[SOLVED] What would you use as RAM for the Asrock Z390 Taichi M/B?

Vilesyde

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Jul 20, 2016
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Here are my PC specs, I am wanting to switch RAM as the one I have doesn't allow for the XMP Profile to work. Any suggestions? Id like to stay with 64gb. Here are my specs atm.


Summary
Operating System
Windows 10 Pro 64-bit

CPU
Intel Core i9 9900KF @ 3.60GHz 29 °C
Coffee Lake 14nm Technology

RAM
64.0GB Dual-Channel DDR4 @ 1065MHz (15-15-15-36)

G.SKILL TridentZ RGB Series 32GB (4 x 16GB) 288-Pin PC RAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C16D-32GTZRC

Motherboard
ASRock Z390 Taichi (CPUSocket) 28 °C


Graphics
HISENSE (3840x2160@60Hz)
2047MB NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3080 (Gigabyte) 34 °C

Storage
14902GB Seagate ST16000NM003G-2KH113 (SATA ) 36 °C
14902GB Seagate ST16000NM003G-2KH113 (SATA ) 39 °C
7452GB Western Digital WDC WD80EFZX-68UW8N0 (SATA ) 40 °C
11176GB Seagate ST12000NM0007-2A1101 (SATA ) 36 °C
931GB Samsung SSD 970 EVO Plus 1TB (Unknown (SSD))
931GB Samsung SSD 970 EVO 1TB (Unknown (SSD))

Optical Drives
No optical disk drives detected

Audio
FxSound Audio Enhancer
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
Those sticks are not compatible with your motherboard based on the results of the G.Skill memory configurator. Besides which, running very high speed memory kits with 4 DIMMs installed is tricky at best, regardless of the platform.

What happens when you try to run it at the XMP profile?
 

Karadjgne

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F4-3600C16D-32GTZRC is a 2stick kit, 16Gb x2, and you are running 2 of them, which is simplest terms is mixing ram. Makes no difference if they seem identical, they aren't. Ram is made from sheets of silicon, chopped into size and stuck to a pcb. Mixing kits, even if they seem identical, usually means that the kits themselves came from different sheets, which have different levels and types of impurities, which changes the Secondary and Tertiary timings. That's what makes them incompatible.

When mixing kits, you get one of 3 results. Either they work, they work with adjustments or they don't work. With you, it's either 2 or 3, undecided yet because you haven't tinkered. You may need to bump dram voltage to @ 1.38v, or add a small amount of voltage to VCCIO and/or VCCSA as those deal with the memory controller and transmission voltages. The ram will most likely work together as it already does at 2133MHz, the question being is if you can get the memory controller in the cpu to accept the 3600MHz, even if you must first plug in the speeds and/or timings manually, and that may include changing the timings to the loosest of the 2 kits.

Or replace the ram with a single kit of 32Gb x2/16Gb x4 if you must have 64Gb.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
G.Skill doesn't show ANY 32GB x2 kits that are 3600mhz and compatible with that board. They would have to either drop down to 3200mhz for a 16GB x4 kit or stick with a 32GB x2 kit at 3600mhz.

But you are right about one thing, and I didn't notice, that it is two kits. I was looking on the configurator for a 4 DIMM kit which is why it wasn't showing up. However, taking a look again it seems that even the actual F4-3600C16D-32GTZRC kit is not compatible either. Another kit, F4-3600C16D-32GTZR which does not have the "C" on the end, but which has VERY different timings and likely totally different physical makeup, is compatible, but again you would be rolling the dice on two kits together which IS a roll of the dice. The only way anything is ever even remotely guaranteed is when they all come together in one kit.

I'd recommend these, which are more expensive, and are only 3200mhz, but they are 14-18-18-38 sticks compared to the 16-19-19-39 sticks they have now and actually have a lower true latency of 8.75ns rather than the 8.889ns true latency on the existing kit so in reality, they are actually minutely faster than those sticks AND considering they are 3200mhz CL14 sticks they are most probably either Samsung B-die DIMMs or another very high end DIMM and if a person wanted they could probably easily overclock them even further although I wouldn't recommend it because at 8.75ns true latency you are already getting very close to the fuzzy gray edge of stability where anything below about 8.5ns may result in unstable or unbootable conditions.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
Right. I was going to ask that too and completely forgot. Good call man. As well, oh yeah, that's why I didn't say it, because I was waiting to hear back about exactly what HAPPENS when they try to use XMP. I was going to suggest putting them in, enabling XMP but before you exit bump the DRAM voltage up a bit. The voltage of 1.35v is really only specified for a single pair. With four DIMMs installed you may need a little DRAM more voltage to get them stable at full speed. Possibly also a small bump in VCCIO voltage as well.
 

