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water cooling

ws6

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Dec 31, 2007
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i need some help to locate some parts for my water cooling system.

i need a inline water pump and a peltier. I plan to use a swifttech m462w water block and a vid card block. i have a 1 gig and a 1.2 gig c athlon chip (one will be in the system). where can i find a good pump and a good sized peltier?? and brand and types of pumps are good?

thanks,

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 
G

Guest

Guest
For the pump I'd recommend the <A HREF="http://www.petwhse.com/webstore/webstore.nsf/(id)/13C86?OpenDocument" target="_new">Eheim 1048</A> which you can buy at various pet stores. It is a good quality, quiet pump with a reputation for being reliable (if your pump breaks, your CPU will probably burn up). People have had success with cheaper Mag Drive pumps, but the only concern with them is the electro-magnetic field they create. Little Giant and Iwaki are a couple of other good pump manufacturers. Stay away from Rio, their pumps have a reputation for breaking down. You will probably want a flow rate between 150 and 300 gph. Any faster than that and the radiator probably won't have enough time to cool the water, any slower than that and the water jacket(s) may not get enough water to cool down the chip as well.

Waterblocks (waterjackets) are best bought from <A HREF="http://www.dangerden.com" target="_new">dangerden.com</A> or a Swiftech reseller. <A HREF="http://www.highvoltagepc.com/" target="_new">High Voltage PC</A> carries some good clamps. Dangerden also carries some good radiators and <A HREF="http://www.overclock-watercool.com" target="_new">Overclock-Watercool</A> carries some decent ones too. You can buy peltiers from many places (Dangerden, Overclock-watercool, <A HREF="http://www.2cooltek.com/" target="_new">2cooltek.com</A>, <A HREF="http://millisec.com/" target="_new">Millisec</A>, <A HREF="http://www.overclockershideout.com/" target="_new">Overclockers Hideout</A>, and more). You will want a potted peltier for internal protection from moisture, and one with twice the wattage your CPU puts out or more. If you don't have a fan(s) for your radiator, check out <A HREF="http://www.caseetc.com/cgi-bin/caseetc/scan/sf=display/se=yes/se=Fans and Cooling/sf=category/ml=8.html" target="_new">Panaflo fans</A>. The McMaster Premium Silicon tubing Dangerden carries is highly regarded and Arctic Silver thermal paste is the best. You will want to add <A HREF="http://www.inlinefour.com/roypurpurice.html" target="_new">Purple Ice</A> or <A HREF="http://www.caseetc.com/cgi-bin/caseetc/000331.html" target="_new">Water Wetter</A> to your distilled water for better cooling, algea growth control, and to reduce to battery effect (if using copper components with aluminum components). You may also want to look into some insulating materials to control condensation from the peltier.

This is about it. Some good places for info are:
<A HREF="http://www.overclockers.com/topiclist/index31.asp#WATER COOLING" target="_new">Overclockers.com</A>
<A HREF="http://www.procooling.com" target="_new">Procooling.com</A>
and <A HREF="http://rainwulf.trancetechno.com/principles.html" target="_new">http://rainwulf.trancetechno.com/principles.html</A>
 

Grizely1

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i would stay away from watercooling, i just totally screwed my computer.

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"648kb is all the space anyone will ever need!"

Bill Gates, 1980s
 
G

Guest

Guest
Heres some links I have ran across.

<A HREF="http://www.tedist.com/overclk.html" target="_new">pelters/oc info</A>
<A HREF="http://www.tetech.com/assys/" target="_new">liquid coolers</A>
<A HREF="http://www.overclockershideout.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=o&Category_Code=WC" target="_new">watercooling kits/components</A>


<b><i>"Bad advice is expensive, Good advice is priceless"
 
G

Guest

Guest
in case you didn't look, th water in his water cooling got so hot that the sealant came off, spilling water all over his MB, frying just about everything in the setup.

watercooling is a little higher risk, all that water just begging to spill and all. just know what you're getting into.
 

Grizely1

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actually it got so hot the water boiled (im ****ing serious), and the water tubes melted spilling water all over my MB and the solder on the waterblock melted all over it too.

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"648kb is all the space anyone will ever need!"

Bill Gates, 1980s
 

ws6

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i have used water cooling systems in the past. one of my clients has a rack of 2u servers that are water cooled zeons. i want to set something up at home. this is my plans so far:

a mcw-462b waterblock from swiftnet
a 75 to 150w peltier
a Eheim 1048 pump
i like the HWLABS Black Ice radiator at Overclock-Watercool
use hiperfomance automotive hoses for all connections
use double clamps on all hoses
i will use the inline water temp sensor from overclock-watercool
for a coolant i was thinking of using a mix of distilled water, water wetter, and the special antifreeze from my race car(scca solo 1 class).

i still haven't found a cooler for my vid card or scsi hdd. i am thinking of using a full tower inwin case unless someone can think of something better. anyone have idea for cases (and no supercase's)???



