Question Which system will fit my needs

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tigereon69

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Nov 29, 2014
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I am looking to buy a system and i can not decide between 2 that i have narrowed it down to. My biggest issue is that there are a few programs i use that I have noticed lag and issues with so more then anything else I am looking for a system that will give me the best results using . Photoshop CS5, Civilization 5, and Everquest (and other online MMORPGs).

Here are the 2 systems I am considering (if there is a tweak or something anyone things would be better i am open to suggestions)

OPTION 1 -
27-inch iMac with Retina 5K display
Hardware
3.5GHz quad-core Intel Core i7, Turbo Boost up to 3.9GHz (could bump up to 4.0GHZ)
16GB 1600MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x8GB
1TB Fusion Drive
AMD Radeon R9 M295X 4GB GDDR5

OPTION 2 -
Refurbished 27-inch iMac 3.5GHz quad-core Intel Core i7
Originally released September 2013
27-inch (diagonal) LED-backlit display with IPS technology; 2560-by-1440 resolution
16GB memory
3TB Fusion drive
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M graphics processor with 4GB of GDDR5 memory
Built-in FaceTime HD camera



Which one is going to give me the better performance on the software i listed (gaming and photo editing)....and is it likely to be a SIGNIFICANT difference? also, is there a better config i am missing keeping in mind i am looking to keep the price UNDER $3k.
 
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Regarding OPTION 1:

I unfortunately don't know the specific demands for the games you mentioned but let me just assure you that you will not be able to play games that are medium to high in graphical workload demand at 5120x2880 at even medium quality settings, let alone high or ultra. One alternative would be to change resolution to say 2560x1440 (2:1 ratio) and that would leave you enough GPU power to play most game at a decent level of quality. But many would argue that ruins the purpose of the the "5K" monitor and you could argue you are paying a premium price for a feature you cannot really use for what you intend it to be used for. The 27" iMac Retina 5K has an unprecedented under-powered GPU for the 5120x2880 resolution which makes it very unsuitable for gaming of almost any kind at its native resolution and even your possibility in terms of video-editing might be limited depending on what you need to do almost to an extent that you could argue the resolution the build offers is more or less a marketing gadget.

Regarding OPTION 2:

Here you will have the same resolution as you would probably be forced to downscale on the OPTION 1 anyway if gaming, but as far as I can tell OPTION 2 is well over $1.200 cheaper and you are not really losing any significant performance especially considering the size of the price gap. By the way, the difference between having 2GB or 4GB or RAM on your GPU is not so important when running at single 2560x1440 monitor unless you intend to use a lot of multisample anti-aliasing (MSAA) when gaming.

So if you ask for an opinion of which is the best buy for the purposes you mentioned. OPTION 2 wins hands down as it basically gives you the same experiences but for a much, much lower price.

What is worth mentioning is that both those computers have mobile GPUs since there is simply not enough space in there nor possibility to get rid of the heat to have a "desktop" GPU in that tiny space.

It can be wise to mention that even the best mobile GPUs cannot compete with more moderate version of normal GPU, let alone the top notch "normal" GPUs. The NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M and ,judging by the early testings, R9 M295X are in the weight class that it's only probably at 1920x1080 / 1920x1200 that you will be able to play the most demanding games on ultra with a 60 or close to 60 fps.

So if you want a computer and a 27" IPS 2560x1440 display you can get extremely much better performance for only $2.000 (not to mention $3.000) if you choose a solution that involves a more conventional midi tower or big tower desktop which has a completely different capability since it has the capacity of fitting both one or two high performance GPUs in it.

But if it's important for you to not have such a tower and/or you prefer Apple products, I would definitely go for OPTION 2.
 
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From what you have mentioned, Civ 5 will be the most intensive and will run on either of those machines at max settings. I have a MacBook Pro that will consistently hold 50fps(good fps for this game, being a TTS and all) at max settings at 2880x1800, and the iMac's you are considering have higher specifications. I personally would go for the Retina, but it is cost prohibitive. You will get similar levels of performance from the Applications you have mentioned from either iMac
 
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50fps is pretty crappy if you ask me!

