Upgrade choices - AMD vs Intel

[jfiges]

Hi all, thanks for reading. I've got a few questions about upgrading my build, but most of it hinges on the processor choice.

TL;DR - should I get a 2700x or an 8700k?

I first built the PC around 5 years ago and have mostly added a new GPU and storage, and OC'd my CPU to 4 giggies. Currently I have essentially this:
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/29grP3

Most of my use for my PC is gaming, streaming both music and video, web browsing and photo editing with lightroom and photoshop. Conceivably I could be doing most of these at the same time, including downloading/installing games. I do have a side interest in 3d modelling and game design and I've got UE4 and blender for these, and I plan on doing more in the future.

My initial thought had been to upgrade my CPU to match the new GPU and upgrade to 16Gb of 3200MHz RAM (that Trident Z is good looking), and had decided on the i7-8700k but the prices have inflated massively whilst I was trying to decide on the right mobo. If only I'd foreseen the supply shortage and bought the processor 3 months ago! In the UK you could get one in the summer for around £300 and now they sit at over £400 in the few places I can even find them. So I've been considering switching to AMD and getting a 2700x, but I'm put off by the fact that the OC would only be around 4.2GHz (and my current is stable at 4GHz) and the single threaded performance would be far inferior for gaming and PS/LR from what I've seen. I think if I plumped for the 8700k at this price I'd be as well getting an 8086k for only £20-40 more, and tbh it's probably a tad excessive.

Are there any other options I've not considered?
Most of the other CPUs I've looked in to don't really offer the performance that I'm looking for at around the £300-350 price range.
Are AMD boards any good?
Is it worth waiting for a few months (keeping an eye on Black Friday deals in the meantime) to see what happens with Intel's supply issues/if AMD vendors drop their prices to take advantage of Intel's current issues?

Thanks for any help/suggestions!

 

[volkgren]

TL;DR - if money is a concern, get the R7 2700X; if money isn't a concern get an i7-8700K, 9700K, or i9-9900K (9th-gen not really available atm). The 8086K is only good if you like the nostalgia of having a limited edition/anniversary CPU. Other than that the 8700K will perform the same when overclocked.

I've been using my R7 2700X for 2-3 weeks now and it's a pretty solid CPU. It would still be faster than your i5-3570K. There are some really good AMD boards inlcuding ASRock Taichi and Asus Crosshair VII.

I'm not a fan of Black Friday because they typically have the biggest sales on things I don't want; ie. the second-rate stuff.

 

[Dugimodo]

The 8700K is a better gaming CPU, but if you really think you will multitask that much the extra cores and threads of the 2700X will be an advantage. I recently build a new PC to replace my 6700K and went with the 2700X on a whim and it games about the same as my 6700K did - but with the CPU largely unused on most of it's cores.

I don't think you'll regret it whichever way you go they are both good choices.

The 8086K is a pointless bit of marketing hype. It only clocks higher than the 8700K at stock on the single core turbo speed and that's never used in practice anyway. If it has any advantage it would be a ptotential for better overclocking if intel has binned them for the better performance and we can't know that for sure.

I will say this at the risk of upsetting AMD fans, the intel is the "safer" choice if you just want hassle free gaming out of the box without too much stress.
Ryzen is more likely to cause you isses. For me for example it took two BIOS upgrades and down clocking my 3200 RAM to 2933 before I could play far cry 5 without it randomly closing on me.

I recommend if you go Ryzen to spend the extra on one of the known to work well RAM kits such as Gskill FlareX DDR4 3200. I thought I'd save $100 on cheaper Gskill sniper RAM (local prices in august where I am) and regret it a little. My PC is now working great but at reduced RAM timings.

 

[jfiges]

volkgren: I very much feel price is an issue, but my priorities here would be photo editing software>gaming>modelling. This tells me the 8700k would be a better choice but I won’t pay the extra 30% - do you think I’d get one in a sale at some point in 2018? Otherwise it’d be the 2700x for me, I guess

 

[jfiges]

Dugimodo: noted re: the 8086, thanks.

The teething problems with getting a 2700x up and running can be avoided by choosing the right board and RAM, as you say. Do you have any experience with how it compares to the 6700 with programs like photoshop and blender?

 

[volkgren]

do you think I’d get one in a sale at some point in 2018?

It's difficult to say really. Rumors are Intel has a 14nm wafer shortage, which has showed an increase in price of Intel CPUs recently.

 

[Dugimodo]

Do you have any experience with how it compares to the 6700 with programs like photoshop and blender?

Sorry no, mainly I'm a gamer and should probably have gone for the 2600X but I wanted the 2700X and had the money.
It does have similar clock speed and double the cores compared to a 6700 though......

I kept changing my mind, but in the end picked AMD to support competition and because I think the wraith prism just looks cool, not the best of reasons to buy a cpu perhaps

 

[volkgren]

I kept changing my mind, but in the end picked AMD to support competition

I literally did the same thing 😀

I also bought the i7-9700K but didn't feel like messing with it; so I sold it on eBay for a profit.