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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

ws6

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that is why i am using the inline water temp sensor. becouse of what happened to you and another article that i read on about the same thing i build a little e shutoff switch with it. it is wired so if the water hits a certain temp it will EMIDITALY shutdown the ps in the computer. i really hate to say this (nothing personal) but thanks for telling me about the hose problem. also i plan to use hitemp racing automotive hoses (they are rubber with a metal reinforcement in them, they are used in the radiator and heater core for example) instead of the plastic ones everyone else seems to use. those rack cases that i have seen use about the same type of hoses. i am sorry though that your system got toasted but on the bright side though if nothing has any cosmetic damage you can always rma the item to the resaler or manifacture and get a replacement (water cooling, i don't know what watercooling is). i have rma'd mb that i have epoxed hs/f to northbridges before and dimms with hs too.

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

Grizely1

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didn't really mean to be making you aware, i'm sure you already were. just trying to bring in a little humor :smile:

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"648kb is all the space anyone will ever need!"

Bill Gates, 1980s
 

ws6

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no problem. your posts helped though. tell i heard your post about your experience i planed on using the clear plastic hoses and to hook my water temp sensor to the mb sensors. it is becouse of what you said happened that i decided to make my own ekill switch for the water temp and to use the rubber hi temp hoses.

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

Grizely1

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i am now changing it and going to have probably aluminum leads going out awhile so it will be farther from the block. don't know if this will help, but oh well.

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"648kb is all the space anyone will ever need!"

Bill Gates, 1980s
 

wapaaga

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girz mabye you can epoxy on a heat sink to your water block. it might help keep your system cooler if the water line kninks agian

also you might want to thin about only using rubber lines out side of the computer so that you hhave the cas to cause so protection if it does start to leak

also at hardware stores they have water sensores that for water heaters and other stuff like that, they close the water off when they seen water. you might want to look into some thing like that
i also think that it has an alarm that goes off
 

ws6

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hey why don't you use hi temp automotive leads like i plan to?? they WILL not melt and they don't expand when they get warm so they won't slip off your water block.

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

Sojourn

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Does this automotive tubing insulate as well? I plan on supercooling my fluids, probably using a hacked up dehumidifier. I will have to insulate everything inside my PC to prevent condensation. Also, how thick is this tubing? Just wondering if I can squeeze it through a PCI slot, or if I need to drill some hose ports in my case.

/Athlon-1.2GHz@1370MHz(137MHz*10)/Asus_A7V133/
 

ws6

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go look at your car. you should have the same type of hoses on it for the cooling system. i think i will use 3/8 tubing. it does offer some insulation but you can also go and get the fiberglass/foil insutation they use in a/c systems and such. that would work really good. i plan to post tonight my plan for my water cooler with costs for all intested.

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Chris
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ws6

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ok all here is my plans so far:

Pump: Eheim 1048 Pet warehouse 56.00
Water block: Swiftech MWC462-BT Swiftech 66.75
Peltier: 156w Potted Unit Overclockers Hideout 39.99
Vid Card: Vid card super kit Overclockers Hideout 52.99
Radiator 1: Black ICE Overclock-watercool 67.95
Radiator 2: Radiator 676 assy. Swiftech 49.99
Power Supply: 13.8V 23A Continuous Overclocker Hideout 125.99
Inline Thermal Probe x2 Overclock-watercool 12.00
Hoses: hi temp automotive Auto parts store ????
Fittings: all brass from hardware stores
????
Foam Matting: 1/8 closed cell Overclocker Hideout 1.82
Anti-condisation Jell:Frost Fighter Overclocker Hideout 5.99
Paste: Artic Silver II Overclocker Hideout 7.90
Epoxy: Artice Silver Epoxy already have: ---
Case: LiteOn FS020 Full Tower Case etc. 159.99
Fan: Pancool x3 Case etc. 44.97
Mini-Radiator: for vid and future hdd Overclocker Hideout 49.00
TOTAL: 704.33+shipping (with black ice radiator)

Water flow:

Pump -> vid cooler -> hdd cooler -> radiator 2 -> water temp sensor 1 -> CPU waterblock w/ tec -> water temp sensor 2 -> radiator 1 -> pump

Stage 1:
Case
Pump
Tec
Cpu waterblock
Radiator 1
First thermal probe

Stage 2:
Radiator 2
Second thermal probe

Stage 3:
Vid cooler
Hdd cooler

Stage 4:
Chillers

Stage 5(????):
Second pump
Second radiator 1
Second CPU cooler
Second tec
More chillers
(Window a/c unit for my room :) )

By comparision:

Vaporchill:
Vaporchill Barebone Vaporchill 650
300w Power Supply misc web site 39.00
TOTAL: 689.00+shipping

And it doesn’t do the hdd or vid card but will get the cpu to around –10c underload :p.



i would appreasite any input anyone might have into this.

thanks,

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

Grizely1

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good, except i would send it through another radiator before going to the CPU. or go to the cPU first then all the others.