I got a 1000$ PC and I get over 100fps on games like call of duty or metro etc...

Don't waste your money on a mac if you are going to use it for gaming.
 
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Eh, I don't feel the need to defend peoples preferences for an OS or comp. Civ 5 is not a game that you will have a need for more then 30-40 fps... fyi And my NOTEBOOK can play it at over 2k without issue. FYI I also typically use VSYNC which is probably seriously affecting my average. I don't play COD. I do also have a self built tower next to this comp.

Both can game well, I do agree though, don't buy a Mac JUST for gaming, though CS5 being mentioned suggested you aren't only going to be gaming.
 
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Fair enough, but why pay extra money for a worse performance? Also why pay extra money to have less choices in terms of software and especially games?

Last time I checked, CS5 runs on windows perfectly fine.

My suggestion is save the extra money.

And since it's tomhardware he can actually check for PC parts that would enable him to install mac os X on it. Again, save the money and still use mac os X
 
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1. If someone likes Macs, let them like Macs(And they can run Windows if they want to anyways..)
2. Typically speaking more software doesn't mean better, and thats before the numerical difference of malware issues between the platforms is considered(malware is still software). Keep in mind I use Windows and Mac on a regular basis at home.
3. I will acknowledge that Apple products typically include a premium, but I would say it is well worth it(matter of perspective). Other premium machines are similar in price, Razer Blades for instance
4. Hackintoshes are pirated software, so keep that in mind if you opt for this option.
5. Worse Performance compared to what? Desktop Towers do not directly compare to All In Ones, or Portables for that matter. There is an advantage to each form factor as well as varied disadvantages. Each form factor loses somewhere.
 
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If you prefer Mac Os X and you have the money go for it. But when someone is starting to talk about gaming on a mac you have to be realistic. I mean softwares on mac are limited and depending on what you do if mac's softwares will work for you than it's fine, go for it. But it seems like not only you pay extra for a mac you need to buy a windows machine on top of that... than you kind of prove me right.

Malware are everywhere even on mac... might have less, but if you dont spend your day downloading crap, you should be fine on both machines.

And the prices are lower for laptop pcs too, mac books are over priced, but look good.

I can't justify buying a mac computer that is actually more expensive and does a lot less.... It just makes no senses to me. it's like buying a porche 911 for your family car. You can do it, but it doesn't make it a good idea.
 
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I'm sorry I don't understand, why do you NEED to buy a Windows machine? I have both because I troubleshoot multiple platforms regularly. Realistic? I'm not sure about that.
There are many high quality pieces of software for both platforms. On the flip side their is typically more crap software available for Windows then for Mac, they both have it, but one of them has more. You are right, people should be fine if they don't download crap all day long.
Aside from SPECIFIC games(which many times their are workarounds i.e.WINE) there is no lesser capability on the Mac, making it a matter of preference.. obviously I know your view point straight up on that. Windows PC Portables are nice sometimes but many times you can end up with crap(especially with regard to cooling solutions, thermal pasting etc).. especially from specific manufacturers, and yes that can come down to knowing what you are buying, hell if I wanted a portable that JUST sat at a desk all day I would have considered building my own Clevo for the same money, which ultimately would translate to somewhat better GPU and a substantially worse CPU and way worse battery life.
Also I don't expect you to justify it, buy what you like, just don't chuck your biased position at something you choose not to like. I enjoy my Mac, I enjoy my Windows PC, because they are how I want to have them, I customized both, one before checkout, one after, end goal is the same. A computer that does what I need it to do and does it well. As it most likely will be for our original poster.
Also your car analogy, I would say a Land Rover LR4 would be a more valid comparison, All the capability, but looks a little strange among other options :)
 
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my opinion is biased because of what exactly?

