while keeping an all-core overclock of 4200 MHz. Of course, you can reduce the clock value too but for me, the best results came with undervolt. I disabled PBO too as my use involved CPU-intense multi-thread workloads. The all-core OC still works well for daily driver office work too.

I was able to accomplish the same result with both BIOS and with AI Suite 3.

Do you have exact AI Suite 3 settings? The only offset I see here is "Sense MI Offset" which is set to 272 and the minimum is 0 (no negative values). Also, I see nothing related to "PBO" in AI Suite 3. We're talking about the "TPU" page, right?

AI Suite is garbage, Go to BIOS and do it from there or at least Ryzen Master.

Hmm, never heard of Ryzen Master. Even if I use it, I still need some settings to try

 

[CountMike]

I tried this way. I successfully brought down the clock to 1.7GHZ (30%, just for testing). This method achieved temps ~47-48C. This is serious underclocking next to the built-in 4.2GHz which gives 50-51C. In this case 3C is not worth it.



Do you have exact AI Suite 3 settings? The only offset I see here is "Sense MI Offset" which is set to 272 and the minimum is 0 (no negative values). Also, I see nothing related to "PBO" in AI Suite 3. We're talking about the "TPU" page, right?



Hmm, never heard of Ryzen Master. Even if I use it, I still need some settings to try

It's from AMD direct. It's their program. AIsuite is just Asus, other makes have own
https://www.amd.com/en/products/software/ryzen-master.html

 

[cgash3]

It's from AMD direct. It's their program. AIsuite is just Asus, other makes have own
https://www.amd.com/en/products/software/ryzen-master.html

I figured as much. However, as I said, I need a profile that would work with my CPU and help me achieve the results I need

 

[CountMike]

I figured as much. However, as I said, I need a profile that would work with my CPU and help me achieve the results I need

Nobody can tel you exactly what, you'll have to experiment yourself.

 

[wyliec2]

I tried this way. I successfully brought down the clock to 1.7GHZ (30%, just for testing). This method achieved temps ~47-48C. This is serious underclocking next to the built-in 4.2GHz which gives 50-51C. In this case 3C is not worth it.

Do you have exact AI Suite 3 settings? The only offset I see here is "Sense MI Offset" which is set to 272 and the minimum is 0 (no negative values). Also, I see nothing related to "PBO" in AI Suite 3. We're talking about the "TPU" page, right?

Hmm, never heard of Ryzen Master. Even if I use it, I still need some settings to try

PBO might need to be disabled in BIOS.

I used the 5950X for a few years with the 4200 all-core OC and an undervolt - a couple months back I upgraded to 7950X and MSI motherboard - I don't have anything to reference now. There are just a few parameters that need to be changed.

There's an AI Suite 3 page that has CPU clock speed on top and then two columns of voltage parameters underneath. There is an Offset Voltage and this can be set to a negative value - IIRC I used values of -.06 to -.12.

Page 7 of this document shows what I'm talking about:

https://dlcdnet.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/LGA1150/MAXIMUS-VI-EXTREME/DE138_ROG_AI_Suite3.pdf

I wouldn't use AI Suite 3 or Ryzen Master for hard core overclocking...I tried Ryzen Master on my 7950X twice and both times it left me in a situation where the system crashed and failed to post. You can go down a rabbit hole with curve optimizer, etc.

For a moderate undervolt, AI Suite 3 works fine.

 

[cgash3]

My AI Suite looks different than the one in the document you shared @wyliec2 . I really don't have an "Offset Voltage" parameter and I also don't have a lot of things included in that document.
All the parameters on my TPU page (and their values with the 4.2GHz built-in profile) are:
BCKL Frequency: 100 MHz
Ratio: 42 => 4200MHz

CPU VCore Voltage: 0.0
DRAM Voltage: 1.4
1.2V SB Voltage: 1.2
VDDP Voltage: 0.9
PCE Tune R3: 63
DRAM CTRL REF Voltage on CHB: 0.5
1.8V Standby Voltage: 1.8
CPU 3.3v AUX: 3.6
VDDSOC Voltage: 1.1
1.00V SB Voltage: 1.0
VTTDDR Voltage: 0.7
VPP_MEM Voltage: 2.5
DRAM CTRL REF Voltage on CHA: 0.5
PLL reference voltage: 0
1.8 PLL Voltage: 2.1
Sense MI Offset: 272

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Hey there,

Just go into the bios, and put the CPU in ECO mode. Save and exit and be done with it.

