Jmi20

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It would not seep in to the PCB or the circuits, no. The mechanism that allows it to do that on human skin is the porous membranes of the skin cells. Unless we've segued in to Farscape without my noticing, computers don't have that. If you're desperate, as someone else pointed out, you can use soap and water (I advise Dawn out of personal preference), but you do need to either thoroughly dry it with canned air or wait a few days for it to dry completely, or you short it the f- out. And once it's been properly cleaned and dried, there should be no lasting harm to it. If you have a back up machine you can use, that would actually be a good idea, though. For the sake of being paranoid.
this is sound advice, but using anything other than distilled water would leave........ you guessed it, "residue"

Of course I acknowledge it. I paid attention in high school science class. And, since the big box manufacturer I worked at explicitly told customers that were hospitals that this was the prefered material for cleaning anything you care to name (with varying degrees of "wait for it to evaporate, or you'll either short your computer or set it on fire") for literally that reason, I've plenty or reason over the last two and a half decades to presume this to be true.
The main reason for it being used is because 99% pure isopropyl alcohol leaves zero residue, and lower percentages leave less residue than any other material you care to name.
I believe this is where all our misunderstandings stem. We aren't even clarifying what type of alcohol we are talking about. we must all not be on the same page.

which alcohol is "the prefered material for cleaning..."? i'm assuming it's 70%?
just like the previous person you replied to, what alcohol were they talking about? it's such a broad term.

I think MOST rubbing alcohol you could buy leave some sort of residue. Thats why with a lot rubbing alcohols you get a sticky feeling in your hand, cause most of them add a moisturizer of sorts. Else your hands would be very dry.
but who knows if isopropyl truly wont leave any residue...
the exact types of alcohol im talking about are 70 iso and ethyl. Most small bottles of rubbing, consumer grade alcohol, where i'm at, contain some type of fragrance or perfume... which, by my definition, contains "residue". so i believe its just proper to say that a lot of these consumer grade alcohols contain some sort of "residue"... because in my case, they do.

of course obviously 99 purity isopropyl alcohol will not leave any residue.

but would it matter though? we're building pc's here not F-22 Raptor's... I'd bet you $100 that somebody else in the world would be using a 70% iso with "moisturizer" and have no problems at all...

plus, here we are confusing OP even more by suggesting the use of erasers, toothpaste, electric contact cleaner, soap and water... i'm thinking a mod should just lock this thread lol.
 
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the exact types of alcohol im talking about are 70 iso and ethyl. Most small bottles of rubbing, consumer grade alcohol, where i'm at, contain some type of fragrance or perfume... which, by my definition, contains "residue". so i believe its just proper to say that a lot of these consumer grade alcohols contain some sort of "residue"... because in my case, they do.
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Not disagreeing with anything, just want to make some things (I hope) a tad bit clearer...

Rubbing alcohol is different from medical grade alcohol in that it has some sort of moisturizer or lubricant that can leave a residue when it dries. You can get medical grade alcohol in (probably) most any solution percentage, maybe as low as 50% up to 90%, and for what we're doing any would be good enough (I use just a plain paper towel to remove thermal compound, so what's that...0%?).

Isopropyl is preferred, although Ethyl alcohol is OK if you know it's pure. The problem with Ethyl is it often comes with an adulterant or denaturant so people can't drink it, since pure ethyl alcohol is the same stuff that's in Vodka and used to make gin.

Look on the label, read the fine print in back it should tell you all of the ingredients. Whatever they put in the alcohol, whether its denatured ethyl or rubbing alcohol or hand sanitizer, it may be perfectly safe. But you don't know so while nobody may have run any extensive tests that doesn't mean it's known safe either.

But one thing you should realize is a moisturizer does what it does to feel 'moist' on your skin by attracting moisture from the air; it's hygroscopic. Moisture getting trapped and retained in the tiny gap between heatsink and CPU is not a good thing. As far as I'm concerned, it's just better to avoid it altogether.
 