Ask anyone who likes a bit of gaming if they enjoy their macs..... and you are saying the guy should buy a more expensive to get 50fps in a shitty little game!!! c'mon now! be serious.
 
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You very clearly missed the point, and chose to ignore specific details while continuously trying to emphasize and reemphasize the points that make your point of view look good. I see no point in beating a horse to death any further.
 
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You are biased because every reply you make to enquiries about Macs or OS X boils down to "I don't really know a lot about Macs but you should have bought (or should buy) a Windows computer". It's certainly a point of view, but not a very useful answer to people who are specifically enquiring about Macs. And it's getting a little boring.
 
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unfortunately, the answer is often 'you should have gotten a PC' people blindly buy mac and asks why their programs don't run on this machine. The reality in desktop PC is that windows owns the market. It's very very very different in the mobile market, but this is the reality.

When someone is asking about gaming on mac.... the answer cannot be get a mac... sorry, it just cant.

 
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"You should have gotten a PC" is not an even remotely helpful answer in the situation you presented. First off there are typically program equivalents if the program is not available(which most mainstream productivity applications are). Secondly there are products such as VMWAre Fusion, Parallels, Crossover, Virtual Box etc... That would allow you to run Windows versions of most programs. Another option is Boot Camp. I can understand if you don't want to present these options if you aren't aware of them(or don't know enough about them), in which case you probably should not be the one answering those questions.

You do occasionally get people who "blindly" buy something, and "unfortunately" the "you should have gotten a PC" answer is nothing but condescending. If you don't know, or don't want to accept the situation, then again you probably shouldn't be the one to provide that answer.

Our original poster wasn't blindly going into anything. He was selecting between two Macs, He knew what software he wanted to run. All the software he mentioned is available for that platform, and even if it wasn't there are options as pointed out above.

The gaming "reality" is that PC Gaming and Mac OS X Gaming are not the same market. Much in the same way as the Xbox market compares to Nintendo's Market, or iOS compares to Android. They all have differing advantages, and differing selections of content as should be expected. And no matter what, you can find issues as well (i.e. Console vs PC)
 
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I think people who buy expensive macs are blind, plain and simple. I know mac more than you can imagine. I work in Computer support and I deal with tons of macs and ios. I probably know them much better than you fan boys.

For VMware and all that stuff, you can do that the other way around too, so it's very poor argument.

As for the gaming aspect, I'm sorry, but there is ZERO, obsoletely no advantages or better differences for the mac.... Again, you try to bend the reality to try and justify the more expensive mac....


 
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You are not the only one who works in technical support my friend.

Admitting that you knew a more helpful answer and CHOOSING not to give it.. that says something about your own fortitude.

Keep trolling friend
 
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I think people who buy expensive macs are blind, plain and simple.
Click to expand...
I think we had already established your obvious bias; there's no need to keep pointing it out. When you start to refer to someone who is trying to answer the question asked, rather than some question that you have made up, as a "fanboy" then I agree that it verges on a troll.

From the answers that you have given so far to Mac problems I find it surprising that your employers let you provide support for Macs. You wouldn't have lasted a week in the support department that I managed.
 
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in all of this... no one has given me ONE reason to buy a mac... I'm not saying there isn't, there are a few reasons why it would be a smart reason. (unix programming, iOS development, print design etc..)

But for the needs of the original poster, macs are simply over priced machine for what he wants to do. Let's remember he is asking about GAMING! not to MENTION THAT EVERQUEST HAS BEEN DISCONTINUED FOR OVER 2 YEARS ON MAC!

Giving good support to someone is the ability to understand that the person you are giving support too is per haps looking for the wrong thing.
 
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Let's remember he is asking about GAMING!
Click to expand...
To be precise, he asked about gaming amongst other uses.