Karadjgne

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Afaik, that's Hynix DJR sticks. Which I do believe currently hold world records in OC. B-die is somewhat more forgiving and easier to OC with, it's base Secondary and Tertiary timings really don't change much across any platform or speeds, but with a little patience, Micron-B or Hynix DJR are just as viable, if not more so in some instances.

I find that last "C" odd. For years now, the trident have used a 3-4 last digits, like GTZ or GTZN or GTZR, having that 5th digit is out of character.

It may also come down to the Z390 being Daisy Chain not T-topology. Daisy's do better with 2 sticks, T-topology do better with 4 sticks at high speeds, and the only high speeds (4000) are on the single rank chips (8Gb), not the dual rank (16/32Gb).

I'd say gskill tridents weren't a good fit for the ASRock Z390 Taichi, not for 3600 anyways. Most likely have better luck with Corsair.
 

Vilesyde

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Jul 20, 2016
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Those sticks are not compatible with your motherboard based on the results of the G.Skill memory configurator. Besides which, running very high speed memory kits with 4 DIMMs installed is tricky at best, regardless of the platform.

What happens when you try to run it at the XMP profile?
What happens is, it just wont boot. It starts, flashes AsRock, and then spins and then reboots. It doesnt go into XMP at all
 

Vilesyde

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Jul 20, 2016
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G.Skill doesn't show ANY 32GB x2 kits that are 3600mhz and compatible with that board. They would have to either drop down to 3200mhz for a 16GB x4 kit or stick with a 32GB x2 kit at 3600mhz.

But you are right about one thing, and I didn't notice, that it is two kits. I was looking on the configurator for a 4 DIMM kit which is why it wasn't showing up. However, taking a look again it seems that even the actual F4-3600C16D-32GTZRC kit is not compatible either. Another kit, F4-3600C16D-32GTZR which does not have the "C" on the end, but which has VERY different timings and likely totally different physical makeup, is compatible, but again you would be rolling the dice on two kits together which IS a roll of the dice. The only way anything is ever even remotely guaranteed is when they all come together in one kit.

I'd recommend these, which are more expensive, and are only 3200mhz, but they are 14-18-18-38 sticks compared to the 16-19-19-39 sticks they have now and actually have a lower true latency of 8.75ns rather than the 8.889ns true latency on the existing kit so in reality, they are actually minutely faster than those sticks AND considering they are 3200mhz CL14 sticks they are most probably either Samsung B-die DIMMs or another very high end DIMM and if a person wanted they could probably easily overclock them even further although I wouldn't recommend it because at 8.75ns true latency you are already getting very close to the fuzzy gray edge of stability where anything below about 8.5ns may result in unstable or unbootable conditions.
Which ones do you recommend I get? I dont see them sorry.
 

Vilesyde

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Afaik, that's Hynix DJR sticks. Which I do believe currently hold world records in OC. B-die is somewhat more forgiving and easier to OC with, it's base Secondary and Tertiary timings really don't change much across any platform or speeds, but with a little patience, Micron-B or Hynix DJR are just as viable, if not more so in some instances.

I find that last "C" odd. For years now, the trident have used a 3-4 last digits, like GTZ or GTZN or GTZR, having that 5th digit is out of character.

It may also come down to the Z390 being Daisy Chain not T-topology. Daisy's do better with 2 sticks, T-topology do better with 4 sticks at high speeds, and the only high speeds (4000) are on the single rank chips (8Gb), not the dual rank (16/32Gb).

I'd say gskill tridents weren't a good fit for the ASRock Z390 Taichi, not for 3600 anyways. Most likely have better luck with Corsair.
Do you know the model number of the Hynix DJR set i should look at?
 

