Question Undervolted my Ryzen 3600

TBMD

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Hi guys

i watched a video last night (linked below) where a guy undervolted his ryzen cpu for lower temps and better performance by:
  1. opening ryzen master and going to a profile
  2. selecting manual in control mode
  3. manually setting peak core voltage to 1.25v
  4. manually setting all cores to the boost speed of the cpu (in my case 4.2 ghz)
Trying this myself i shaved ~10c off my temps when gaming, and improved my multi-core score in CB R20 from 3589 to 3782, and could now achieve 4.2ghz on all cores.
Single core score remained the same. Gaming also unaffected performance wise by the drop in voltage.


What are you guys' thoughts? is this safe long term or will this damage the CPU in some way or cause degradation?

edit: prior to the above change my default peak core voltage hits 1.38v under load (gaming & CB20)

the video:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JTuxMnrqds
 

dorsai

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Lowering the cpu voltage by .10v wont damage the cpu...the issue most people have with under-volting is stability...most systems are not 100% stable under a true 24/7 workload.

The "way too hot" stuff in the video above is hyperbole...as long as the case has good airflow there's no reason to be concerned with temps moving into the 75 + C range...the cpu is made for it.

The chip hitting 1.38v is no concern at all...it will go there and higher due to the Ryzen algorithm constantly balancing temp, voltage, and clockspeed.

IMHO a better way to drop load temps on the 3600 easily is by just changing out the stock cooler for an NH-D15 or an AIO...you get the same temp drop or close to it without causing potential stability issues.
 

TBMD

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Lowering the cpu voltage by .10v wont damage the cpu...the issue most people have with under-volting is stability...most systems are not 100% stable under a true 24/7 workload.

The "way too hot" stuff in the video above is hyperbole...as long as the case has good airflow there's no reason to be concerned with temps moving into the 75 + C range...the cpu is made for it.

The chip hitting 1.38v is no concern at all...it will go there and higher due to the Ryzen algorithm constantly balancing temp, voltage, and clockspeed.

IMHO a better way to drop load temps on the 3600 easily is by just changing out the stock cooler for an NH-D15 or an AIO...you get the same temp drop or close to it without causing potential stability issues.
Thanks for the reply.

I'm not very confident when it comes to installing a CPU cooler, so have always opted for pre-built bundles. So i guess i wanted to shave some of the temps off without having to get another cooler. Temps at the moment are around 75c in gaming which is safe enough i'd say for stock and 38-42c idle.

In regards to stability testing a fixed 1.25v, what would you recommend?
 

IDProG

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I'm not very confident when it comes to installing a CPU cooler, so have always opted for pre-built bundles. So i guess i wanted to shave some of the temps off without having to get another cooler. Temps at the moment are around 75c in gaming which is safe enough i'd say for stock and 38-42c idle.
Oh boy.

Anyway, may I see your detailed specs of the PC?
 

TBMD

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Oh boy.

Anyway, may I see your detailed specs of the PC?
Is there something wrong with them temps under load, they seem about average?

specs:
Ryzen 3600 w/ stock cooler, Precision Boost Overdrive set to auto
16gb Corsair LPX 3200 MHz DDR4 RAM w/ DOCP enabled
RTX 2060 Super
Corsair TX650w 80 PLUS Bronze

I would suggest you run prime 95 smallest fft test for an extended duration such as overnight. And if prime shows errors or your pc crashed/rebooted, your undervolt is not stable.


Thanks i'll give this a try!
 
Hi guys

i watched a video last night (linked below) where a guy undervolted his ryzen cpu for lower temps and better performance by:
  1. opening ryzen master and going to a profile
  2. selecting manual in control mode
  3. manually setting peak core voltage to 1.25v
  4. manually setting all cores to the boost speed of the cpu (in my case 4.2 ghz)
Trying this myself i shaved ~10c off my temps when gaming, and improved my multi-core score in CB R20 from 3589 to 3782, and could now achieve 4.2ghz on all cores.
Single core score remained the same. Gaming also unaffected performance wise by the drop in voltage.


What are you guys' thoughts? is this safe long term or will this damage the CPU in some way or cause degradation?

edit: prior to the above change my default peak core voltage hits 1.38v under load (gaming & CB20)

the video:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JTuxMnrqds
In all honesty, I'm a bit surprised that fixing Vcore at 1.25 V left your single thread CB20 scores unchanged. It's not unexpected to improve MT scores a bit since 1.25V is about where it would drop to under processing heavy loads anyway.

But then, 3589 seems a bit underperforming for a 3600 in the first place. I suspect that if you experimented with a little bit of a negative offset voltage instead of a fixed voltage you might find a combination that improves both multithread scores and single thread scores. Gaming likes better ST performance.

BTW, it's highly recommended to not set fixed voltage values above 1.2V on Ryzen 3000 unless you really know what you're doing. Even if the temperature seems good it can degrade the processor much quicker than just leaving it in AUTO and letting the processor manage itself with safety. In AUTO the processor frequently drops voltage to 1.0V or less but with a fixed voltage it never gets to see that. Overclockers have been finding this out even with fixed voltages as low as 1.25V.

Using offset voltage adjustment lets the processor still drop voltage...although using a positive offset means it's not dropping as far as the processor thinks it is.
 
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TBMD

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But then, 3589 seems a bit underperforming for a 3600 in the first place.
really, for a stock 3600(non-x)? from a quick google scores seem to go from mid 3500s to low 3600s on CB20.

I did notice that my core speed is pegged at 4ghz all cores. probably due to temps and PPT being at 100% of 88w? so guess i'm missing out some performance there.
 