Giving good support to someone is the ability to understand, and answer, their question (not your own made up question) without making unwarranted assumptions or adding ones own bias to the answer. Anyone who referred to customers - Mac users - as "fanboys" in my department wouldn't have know what hit them.
 
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Well, you are probably the joke in your office. You are probably that mac guy who has to spend half the day to change a Harddrive on a work station, right?

So here is the original question and I will break it down for you since you don't understand:



First Everquest does NOT run on MAC. First problem here

Second he is asking for MMORPGs in general
Here is the list of of the games available for MAC:
http://store.steampowered.com/search/?snr=1_7_7_151_12&term=MMORPG#term=MMORPG&sort_by=_ASC&os=mac&page=1

If you count out the MARVEL expansion packs you have about 15 games to choose from and I cannot stress this enough everquest is discontinued on mac.

Here are the EVERQUEST games available for Windows:
http://store.steampowered.com/search/?snr=1_7_7_151_12&term=everquest

Here is the nice list of 6 pages MMORPGs he can find on steam (for windows of course):
http://store.steampowered.com/search/?snr=1_4_4__12&term=MMORPG#term=MMORPG&sort_by=_ASC&os=win&page=1

Civ is on both platform and Photoshop is on both platform and works just as good for both.

Notice on the last line he is asking performances for GAMING! If you fail to see he is looking in the wrong place I don't know what else I can tell you.

If he had mention he can't stand windows or he has other reasons why he wants a mac, than I agree. Maybe I could suggest a mac for him. But with the reasons he listed.... a mac would be a waste of money, sorry!

Now can you tell me one reason why a mac would be a better idea for his needs? I just gave you a couple reasons from my point of view.




 
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First off, about Everquest.... https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=2939

Secondly, you keep spewing the "more is better" concept like it is at all relevant, which you should already know it is not.

People can game on whatever they want to game on, just because you see some type of limitation, doesn't mean there isn't a way around that 'limitation", as I'm sure anyone running Linux distros could point out to you. And the fact that he is comparing between two MACS, he has already implied that he is specifically looking for a MAC. If it was between a Mac and a WindowsPC I would see your point as more relevant. And that is saying something considering your general biased tone throughout this interaction..
 
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First Everquest does NOT run on MAC.
Click to expand...
Again, to be precise, Everquest does not run on OS X. I presume, with your experience of Macs, you have heard of Boot Camp?

My problem with your answers in this forum is not just with this thread, but the totality of your posts. OK, so you have a negative view of Macs - that's not very helpful to people here with problems with their Mac. "Should have bought a PC" is rarely a helpful answer. If you've nothing helpful to say then perhaps it's best to keep quiet. Better to say nothing and be thought a fool than to say something and prove the point
 
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Yes more is better in this situation. He is talking about "other online MMORPGs"

So I think he wants a little bit more options down the road.

Working in support, I often realize people don't know exactly what they want. It's our job to give them all the options and knowledge.

The other day someone in the office asked me about an HTC phone she saw at the store and wanted to buy it but asked me before if it was a good deal. I asked her want she wanted to do with it and she listed FACETIME with her daughter..... I was like, you better look for an iphone (something she wanted to avoid because of the price). Anyway, all this to say that sometimes people don't really know what they are looking for.

When I see someone mention GAMING on mac... there is a big red flag! I am not saying it can't be done. You can drive a car with your feet, but it doesn't make it a good idea you know.

So ya, from what I can see here is that this guy wants to do some gaming and photoshop with his computer.

Photoshop works perfectly on both
But forget gaming on Mac. C'mon now! I can't even believe someone is arguing with this.
 
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The boot camp argument is always irrelevant in a situation like this because the other way around could be said as well. VMware on windows or hackintosh would be an even better choice. So this is irrelevant imo.

Doesn't matter what I answer in other threads. They are all different. Most of the time I think I am right.

I am still waiting for your reasons why a mac would be a better idea for his needs. I gave tons of them. You gave me none so far.
 
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