Vilesyde

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I guess my next question would be: If you only use two of the matched sticks, can you use XMP?
Never tried, what originally happened was, I had the Gigabyte Aorus Master z390 board, and it just bricked for no apparent reason from factory, Ended up putting the same ram sticks into the ASRock without thinking it wouldn't work. Go me. So, ive never tried just 2 sticks, I just noticed an error when i ran benchmark and it said that my ram was FAR underperforming and Im like, wtf? So i looked into it and found the QVL list for the MB and low and behold, my current memory isn't on the list at all. So, here i am. Lol. Ill more than likely throw this set on Ebay and get the proper ones. Any suggestions based on my rig would be appreciated. This was my first full build by myself, made some errors lol.
 

Vilesyde

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Yeah, these would also be a really good choice, and with only two DIMMs a bit easier on the memory controller. Also high quality model, 3600mhz and actually cheaper than the G.Skill kit I mentioned earlier. They also show as compatible on the Corsair memory finder.

https://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Dominator-Platinum-2x32GB-PC4-28800/dp/B0899DTRMM
Can you link me the first set your referring to? I appreciate it, and also, if you were me, which set would you slap in the system?
 

Karadjgne

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There's only a handful of ram OEMs worldwide, Samsung, SkHynix, Nanya, Micron are the big 4 and what you'll find in most consumer pc's. They make the ram and put Corsair or Gskill or Kingston or Crucial heatspreader and paint job on the outside.

This is half the reason why the QVL is so small. If you test Corsair LPX, you've essentially tested every other SkHynix ram by every other name brand, so it's absolutely pointless to do further testing. Silicon has different grades and potential, dies, so Samsung B-die is their best grade, gets the best speeds and timings but costs more to produce, so costs more. That's why there's a big price difference between 3600/14 (B-die) and 3600/16 (D-die).

Gskill uses primarily Samsung B-die/D-die/Z-die/A-die and Hynix CJR/DJR in the Trident-Z and RipJaws lines.

Corsair Dominator use Hynix CJR.

So your issue isn't so much that you are using Gskill, it's that you are using 2x kits of 32Gb dual rank Gskill 3600 and the cpu memory controller has issues with that. I'm also thinking that your board uses Daisy Chain and not T-topology (the Gigabyte you had prior uses T-topology) Explained here which works far better for 2x sticks at high speeds but has issues with 4x sticks of dual rank (don't confuse rank and channel, not the same) at high speeds.

So. After all that is said, if you have a need for 64Gb of ram and you want it to run at 3600 or higher speed, you'll need a single kit of 2x32Gb 3600.

The Corsair Dominator that Darkbreeze linked earlier are about the best ram on the market, hold world records, have been top of the list as most common for uber professional overclockers etc. They are as good as it gets for a 2x32Gb kit at 3600MHz.
 

Darkbreeze

Retired Mod
These are the sticks I recommended earlier: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374081

But if we're being honest, much as I prefer G.Skill over just about anybody else, those Dominator platinum sticks are probably the better option AND they are less expensive, as well as actually showing as being validated compatible for that board, which the above G.Skill kit does not. That doesn't mean it won't work on that board, because it most certainly should, but even so, I like to stick to kits that are validated when making recommendations for somebody other than myself.

Both should work though.
 

Vilesyde

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Jul 20, 2016
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These are the sticks I recommended earlier: https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-64gb-288-pin-ddr4-sdram/p/N82E16820374081

But if we're being honest, much as I prefer G.Skill over just about anybody else, those Dominator platinum sticks are probably the better option AND they are less expensive, as well as actually showing as being validated compatible for that board, which the above G.Skill kit does not. That doesn't mean it won't work on that board, because it most certainly should, but even so, I like to stick to kits that are validated when making recommendations for somebody other than myself.

Both should work though.

You have been such a help, thanks alot. This is quite off topic but, do you happen to know of an all white case similar to the Lian Li 011 Dynamic XL ? i have that now but its black and I truly want an ALL white build but I need a huge tower and thats hard to find. I use my pc as a gamer and a media station as I use plex and have thousands of blu rays and such. So i have massive harddrives and they all fit in the case. Maybe i should look into a raid box for the harddrives and just get a smaller case. Any suggestions? Sorry to ask here but you are so knowledgable wanted to get your opinion. So thankful!
 

Karadjgne

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You don't need a raid box, you already have one. Just strip out of the case everything you want in the new case, and put in something cheap instead, old Intel 2nd or 3rd gen work great with a simple air cooler and a Linux distro.
 

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