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really, for a stock 3600? from a quick google scores seem to go from mid 3500s to low 3600s on CB20. I did notice that my core speed is pegged at 4ghz all cores. probably due to temps and PPT being at 100% of 88w? so guess i'm missing out some performance there.
I think that if well-tweaked you should be able to get to the high side of 3800's without fixing voltage or frequency. Google'd scores may or may not be a well-setup system. That means running the Ryzen power plan, BIOS with AGESA 1004b, and BIOS set up correctly including finding the right VCore offset (usually slightly negative). But the biggest difference, though, will come with ST scores since you'll get more regular and higher boosting under light bursty loads (think games) even to 4200 Mhz. To get that kind of boosting it has to be able to VCore up to 1.5V; can't do that when fixed at 1.25.

If you want to improve performance enable PBO (Manual) and set PPT to 300, EDC to 230 and TDC to 230 but leave VCore in AUTO, or a SLIGHT negative offset.

Oh yes and also set the following to enabled: CoolnQuiet, Global C States, Processor CPPC and CPPC Preferred Cores. And I'm assuming you've installed the latest AMD chipset drivers and using the AMD Balanced Power Plan.

When set up like that it will be stable under P95 forever, and safely, since it's free to lower both clocks (to stay stable and lower temp) an voltage (to reduce current and lower temp) as it's designed to do. Yet should get you the same (maybe better!) CB20 MT scores and I'm pretty certain better ST scores.
 
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TBMD

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I think that if well-tweaked you should be able to get to the high side of 3800's without fixing voltage or frequency. That means running the Ryzen power plan, BIOS with AGESA 1004b, and BIOS set up correctly including finding the right VCore offset (usually slightly negative). The biggest difference, though, will come with ST scores since you'll get more regular and higher boosting under light bursty loads (think games) even to 4200 Mhz. To get that kind of boosting it has to be able to VCore up to 1.5V; can't do that when fixed at 1.25.

If you want to improve performance enable PBO (Manual) and set PPT to 300, EDC to 230 and TDC to 230 but leave VCore in AUTO, or a SLIGHT negative offset.

Oh yes and also set the following to enabled: CoolnQuiet, Global C States, Processor CPPC and CPPC Preferred Cores. And I'm assuming you've installed the latest AMD chipset drivers and using the AMD Balanced Power Plan.

When set up like that it will be stable under P95 forever, and safely, since it's free to lower both clocks an voltage as it's designed to do. Yet should get you the same (maybe better!) CB20 MT scores and I'm pretty certain better ST scores.
Thanks for that! will give it a go.

However, I've realised i may have left out some important info from my OP.

my Motherboard is Asus B450M-K and bios is currently version 1821, i have the latest the AMD chipset as i installed it last week and currently have my power plan set to AMD Ryzen High Performance.
 
Thanks for that! will give it a go.

However, I've realised i may have left out some important info from my OP.

my Motherboard is Asus B450M-K and bios is currently version 1821, i have the latest the AMD chipset as i installed it last week and currently have my power plan set to AMD Ryzen High Performance.
ADDED: oh yes, I'd also suggest updating your BIOS to 2006, with AGESA 1004b. In fact, those PBO settings given probably won't even work right without it, and those BIOS settings may not all be available. And I'd keep an eye on the VRM temperature rather than the CPU temperature when P95 stability testing as that one lacks heatsinks on the FET's. But in normal use it should be OK with a 3600.

I've never determined exactly whether the High Performance plan helps anything, so I just recommend using the Ryzen Balanced. But don't change certain settings...min state in particular should stay at 99% as installed. That tells windows to not try to power-manage the processor as the AMD scheme built into the processor, called SenseMi or something, is so much better and faster at changing power states.

My main concern is to get you off fixed voltage. Mostly, fixed voltage and frequency offers so very little even if done right, but it's also very risky for Ryzen 3000 chips. As I said, Ryzen controls it's power useage fast and frequent, dropping voltage to below 1.0 volt very frequently when idle but even in the middle of heavy processing. When you fix it even at 1.25V it's driving heavier current (than <1.0V would) through the processor 100% of the time and never giving it a break. It's actually the current that leads to degradation, the voltage just drives the current and temperature (as the clock speed/processing picks up) makes it ever so much worse. Since they're still learning about how fast it can happen, I just feel it safer to leave it in AUTO if you can and especially since it offers little to no performance benefit if set up right.
 
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IDProG

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Thanks for that! will give it a go.

However, I've realised i may have left out some important info from my OP.

my Motherboard is Asus B450M-K and bios is currently version 1821, i have the latest the AMD chipset as i installed it last week and currently have my power plan set to AMD Ryzen High Performance.
Hate to break the news to you, buddy, but

According to this tier list, your motherboard is in "Garbo aka Garbage" Tier. I guess it's another SI corner cut maneuver.

I knew this would happen.

Undervolting the CPU is a MUST.
You did the right thing.
Your motherboard probably wouldn't be able to handle even the mildest of overclocks, maybe also automatic ones like from PBO. DO NOT EVER overclock your CPU manually, let alone increase the voltage while doing so. It would fry your motherboard in no time if you did.a

I think that's what I can say to you. Sorry if I sounded rude, I didn't mean it to be like so.
 

dorsai

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Hate to break the news to you, buddy, but

According to this tier list, your motherboard is in "Garbo aka Garbage" Tier. I guess it's another SI corner cut maneuver.

I knew this would happen.

Undervolting the CPU is a MUST.
You did the right thing.
Your motherboard probably wouldn't be able to handle even the mildest of overclocks, maybe also automatic ones like from PBO. DO NOT EVER overclock your CPU manually, let alone increase the voltage while doing so. It would fry your motherboard in no time if you did.a

I think that's what I can say to you. Sorry if I sounded rude, I didn't mean it to be like so.
With proper case ventilation his board won't have any issue running a 3600 w PBO.
 
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