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jelardz2000

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Not disagreeing with anything, just want to make some things (I hope) a tad bit clearer...

Rubbing alcohol is different from medical grade alcohol in that it has some sort of moisturizer or lubricant that can leave a residue when it dries. You can get medical grade alcohol in (probably) most any solution percentage, maybe as low as 50% up to 90%, and for what we're doing any would be good enough (I use just a plain paper towel to remove thermal compound, so what's that...0%?).

Isopropyl is preferred, although Ethyl alcohol is OK if you know it's pure. The problem with Ethyl is it often comes with an adulterant or denaturant so people can't drink it, since pure ethyl alcohol is the same stuff that's in Vodka and used to make gin.

Look on the label, read the fine print in back it should tell you all of the ingredients. Whatever they put in the alcohol, whether its denatured ethyl or rubbing alcohol or hand sanitizer, it may be perfectly safe. But you don't know so while nobody may have run any extensive tests that doesn't mean it's known safe either.

But one thing you should realize is a moisturizer does what it does to feel 'moist' on your skin by attracting moisture from the air; it's hygroscopic. Moisture getting trapped and retained in the tiny gap between heatsink and CPU is not a good thing. As far as I'm concerned, it's just better to avoid it altogether.

I'm really just scared of what this guy said

Under pressure, the paste will only be a few microns thick, so any oils (or moisturizers) or other contaminates like dusts or tissue fibers, can create thermal barriers which result in 'hot spots' which if not at one of the thermal readers will not be registered by them, so go totally unnoticed by you temp reporting software. You can fry several thousand transistors in a matter of less than a minute, permanently, and never be the wiser.
This makes me want to hurry more to do the clean because yea I might have nice temps but I would never know if there are air gaps or something. Also when I clean should I leave the bottom part of the CPU alone? Because I remember using alcohol there to clean some thermal paste marks but thankfully I didn't use it on the pins. Just one site around the pins. Should I just leave it alone and clean IHS and PCB surrounding it?
 
I'm really just scared of what this guy said



This makes me want to hurry more to do the clean because yea I might have nice temps but I would never know if there are air gaps or something. Also when I clean should I leave the bottom part of the CPU alone? Because I remember using alcohol there to clean some thermal paste marks but thankfully I didn't use it on the pins. Just one site around the pins. Should I just leave it alone and clean IHS and PCB surrounding it?
ecause yea I might have nice temps but I would never know if there are air gaps or something. Also when I clean should I leave the bottom part of the CPU alone? Because I remember using alcohol there to clean some thermal paste marks but thankfully I didn't use it on the pins. Just one site around the pins. Should I just leave it alone and clean IHS and PCB surrounding it?
I assume you want to change it because of using hand sanitizer initially? Just clean the thermal compound off the IHS and heatsink bottom and reapply it. Use medical grade isopropyl alcohol...70%, 90%, 99% it DOES NOT MATTER.

Or use nothing; just a plain, clean paper towel. By the time you wipe off the thermal paste so little moisturizer will remain it will be irrelevant. You're not working in a class 10,000 clean room...not even a class 100. You'll leave a layer of dead skin cells more voluminous than any remaining moisturizer. You'll be fine.

DO NOT BOTHER cleaning the bottom of the CPU or any of the surrounding PWB. It's not worth it as the possibility of doing mechanical damage to delicate parts far outweighs the potential of the moisturizer doing harm. The pins of the CPU and contacts on the socket are gold plated for a reason: noble metals are highly resistant to corrosion. The board (pwb) is fiberglass with a painted top coating. It's protected.
 
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jelardz2000

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I assume you want to change it because of using hand sanitizer initially? Just clean the thermal compound off the IHS and heatsink bottom and reapply it. Use medical grade isopropyl alcohol...70%, 90%, 99% it DOES NOT MATTER.