Your min temps will not go much further below, no matter how much you reduce core clocks. Ideally you need to strike a balance, between having the power when you need it, versus low power usage when idling.

I'd have to agree with @CountMike here. For some reason, you don't seem to be too interested in trying the fixes provided. Or, at least, you have some preference that negates each response. Working from the bios ensures more stability than the software fixes you seek.

Stop using AI Suite to manage your system. If part of Armoury Crate, then if you really want results, you will uninstall it. In fact, that software is so bad, ASUS have their own uninstaller app for it. AC causes all sorts of crap to happen. Download HWInfo and use it to monitor your system.

Also, please list your full PC specs. We are dancing around an issue with not even the basics understood.

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

Nobody can tel you exactly what, you'll have to experiment yourself.

Precisely. There's a certain amount of work involved in getting favourable results. This takes time, testing, restarts etc. Every CPU is different, and simply dialing in settings will not work.

 

[wyliec2]

My AI Suite looks different than the one in the document you shared @wyliec2 . I really don't have an "Offset Voltage" parameter and I also don't have a lot of things included in that document.
All the parameters on my TPU page (and their values with the 4.2GHz built-in profile) are:
BCKL Frequency: 100 MHz
Ratio: 42 => 4200MHz

I'm not sure if AI Suite 3 has different options based on the specific motherboard or based on some settings made in BIOS.

In my case, I had an X570 Crosshair Formula VIII.

All of my initial setup was in BIOS - there are really just a few parameters to set..
PBO: Disabled
Core Ratio
CPU Core Voltage: Offset
Offset sign: - (negative sign)
Core Voltage offset: value that will vary based on what clock setting you set.

After making initial setup in BIOS, I was able to tweak on the fly using AI Suite 3 - not sure if the settings in AI Suite have a dependency on BIOS - ie. does BIOS need to have Core voltage set to Offset for Offset to show up in AI...

 

[MEMOFLEX]

Based on the other thread you have open for underclocking a 4080 then this all seems like a massive amount of effort, absolutely crippling some high end hardware, when the hot box case is the real problem.

The pursuit of low temps and noise is admirable but when you get high end components then heat is a byproduct. If it cannot escape the case then there us little you can do.

A suggestion was made to move the case to another room and use a long display port / hdmi cable so that you can at least use your components as intended. Would this be an option?

Alternatively increasing the fan speed or changing the case would be the way to go and dealing with the heat management in the room separately.

Options are available but you can't have it both ways

More drastically you could sell the high end components you have and invest in some lower power kit that does not have these issues.

 

[CountMike]

All I have seen here pertains to using one CPU cooler but don't see which one it is in this case.
Best way to minimize temps without losing and maybe even improving performance is to use oversize/over capable cooler which will bring lower temps and fans turning at lower speeds for quieter operation.

 

[MEMOFLEX]

All I have seen here pertains to using one CPU cooler but don't see which one it is in this case.
Best way to minimize temps without losing and maybe even improving performance is to use oversize/over capable cooler which will bring lower temps and fans turning at lower speeds for quieter operation.

This is why I exclusively use 140mm fans where possible and invested in noctua redux fans with the rubber anti vibration mounts for all fans. I even use a push pull with 4 140s on my radiator so that I can keep the speeds low without compromising performance. It was costly but with the computer being on the desk next to me it was worth it.

Fan curve will get them to kick in when required but this is normally only during a heavy gaming session and I wil be wearing a headset at this point so I don't notice.

What I do notice though is the heat output which can be significant but I have accepted that this as a consequence of getting that hot air out of the case. It is welcome in the winter months here in England though.

 

[CountMike]

This is why I exclusively use 140mm fans where possible and invested in noctua redux fans with the rubber anti vibration mounts for all fans. I even use a push pull with 4 140s on my radiator so that I can keep the speeds low without compromising performance. It was costly but with the computer being on the desk next to me it was worth it.

Fan curve will get them to kick in when required but this is normally only during a heavy gaming session and I wil be wearing a headset at this point so I don't notice.

What I do notice though is the heat output which can be significant but I have accepted that this as a consequence of getting that hot air out of the case. It is welcome in the winter months here in England though.

