Wait for 9th generation intel CPU?

[Stankenestor]

So im planning on building my new PC sometime this year. Im currently waiting for the nvidia RTX graphics cards benchmarks and will either buy a RTX 2080 or 2070. I also need a new CPU to match my GPU. Since im waiting for the graphics cards, i thought i might as well wait for the next gen intel CPU's which are rumored to launch later this fall. If i understand this correctly, it's the coffee lake refresh that im waiting for right?

So does this seem like a good plan?

 

[SgtScream]

Yes - very good plan. What system do you have now?

 

[feelinfroggy777]

I agree with SgtScream, you have a good plan.

 

[Stankenestor]

Yes - very good plan. What system do you have now?

Specs:
Intel i5-4670K
8gb ddr3 ram
970 gtx
650W power supply
asus z87-a motherboard

 

[SgtScream]

Yeah you can definitely and should definitely wait for the 9th gen and 2000 series cards. You have a 4th gen build and most likely just need a 16gb memory kit upgrade if you're having any performance issues. Just be prepared to purchase a solid 1440p gsync monitor for your new build, because it will be way too much horsepower for 1080p.

 

[feelinfroggy777]

Honestly, unless you are doing more than gaming, you could save some money and just get a used i7 4790k and 8gb more of DDR3 RAM. For gaming, the performance difference between the 4790k and the 6700/7700/8700/9700 CPUs will be minimal. If you are gonna game at 1440p and 4k, the performance gap will be even smaller as when resolution is increased, the bottleneck moves from the CPU to the GPU.

The 4790k is still a very good CPU for gaming and will meet or exceed the recommended CPU requirements for just about every game on the market. The only benefit the 9th gen will have is additional cores and the way games are made today, there it little value in going above the 8 threads on the 4790k.

Then maybe next year I would look at AMD's 7nm 2nd gen Ryzen CPUs or Intel's 10nm CPUs where we should see some IPC and process improvements that should give a much bigger bump in performance.

 

[Stankenestor]

Honestly, unless you are doing more than gaming, you could save some money and just get a used i7 4790k and 8gb more of DDR3 RAM. For gaming, the performance difference between the 4790k and the 6700/7700/8700/9700 CPUs will be minimal. If you are gonna game at 1440p and 4k, the performance gap will be even smaller as when resolution is increased, the bottleneck moves from the CPU to the GPU.

The 4790k is still a very good CPU for gaming and will meet or exceed the recommended CPU requirements for just about every game on the market. The only benefit the 9th gen will have is additional cores and the way games are made today, there it little value in going above the 8 threads on the 4790k.

Then maybe next year I would look at AMD's 7nm 2nd gen Ryzen CPUs or Intel's 10nm CPUs where we should see some IPC and process improvements that should give a much bigger bump in performance.

Well i guess im in a rough spot in terms of getting a high end processor right now since there are 10nm cpus coming next year, but i cant wait til then. Also i want better ram (ddr4 and higher speeds) since some games really like ram

 

[Stankenestor]

Yeah you can definitely and should definitely wait for the 9th gen and 2000 series cards. You have a 4th gen build and most likely just need a 16gb memory kit upgrade if you're having any performance issues. Just be prepared to purchase a solid 1440p gsync monitor for your new build, because it will be way too much horsepower for 1080p.

So do you happen to know some nice parts that will be good with the 9th gen intel cpu and an rtx card? I need a new mobo and ddr4 memory and perhaps a cooler. I only game on this machine and will overclock it to a stable 24/7 OC. Hoping this system will last me a while too before upgrading.

Also in terms of a new monitor i wll be getting one as well. I heard 144hz 1440p monitors are nicer to have than 4k monitors atm, why is that? also i've been reading about freesync, adaptive sync and gsync, what should i be aiming for and what are the differences?

 

[mdd1963]

8700K kicks butt now, 9900K (out in a month or two?) should easily 'rock-on' for 3-5 years..or more!

 

[feelinfroggy777]

Honestly, unless you are doing more than gaming, you could save some money and just get a used i7 4790k and 8gb more of DDR3 RAM. For gaming, the performance difference between the 4790k and the 6700/7700/8700/9700 CPUs will be minimal. If you are gonna game at 1440p and 4k, the performance gap will be even smaller as when resolution is increased, the bottleneck moves from the CPU to the GPU.

The 4790k is still a very good CPU for gaming and will meet or exceed the recommended CPU requirements for just about every game on the market. The only benefit the 9th gen will have is additional cores and the way games are made today, there it little value in going above the 8 threads on the 4790k.

Then maybe next year I would look at AMD's 7nm 2nd gen Ryzen CPUs or Intel's 10nm CPUs where we should see some IPC and process improvements that should give a much bigger bump in performance.

