water cooling construction

[PhoenixKnights]

As I'm about to create my own water cooling system I have some thoughts about construction.... 1 or 2 pumps and what order to place the parts?

the 1 or 2 pumps thought I bring up for 2 reasons, I was thinking that if you find a good cheap pump then why not buy two of them as some water cooling systems (such as the koolance system) uses 2 pumps. The thoughts of using 2 are as follows, with 2 perhaps you could get a higher head (the amount of water the pump can push through at a given height (relevant because turns in the flow such as through a radiator simulate this) and also it may be more reliable in case one of the pumps die at least you still have one left. So I wondered if anyone had thought about that and had done anything to experiment with that idea and see if it effects anything.

Secondly the order do you go Pump > radiator > water block(s) > reservoir > pump? or Pump > Water block(s) > radiator > Reservoir > pump? or any other order you can think of? I was thinking that I'd put the radiator right before the water block as even though it may slow down the water flow some, it really shouldn't be that much because it's pretty much a pressurized system and how much water gets pushed in shouldn't change too much in theory (but I never went through physics so I could easily be wrong) and I think you want the water to be as cool as it can before it reaches the water block and if you send it directly from the pump to the water block you may see some of the pump's temperature transfered to the water block.

Well those are my thoughts of the night and I would love to hear any opinions or thought on those thoughts from you experienced water cooling people.

 

[svol]

I think two pumps in serie is asking for problems... the only reason for two pumps is if you put the radiator and the waterblocks on different pumps.

Most times the radiator is placed after all waterblocks so the water is cooled down once it hits the resevor again... this means no resevor heat-up and still cool water. IMHO it is the best way to install the radiator.

As for the pump temp... it is often about a douzen of watts which is given to the water surrounding it in the resevoir or the air surrounding it outside the resevoir... it wont heat up the water pumped inside the tubes.

I love my Delta 60HP 7000 RPM fan that puts out more dB then CFM

 

[PhoenixKnights]

Well I was accually rethinking of my pump idea and thought I might get a via aqua 1300 or since they are pretty cheap I was thinking about getting 2 and building my system this way = reservoir > pump 1 > Radiator > cpu block > pump 2 > reservoir.

I was thinking the via Aqua pumps should be before the radiator because they are pretty warm at about 50 degrees C and I wouldn't want any of that heat going to the processor when it's perfectly able to make more than enough heat on it's own. I was accually also concidering putting a smaller radiator between the pump and the reservoir just to keep the returning water cooler. What do you think?

 

[LtBlue14]

what's your first heatercore? why not just get one good one instead of two? i'm thinking the flow resistance won't be worth the slightly lower water temperature. as for the two pumps, it would be great if you could do that with a waterblock that has high flow resistance, like cathar's whitewater. i think they're selling them at d-tek customs now for like $50, whereas they used to be $110. otherwise, on your average medium or low-flow block, you won't see a whole lot of improvement from increased flowrate, i'd say a degree or two

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[svol]

But it wont increase waterflow... jsut make on of your pumps go bad really soon because of to much (back)pressure.

And why not get a good but cool pump? Like the Sicce Nova and Idra?

I love my Delta 60HP 7000 RPM fan that puts out more dB then CFM

 

[PhoenixKnights]

because I want a good CHEAP pump. I already spent 1000 on the computer parts from the motherboard, processor, video card etc. and I don't know much about pumps but I think that would increase waterflow, because the water comming out of it has to come from someplace so I figgure it's going to help water flow by sucking so to speak on the water flow comming from the water block.

I'm thinking I'll go with the swiftech MCW5000-P water block, because I looked at a review of water blocks and swiftech is one of the best for waterblocks from what I saw, and that wasn't even including the MCW5000 because it hadn't been produced yet, so I figgure since it's supposed to be better (even if only marginally better) than the other swiftech blocks.

And I was thinking about 2 radiators if I was going to do 2 pumps or maybe even if not, I'd use them to cool down the water going into the cpu, and then to cool down the water comming from the CPU. One of the radiators (if I did use 2) would be much smaller comparatively like half the size or less.

in my mind the current construction plan is either going to be reservoir > pump > radiator (small one) > waterblock > radiator > reservoir

or I'd insert a second pump right before the second radiator
(right between the water block and radiator)

 

[PhoenixKnights]

also, I forgot to mention a couple things, first of all I'm thinking that as a pump instead of the via I'm going to go with the Hydor L30 because of it's better head and cooler running. secondly I'm going to use a heater core from a vehicle, I'm not sure which one just yet, still debating between going to ebay for it or going to my local pick and pull and yanking one out of a dead car, of course if I yanked it out I'd try to get a newer car than if I got it off of ebay. But newer is better I feel

 

[svol]

Sicce pumps are pretty cheap.

Anyway normal pumps are not ment to work under pressure... so adding more pumps will create pressure on the pump increasing the change it fails. It also wont increase waterflow as the waterflow is determined by the tubing system: the smallest spot determines how much water can go through.

I got a 1300 l/h pump set to its max... but it pushes less then 700 l/h. Why? Because my system can't flow more water through it unless it is under pressure which can't be done by normal aquarium-like pumps.