Or use nothing; just a plain, clean paper towel. By the time you wipe off the thermal paste so little moisturizer will remain it will be irrelevant. You're not working in a class 10,000 clean room...not even a class 100. You'll leave a layer of dead skin cells more voluminous than any remaining moisturizer. You'll be fine.

DO NOT BOTHER cleaning the bottom of the CPU or any of the surrounding PWB. It's not worth it as the possibility of doing mechanical damage to delicate parts far outweighs the potential of the moisturizer doing harm. The pins of the CPU and contacts on the socket are gold plated for a reason: noble metals are highly resistant to corrosion. The board (pwb) is fiberglass with a painted top coating. It's protected.
Thanks, will really just clean the top part and not touch the bottom or even take It out of the socket. But I have cleaned the bottom part with tissue and q tips to remove thermal paste in the first place. Was that harmless?
 
...But I have cleaned the bottom part with tissue and q tips to remove thermal paste in the first place. Was that harmless?
As I said, the pins and socket contacts are gold plated so they are not going to be affected by whatever moisturizer was left. The greater possible harm would be bending a pin, or worse breaking one, as they are fairly fragile. That would have been done in the instant so if it's worked after there's no reason to think anything will go bad in the future.
 
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jelardz2000

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As I said, the pins and socket contacts are gold plated so they are not going to be affected by whatever moisturizer was left. The greater possible harm would be bending a pin, or worse breaking one, as they are fairly fragile. That would have been done in the instant so if it's worked after there's no reason to think anything will go bad in the future.
I'm confident I didn't touch the pins just the outside. Thanks for your advice/help I'll clean it by the end of the month and use it in the meantime and I hope it lasts long (longevity is more important to me)
 

jelardz2000

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It will last far longer than it's usefulness, that's the way of computer systems and CPU's in particular.
Sorry to revive this but when I took the cooler off to clean the CPU, I noticed one Vrm capacitor that had scratches/dents in it that the CPU heatsink mount thing might have put pressure on since it's so close. How may the damage be?
 

jelardz2000

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This isn't yours?

Well...if this is the standard and it's actually worse (more capacitors than yours) then I'd say it's OK as the scratches appear just cosmetic. Only if the metal can is punctured or the capacitor body is dis-located enough that it's obvious a lead is pulled loose would I be worried.
Idk kind of looks dented in the picture. I've yet to test it and I'm kind of scared to.
 
Il try to get an update picture when i re arrange my cooler fans.
One thing to settle your mind....

Those caps are the output filter caps for the VRM, there are a lot of them all stacked up in a row and that makes them somewhat redundant. So if one or two were damaged to the point of failure you'd get one of two results: completely shorted, or completely opened. If shorted the VRM would fault and your system would not start up. But it has started up so that's obviously not the case. Also, damage bad enough to cause the cap to short would be very noticeable, to the point even you'd have no doubt it's severe enough to warrant repair.

If opened (or capacitor value shifted) then the VRM voltage output would be somewhat less stable, possibly resulting in system instability especially at extremely heavy processing loads. But being redundant (with so many in the circuit) you may never experience that problem as the remaining caps can do it well enough.
 
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jelardz2000

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One thing to settle your mind....

Those caps are the output filter caps for the VRM, there are a lot of them all stacked up in a row and that makes them somewhat redundant. So if one or two were damaged to the point of failure you'd get one of two results: completely shorted, or completely opened. If shorted the VRM would fault and your system would not start up. But it has started up so that's obviously not the case. Also, damage bad enough to cause the cap to short would be very noticeable, to the point even you'd have no doubt it's severe enough to warrant repair.

If opened (or capacitor value shifted) then the VRM voltage output would be somewhat less stable, possibly resulting in system instability especially at extremely heavy processing loads. But being redundant (with so many in the circuit) you may never experience that problem as the remaining caps can do it well enough.
Thank you very much for the informative reply on helping noobies like me.

I wish you all the fortunes in life for taking your time helping this community and other noobs out there
 

jelardz2000

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One thing to settle your mind....