-----------------
"648kb is all the space anyone will ever need!"

Bill Gates, 1980s
 

Sojourn

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I'm looking into setting up a watercooling rig as well. I have a full tower case that will be modded to fully contain the water cooling hardware, no external parts. Here is what I'm thinking.

Water Jacket - I'm considering using a Urethane based conformal coating to protect and insulate the face of my Athlon CPU, while leaving the core exposed. I will then mount a high-temp clear plastic open bottom'd water jacket to the CPU itself using silicone paste and a heat sink clamp. The coolant will flow directly over the CPU core. I plan on buying the cheapest Duron I can find to test this and make sure nothing shorts or cracks (Urethane shrinks a LOT when curing, potentially causing warping or other damage to the CPU.) Failing this, I will use a copper waterjacket purchased from where-ever (they all appear to be pretty much the same) like every other joe and his cooler.

Water pumps - I plan on using a redundant pump system, because if one fails I definately do not want my system to burn out. This will be a grand adventure, but I don't really feel like chucking a $250 CPU out the window. I've got roughly a 9 1/4" x 4" x 6 1/3" area for my resevior/pumps. I want submerged pumps to keep down on the noise levels. I will probably start with 2 <A HREF="http://www.petsmart.com/fish/shopping/water_pumps/products/product_13062.shtml" target="_new">Tetra Typhoon Cat 1 75 gph pond pumps</A>. I need to find a local store that carries them so I can measure their dimensions. If I can squeeze 3 in there, I will. Also, with a variable flow rate, I can adjust it for optimum performance.

Radiator - I will probably start with one <A HREF="http://www.data-detective.com/overclock/black_ice.htm" target="_new">Black Ice radiator</A>. The section of my case I will be housing the radiator portion is 160mm x 160mm x 120mm, so I could potentially fit a couple in there. At $70 a pop that will get very spendy very fast. Unfortunately, I don't want to spend over $500 on this rig right now.

Note the lack of peltiers or compressors. I want to see how well this system performs without a peltier. If I do decide to add peltier cooling, I will probably add it right outside the radiator portion using one or more 150 watt peltiers sandwiched between two copper water jackets. The hot side will flow through the radiator to be cooled, the the cool water will be passed over the cool side of the peltier for further cooling. I will put a temperature sensor on the cool water jacket to cut the power to the peltier in the case of a coolant leak or pump failure. Supercooled performance is grand and all, but I don't want to put my CPU at risk in any way. I've seen entirely too many pics of charred CPUs in peltier systems for personal comfort.

If anyone has comments/suggestions I'd love to hear them! For example, how loud do you think such a system would be? I've currently got a GlobalWin FOP38, which is entirely too loud for my tastes. That's why I started looking in to water cooling, and why I'm leaning towards the low gph submersable water pumps. Very quiet. Also, I plan on conformal coating my entire motherboard with the stuff that glows under UV light. I will then add plexi glass view ports in several key locations and blacklight the whole affair for visual affect. Should be pretty sweet. If I can figure out a way to make my coolant glow, too, I'll do that, and run the tubing out the front of my case at the bottom and back in at the top. If I can use the clear plastic CPU water jacket, it would be even cooler. Of course, form follows function, so if I can't find a way to do with that won't require that I purge and clean my system every 7 days, I'll skip it. Would be nifty to see the water pumping, though, wouldn't it?

/Athlon-1.2GHz@1370MHz(137MHz*10)/Asus_A7V133/
 

ws6

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i am sending it though radiator before it gets to the cpu
"Pump -> vid cooler -> hdd cooler -> radiator 2, 676 radiator-> water temp sensor 1 -> CPU waterblock w/ tec -> water temp sensor 2 -> radiator 1, black ice radiator -> pump"

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Chris
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ws6

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i wouldn't use more than 1 pump. you might run into problems with them trying to cavitate each other. i am using 2 inline water sensors that if the water gets too hot it will flip a relay and kill the ps on the computer. the inline pumps aren't that noisy and will fit better in the case. my whole system will fit into my case. just out of curisity what case do you have?
also as a reminder, the die size on a duron and tbird are difrent (tbird being bigger). i have seen the plastic water jackets crack before. that is one reason that i am using a copper one. also it doesn't justify the cost unless i use a tec. not all copper water jackets are the same also. a lot that i have seen have inefficent ways of moving the water inside the jacket that can actually be bad for it (the cooler that i plan to use for the vid card is this way :-( ). the swiftech ones seem to be the best that i have found for multiple reasons and water flow being one of the biggest.

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Chris
ws6@kc.rr.com
 

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