 

[Dugimodo]

I'm also very likely to upgrade the CPU next year if AMD manages to make significant improvements on IPC and clock speed with Zen 2
Something I've never done on an intel platform as there's never been enough improvement between generations and they don't keep backwards compatibility long enough for it to make any sense.

I may even have a fit of common sense and go for a 6 core when I realise I've never needed 8 (yeah right).

Anyway the AMD platform is more likely to have a meaningful upgrade available in it's useful life time, so that's another consideration.

 

[jfiges]

Haha yeah the wraith cooler does look awesome, definitely a point in favour of the 2700x when you consider the intel cpu doesn’t come with a cooler. I do have the hyper 212 already though which I think would be better for OCing and did come with an AM4 conversion kit iirc.

I think really the option to upgrade in 2 years probably isn’t going to be much use to me, it’s a nice thought but realistically the trade in value for the 2700x would be pretty poor I’m assuming and I’d hope to get 3-4 years out of whichever I choose.

 

[smorizio]

if you can wait for the mb and cpu go with the next ryzen cpu. if you cant wait then go with the 8xxx cpu.

 

[coozie7]

Single core performance isn't THAT far off Intel, lower yes but it's not like the FX series where the Blue Team had a commanding lead.
Where AMD falls more seriously short is the OC frequencies: R7 2700X won't go above 4.2GHz, and many won't hit that, while plenty of Intel parts will hit 5.0 GHz fairly consistently-with adequate cooling.


If I were to advise a purchase now, at this instant it would be this ( or something similar ):

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD - Ryzen 7 2700X 3.7GHz 8-Core Processor (£287.99 @ Aria PC)
Motherboard: Asus - PRIME B450M-K Micro ATX AM4 Motherboard (£66.00 @ Aria PC)
Memory: Team - T-Force Vulcan 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£159.59 @ Overclockers.co.uk)
Total: £513.58
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-10-30 18:51 GMT+0000

Swap the MB for one of your choice, the one I picked is OK but you may need more connectivity.
The memory is known good for AMD.

If you can wait, then wait, I see no harm in doing so, because the Intel option is a lot more expensive right now:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700K 3.7GHz 6-Core Processor (£401.99 @ Aria PC)
CPU Cooler: Noctua - NH-D14 65.0 CFM CPU Cooler (£67.28 @ Novatech)
Motherboard: MSI - Z370 PC PRO ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£96.30 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Team - T-Force Vulcan 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory (£159.59 @ Overclockers.co.uk)
Total: £725.16
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-10-30 19:02 GMT+0000

You'll easily be able to use the current 212, I included the big Noctua cooler to allow for good overclocking.

 

[jfiges]

Thanks for the answers so far everyone. I found a second hand 8700 for £250 from a shop that guarantees a refund in 14 days if there’s anything wrong. This would sort my problem of either buying a 2700x now or waiting for the intel. I’ve never bought second hand though, I’d be worried about getting a chip that’s been degraded by OC’ing for a couple of years before I got it

 

[volkgren]

8700 (non-K) doesn't overclock.

 

[1LiquidPC]

I can vouch for both options. I currently have system in sig as well as an X470 "daily driver" based build with 2700X. 16GB 3200 RAM in both and SSD drives for OS. Both setup ideas you are looking at are fantastic choices in my opinion if the budget allows. Both would serve you well in your needs. Modern AMD is MUCH better than previous years, that's for sure. Setup for X470 and 2700X was as simple as Intel was if that's concerning to you. The included cooler is quite nice as well and seems well built, although in my SFF build, I used a bit more compact cooler. 2700X with no CPU OC settings of any kind, other than adjustments made by XMP for memory, will boost all 8 Cores to about 4Ghz sustained under load. I can provide some more info, though not really benchmark related, if needed.

 

[coozie7]

Yep, the non 'K' i7 will not overclock, but that's not really too much of an issue, the stock part isn't exactly slow!
Most likely you won't see any difference between the 2700X and the i7, and, as an advantage you can use a cheaper motherboard and RAM without any performance penalties by going Intel.

So, adding MB/RAM and a decent cooler to the used i7 comes to:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700 3.2GHz 6-Core Processor (Purchased For £0.00)
CPU Cooler: CRYORIG - H7 49.0 CFM CPU Cooler (£38.94 @ CCL Computers)
Motherboard: ASRock - B360M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£64.99 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Corsair - Vengeance LPX 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory (£116.00 @ Box Limited)
Total: £219.93
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-11-03 17:27 GMT+0000

Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about a used part when bought from a shop, anything sold through a retailer is covered by plenty of consumer protection law-even used parts are covered here in the UK.

This is what the build would price out is with a new i7 8700:
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: Intel - Core i7-8700 3.2GHz 6-Core Processor (£329.99 @ Amazon UK)
CPU Cooler: CRYORIG - H7 49.0 CFM CPU Cooler (£38.94 @ CCL Computers)
Motherboard: ASRock - B360M Pro4 Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard (£64.99 @ Amazon UK)
Memory: Corsair - Vengeance LPX 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory (£116.00 @ Box Limited)
Total: £549.92
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2018-11-03 17:36 GMT+0000

Your call.