Well i guess im in a rough spot in terms of getting a high end processor right now since there are 10nm cpus coming next year, but i cant wait til then. Also i want better ram (ddr4 and higher speeds) since some games really like ram

The performance difference in gaming from RAM speeds between DDR3 and DDR4 are negligible. For AMD's Ryzen CPUs, they scale well with higher speed RAM due to their architecture. But Intel CPUs, not so much.

If you are just dying to upgrade, then go for it. But just know, that on average you are only looking at a 10-15% improvement over a 4790k for a substantially more cost, and that is only in CPU heavy games. If you are gaming at 1440p/4k, it will be less than 10% better fps in games. So if you want to spend $500-$700 for up to 15% improvement, then go for it. But if it were me, I would buy a used 4790k and use the $500 or so that I saved and get a really nice 1440p or 4k monitor.

 

[SgtScream]

Yeah you can definitely and should definitely wait for the 9th gen and 2000 series cards. You have a 4th gen build and most likely just need a 16gb memory kit upgrade if you're having any performance issues. Just be prepared to purchase a solid 1440p gsync monitor for your new build, because it will be way too much horsepower for 1080p.

So do you happen to know some nice parts that will be good with the 9th gen intel cpu and an rtx card? I need a new mobo and ddr4 memory and perhaps a cooler. I only game on this machine and will overclock it to a stable 24/7 OC. Hoping this system will last me a while too before upgrading.

Also in terms of a new monitor i wll be getting one as well. I heard 144hz 1440p monitors are nicer to have than 4k monitors atm, why is that? also i've been reading about freesync, adaptive sync and gsync, what should i be aiming for and what are the differences?

Go 1440p if you want your system to have better longevity before an upgrade is needed. 4k is very graphically demanding and will result in frequent GPU upgrades. As for the 9th gen Intel chips and RTX Cards, I cannot give you advise on hardware that hasn't yet been released. If you're going with an 9th gen i7 or i9 you'll definitely want to pair it with a NVidia 2000 series GPU (GTX 1080TI at the very lease) and a 1440p gsync monitor.

 

[larrycumming]

Well, going from 4790K to 9900K is a substantial upgrade in my book. You're looking at 4C/8T vs 8C/16T. That's almost like rolling two computing into one.

On top of that, 9900K is a better chip thermally and should be able to reach 5.0GHz without heavy tripled fanned radiators.

*-4790Ks have integrated FIVR but without soldered TIM (of Haswell-E's), so they do get heated up quickly

 

[feelinfroggy777]

Pc games don’t use 8C/16T. Pc games really only use a few threads. This is why there is very little difference between the 8700k (6C/12T) and the 7700k (4/8).

Those extra cores and threads just sit idle doing nothing. So unless you are using software that can use those extra threads then you are just spending more money on threads that you won’t use.

So by all means, spend the $500 on the 9900k, $200 on the z370 mobo, and another $150 on DDR4 RAM to upgrade to at 9900k platform for a total of $850. Or you could get a 4790 used for $200 for 10% difference in performance.

To me, 10% bump in performance is not worth an extra $650.

 

[larrycumming]

presently most of them don't but its fairly reasonably to expect in a year's time games will take more and more thread counts in to optimization schemes, i'm already seeing that happening with my recent pubg updates (hope that's not my illusion). the gaming industry generally follows hardware trends and this time intel is taking the lead (with amd pushing its envelopes).

the soft pros learn to work with what they get not the other way around

 

[SgtScream]

I'm pretty much going to have to build a new computer because of these two reasons:
1. The 9th gen chips will be soldered.
2. 8 core 16 threads i9 baby!
The last time I bought an intel chip was sandy bridge and coincidentally was the last gen chip to be soldered up until now. My plan is to build in the Skyreach 4 mini:
http://nfc-systems.com/skyreach-4-mini/
Hopefully i'll be able to run a power efficient GTX 2060 and a locked i9 (for lower wattage) and to be able to run off a power board with ac adapter. Just think of how much power will be in the little case. Hopefully that pair of components will be power efficient enough to not generate a lot of heat.

 

[J_E_D_70]

This is a sample size of 1... but coming from a 3570k@4.3 to the 8700k I gained 20-30 fps (depending on map) in BF1 with same gpu. In my case the plaform upgrade was 25-30% increase at 1440p.