Those caps are the output filter caps for the VRM, there are a lot of them all stacked up in a row and that makes them somewhat redundant. So if one or two were damaged to the point of failure you'd get one of two results: completely shorted, or completely opened. If shorted the VRM would fault and your system would not start up. But it has started up so that's obviously not the case. Also, damage bad enough to cause the cap to short would be very noticeable, to the point even you'd have no doubt it's severe enough to warrant repair.

If opened (or capacitor value shifted) then the VRM voltage output would be somewhat less stable, possibly resulting in system instability especially at extremely heavy processing loads. But being redundant (with so many in the circuit) you may never experience that problem as the remaining caps can do it well enough.
Also can it take down other components with it if it shorts out or fails?
 
Also can it take down other components with it if it shorts out or fails?
If it shorts out? yes of course..it could damage VRM components which in turn could damage CPU and even PSU. You'd probably have heard a loud fizzling pop (as it basically explodes underneath the cooler) and then nothing when you turned power on. That's also pretty extreme and, as I said, if your board looks anything like that picture not the case.

The damaged cap would need to mashed and punctured pretty badly, so badly that you'd have had to almost purposely mashed the cooler into it and you'd know it. It would be very obvious when you look at it.
 
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jelardz2000

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If it shorts out? yes of course..it could damage VRM components which in turn could damage CPU and even PSU. You'd probably have heard a loud fizzling pop (as it basically explodes underneath the cooler) and then nothing when you turned power on. That's also pretty extreme and, as I said, if your board looks anything like that picture not the case.

The damaged cap would need to mashed and punctured pretty badly, so badly that you'd have had to almost purposely mashed the cooler into it and you'd know it. It would be very obvious when you look at it.
Hey so quick update. here is a pic of my cpu mount to show you how it got damaged in the first place.
and I have encountered another issue.



The Damage might not be visible but that's good.

Another problem I encountered with long use of my machine, is overheating.
i get 50-59 at idle and 80 degrees max at heavy gaming. though my room temperature is like a sauna from where I live
so that may be another factor.
I don't know what causes this and I am told that these Temps are normal for Zen 2 cpu's and it cant be the capacitors fault right?

i used HWINFO64 to monitor temps and my cooler is a cryorig M9 plus.
I've seen at a thread that stock voltages of zen 2 which is 1.46v are pretty excessive and i am considering undervolting to reduce temps
whats your opinion on this?
 
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Another problem I encountered with long use of my machine, is overheating.
i get 50-59 at idle and 80 degrees max at heavy gaming. though my room temperature is like a sauna from where I live
so that may be another factor.
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You should take new questions to another thread and be sure to include your system configuration: motherboard, CPU, CPU cooler, case and fan arrangement at least.

In general, those temps are not remarkable for Ryzen CPU's as they Tjmax at 95C (90C for 5800/5900/5950). And while they might can be improved upon, if room temp is high then system temps just get hotter right along with it. Open the new thread with the info above included to get help with improving cooling.
 
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jelardz2000

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You should take new questions to another thread and be sure to include your system configuration: motherboard, CPU, CPU cooler, case and fan arrangement at least.

In general, those temps are not remarkable for Ryzen CPU's as they Tjmax at 95C (90C for 5800/5900/5950). And while they might can be improved upon, if room temp is high then system temps just get hotter right along with it. Open the new thread with the info above included to get help with improving cooling.
Yes I need to let this thread die that's all really my paranoia is sorta over. Thank you again for all the help and this will be the last from this thread I promise.
 
For the overheating, you can try setting all your fans to 100% and see if that helps. Most computer fan controls are designed for AC home/office environments so I've found that the fans won't ramp up properly for systems in an otherwise 'sauna' as you called it, lol. I've actually had one system die when the fan didn't ramp up, so now I always floor my high heat exposed systems and it keeps them cool.

If setting all the fans to 100% doesn't help, you might have more than just scratching from those capacitors and they may be preventing the cooler from mounting properly and I would change to another cooler.
 

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