As for a new radiator being better... if they both dopn't leak and aren't dirty it doesn't matter anything. The technology behind radiators didn't improve anything the last decades.

I love my Delta 60HP 7000 RPM fan that puts out more dB then CFM

 

[PhoenixKnights]

Well I think that you are right with doing only 1 pump instead of 2, as long as I can get a pump with enough head and the Hydor has the highest head of the pumps I have been looking at. so what order should I go with? reservoir > pump > radiator > waterblock > reservoir?

Or reservoir > pump > waterblock > radiator > reservoir?

The first has the advantage of cooling the water right before it gets to the cpu, the second has the advantage of possibly more pressure going through the water block which will be greater possibly, however since it's going to be a fairly powerful pump I do worry a bit about it being too much water pressure on the cpu? it also would keep the reservoir cooler possibly. What do you think?

 

[LtBlue14]

the danner mag 3 is the pump with the highest head that i've seen. 10.5 ft, 350gph
<A HREF="http://www.pet-expo.com/cgi-bin/fullpres.exe?PARTNUM=EUD2519" target="_new">here for $44+ship</A> but you could probably shop around and find cheaper

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[PhoenixKnights]

should I be worried about having too much head? to much pressure causing the hoses to come off of any of the parts? The parts I'm going to use are:

MCW5000-P Swiftech water block (seems to be one of the best out there but I'm open to suggestions)

1/2" tubing I forget the letters to describe the tubing type though.

Car heaterblock as the radiator, not sure what it will be just yet although I'm wondering how I can attach the hoses to it guess I'll find out when I get it

Either the Hydor pump or the pump you just described depending on reviews of it, it's price, and if you guys think with the above parts it will be a good thing to have that much pressure.

Then I think I'll do the error 911 thing and make my own reservoir out of some tuperware.

What concerns should I have about building it with these parts? also would you think that getting some silicone would be a good idea and putting it on all the different places the hoses connect?

 

[PhoenixKnights]

2 more concerns while I'm at it, a friend of mine that's a computer guy who hasn't built any water cooling but has built aquairums voiced an opinion that I might have to worry about alge, just wondered is that even a concern or does wetter water(something I'm planning on adding) prevent that?

Also, how hard is it usually to create the water tight seals when building the system from the parts I have listed above?

Thanks for all your input so far guys I appretiate it.

 

[svol]

Waterwetter prevents the grow of alges, bacterias, etc etc etc.

I love my Delta 60HP 7000 RPM fan that puts out more dB then CFM

 

[PhoenixKnights]

Ok and do I have to worry about too much pressure in the system if I got that mag drive 3 for instance? And in your guys's opinions how hard is it to ensure a water tight seal?

Should I grab some hoses off the net with my water block? or should I go to a pet store for tubing and adaptors etc?

Should I have any concerns about the construction? or anything I should watch out for while constructing it? After all I wouldn't want to construct it in a way that would not take pressure or would leak easily

 

[LtBlue14]

i've never heard of any problems with the mag3 having too much head...or any pump, really. you'll find that the hoses fit quite snugly on the waterblocks. you ought to use metal screw clamps to hold the hoses on though, just in case. (actually, i don't know if you can use hose clamps with the swiftech block...i've never used one). you can use any hose you like - just look for stuff that isn't prone to kinking. <A HREF="http://www.dangerden.com/mall/Misc_Hardware/tubing.asp" target="_new">this page</A> has two types of tubing that are popular - clearflex tubing and tygon tubing.

finally, you want to put your system together outside of the computer, over some white sheets or something that will show a leak. run it for as long as you feel comfortable (a few hours if you're impatient and want to get that thing in the computer, or a full day if you're less anxious)

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[PhoenixKnights]

Man LtBlue you are like a walking pricewatch thanks for the info. Any links for 1/2 od to 1/2 id barbs and stuff? perferably some good quality stuff. Such as perhaps the swiftech 1/2 od stem to 1/2 id tube? I'm still not sure how to describe all these things but I mean the things I plug into a mcw5000 to turn it into something I slide a tube over instead of into if you know what I mean

Also a place to get some of those hose clamps? the only ones I can think of are the ones you use in cars and they may be a bit too big to use.

 

[LtBlue14]

hmm, <A HREF="http://www.cooltechnica.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=JG-PI1251616S&Category_Code=TAF" target="_new">here's your 1/2" ID to 1/2" OD connector</A> (two of them, actually), and you can get hose clamps at any local hardware store, but if you don't feel like looking, the 1/2-29/32" clamps <A HREF="http://www.plumbingworld.com/clamps.html" target="_new">here</A> are what you're lookin for. Anything that'll go around your 3/4" OD tubing

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[PhoenixKnights]

Cool thanks again man, any chance I can bookmark you?

 

[LtBlue14]

lol

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[FallOutBoyTonto]

How's your setup coming? I recieved my first order, about half of the components. Placed orders for most of the rest (just need to find tubing and a resivoir). Just wondering how much progress you've made.

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