 

[feelinfroggy777]

presently most of them don't but its fairly reasonably to expect in a year's time games will take more and more thread counts in to optimization schemes

It takes years to develop a game. The games that are released next year began development in 2013 when high core count CPUs were not even close to mainstream. 8 threads will be enough for games for the next several years. It will take that long for game developers to catch up. Quad core CPUs have been maintstream for a decade and only in the last couple years do they take advantage of them. Consoles drive game development, this is where they make their money. Consoles use 8 thread CPUs. Until a console is released with more than 8 threads, 8 threads will be enough.

The 9th gen chips will be soldered

Yeah, I am excited about that one too! And if I was rocking a Sandy Bridge, I would upgrade too, but Hasewell is about 10% behind the last 3 generations of Intel CPUs.

but coming from a 3570k@4.3 to the 8700k I gained 20-30 fps

Yeah, you will see a big jump from the 3570, because the 3570 only has 4 threads. BF1 needs a CPU with 8 threads.

 

[larrycumming]

Well, game programmers typically code the game first and do further optimizations later (sometimes after official release) for obvious reasons. It's no uncommon to release updates with better optimization schemes for long running titles such as PUBG CS:GO etc.

 

[Stankenestor]

I like the idea of buying a used processor to save money. One of my favorite games atm is Fallout 4 which is suprisingly cpu intensive and also ram intensive (to a certain threshold). I plan to mod the game alot and also Skyrim SE which use almost the same engine. Of course im not buying a new beast system just for those two games but it would be really nice to get 16 gb 2666 DDR4 ram (you cant go that high on ddr3) along with a nice CPU that wont bottleneck a RTX 2080 or 1080 ti.

So what used CPU could i buy on 1151 socket in terms of getting the best value?

 

[SgtScream]

I like the idea of buying a used processor to save money. One of my favorite games atm is Fallout 4 which is suprisingly cpu intensive and also ram intensive (to a certain threshold). I plan to mod the game alot and also Skyrim SE which use almost the same engine. Of course im not buying a new beast system just for those two games but it would be really nice to get 16 gb 2666 DDR4 ram (you cant go that high on ddr3) along with a nice CPU that wont bottleneck a RTX 2080 or 1080 ti.

So what used CPU could i buy on 1151 socket in terms of getting the best value?

i7 7700k. It's essentially an 8700k but with four less threads.

 

[feelinfroggy777]

I like the idea of buying a used processor to save money. One of my favorite games atm is Fallout 4 which is suprisingly cpu intensive and also ram intensive (to a certain threshold). I plan to mod the game alot and also Skyrim SE which use almost the same engine. Of course im not buying a new beast system just for those two games but it would be really nice to get 16 gb 2666 DDR4 ram (you cant go that high on ddr3) along with a nice CPU that wont bottleneck a RTX 2080 or 1080 ti.

So what used CPU could i buy on 1151 socket in terms of getting the best value?

I don't think I would move to a 7700k. It is a good CPU, but that platform is dead. If you want to upgrade the platform, then you should go with a 8th gen Intel CPU, a 9th gen Intel CPU, or an AMD Ryzen 2xxx series CPU. You may be able to save a little bit by finding a 7700k used, but not that much. The 8700k has 2 more cores and 4 more threads and the MSRP is the same as the 7700k. It is really not a good idea.

The main reason I would stay in Hasewll is you can avoid paying for new RAM and motherboard and take a minimal performance hit. But if you are going to by new RAM and a mobo, then you should by the current Intel or AMD CPUs.

 

[larrycumming]

I like the idea of buying a used processor to save money. One of my favorite games atm is Fallout 4 which is suprisingly cpu intensive and also ram intensive (to a certain threshold). I plan to mod the game alot and also Skyrim SE which use almost the same engine. Of course im not buying a new beast system just for those two games but it would be really nice to get 16 gb 2666 DDR4 ram (you cant go that high on ddr3) along with a nice CPU that wont bottleneck a RTX 2080 or 1080 ti.

So what used CPU could i buy on 1151 socket in terms of getting the best value?

I wouldn't upgrade to kabylake from haswell.

if you're spending the money on motherboard cpu and ram, and want to pick up something used, as an upgrade from haswell, I would wait for used coffeelake.

 

[mdd1963]

It's hard to imagine an onslaught of misguided folks trading in their 4-6 month old 8700K rigs for 50 cents on the dollar for a 1.5 fps increase under a 9700K/9900K, but, anything is possible I guess...

 

[SgtScream]

It's hard to imagine an onslaught of misguided folks trading in their 4-6 month old 8700K rigs for 50 cents on the dollar for a 1.5 fps increase under a 9700K/9900K, but, anything is possible I guess...

You know there's people out there that will do it.

 

[larrycumming]

there certainly will. but it's more like 80 cents on the dollar.

even 4-5 year old cpu/mobo's can fetch 50 cents on the dollar these days, they retain value pretty well