That's the way to go, amount of heat is inevitable no matter what cooling just temps could be different. If I was to cripple my 7900x just to lower temps and heat might have gotten 7600x which can be cooled in light breeze.

 

[MEMOFLEX]

That's the way to go, amount of heat is inevitable no matter what cooling just temps could be different. If I was to cripple my 7900x just to lower temps and heat might have gotten 7600x which can be cooled in light breeze.

Absolutely. Compromises can be made in some areas but I would rather open a window for some fresh air than throw half my performance out of it.

 

[cgash3]

I consider this thread closed. Judging by your answers, there's no way for me to achieve what I want. It's just that the computer parts aren't made to be able to do that. That's fine, I guess. Some final thoughts and answers just to tie up some loose ends though:

First of all, I want to thank all of you who joined this discussion and gave your best to help me with my issue!

1.

Hey there,

Just go into the bios, and put the CPU in ECO mode. Save and exit and be done with it.

Your min temps will not go much further below, no matter how much you reduce core clocks. Ideally you need to strike a balance, between having the power when you need it, versus low power usage when idling.

I'd have to agree with @CountMike here. For some reason, you don't seem to be too interested in trying the fixes provided. Or, at least, you have some preference that negates each response. Working from the bios ensures more stability than the software fixes you seek.

Stop using AI Suite to manage your system. If part of Armoury Crate, then if you really want results, you will uninstall it. In fact, that software is so bad, ASUS have their own uninstaller app for it. AC causes all sorts of crap to happen. Download HWInfo and use it to monitor your system.

Also, please list your full PC specs. We are dancing around an issue with not even the basics understood.

It's not like I don't appreciate the provided fixes. It's just that they are not what I'm looking for and most of them are options that I've already gone through one way or another. Please don't feel unappreciated just because a solution that was given to me is not exactly what I'm looking for.

2.

Based on the other thread you have open for underclocking a 4080 then this all seems like a massive amount of effort, absolutely crippling some high end hardware, when the hot box case is the real problem.

The pursuit of low temps and noise is admirable but when you get high end components then heat is a byproduct. If it cannot escape the case then there us little you can do.

A suggestion was made to move the case to another room and use a long display port / hdmi cable so that you can at least use your components as intended. Would this be an option?

Alternatively increasing the fan speed or changing the case would be the way to go and dealing with the heat management in the room separately.

Options are available but you can't have it both ways

More drastically you could sell the high end components you have and invest in some lower power kit that does not have these issues.

Moving the case to another room is not an option because of the place I live in.

3.

That's the way to go, amount of heat is inevitable no matter what cooling just temps could be different. If I was to cripple my 7900x just to lower temps and heat might have gotten 7600x which can be cooled in light breeze.

I need the full power, just not at all times. That's why I can't downgrade my hardware. Otherwise, I would've done it a long time ago.

4.

Absolutely. Compromises can be made in some areas but I would rather open a window for some fresh air than throw half my performance out of it.

My window is ALWAYS open (except for when the AC is on). However, during the summer the temps go up to 40-45 C even without being exposed to direct sunlight, so any extra temp from the PC makes this a lot worse.

 

[Roland Of Gilead]

I consider this thread closed. Judging by your answers, there's no way for me to achieve what I want. It's just that the computer parts aren't made to be able to do that. That's fine, I guess. Some final thoughts and answers just to tie up some loose ends though:

First of all, I want to thank all of you who joined this discussion and gave your best to help me with my issue!

1.

It's not like I don't appreciate the provided fixes. It's just that they are not what I'm looking for and most of them are options that I've already gone through one way or another. Please don't feel unappreciated just because a solution that was given to me is not exactly what I'm looking for.

2.

Moving the case to another room is not an option because of the place I live in.

3.

I need the full power, just not at all times. That's why I can't downgrade my hardware. Otherwise, I would've done it a long time ago.

4.

My window is ALWAYS open (except for when the AC is on). However, during the summer the temps go up to 40-45 C even without being exposed to direct sunlight, so any extra temp from the PC makes this a lot worse.

Ah, no worries. No offence taken.

As you mentioned we are trying to help, but if we can't solve your issue, then of course keep searching for your solution. I wish you well. If there's anything else problematic on a different subject, or the same PC but another issue, let us know. We'll be glad to help.

Good luck