Why do so many people fight about Macs and PCs, i mean dont they both just do the same thing.
- Thread starter Bevs4Days
- Start date
lightningwing92
Reputable
- Feb 7, 2015
- 25
- 0
- 4,540
To me it seems like it's a fanboy stand-off because some people just swear by Apple, same with pc but in the end it's all an opinion
- Oct 30, 2004
- 32,252
- 14
- 99,960
What's important to some people is not important to everyone.
The Mac is like a car you can basically ignore .... it will start up every day no matter the weather, no matter the elevation, and you don't have to worry about anything .... it just works.
The PC car is customizable, you cab tweak it for a little more performance but it is going to perplex and annoy you at times as to why something is not working.
The Mac is like a car you can basically ignore .... it will start up every day no matter the weather, no matter the elevation, and you don't have to worry about anything .... it just works.
The PC car is customizable, you cab tweak it for a little more performance but it is going to perplex and annoy you at times as to why something is not working.
Aspiring techie
Reputable
- Mar 24, 2015
- 823
- 9
- 5,365
The major difference is that Apple's machines use proprietary hardware while the specs for PC's are published so anyone with the knowhow can make circuit boards for them.
Remember that the PC is based from the IBM PC. IBM tried later to make the PC proprietary when they developed the PS/2. It was a huge flop. In essence, developers had to pay IBM a royalty to develop hardware for the PS/2 and the developers weren't going for it.
A case can be may that the published PC specifications and the ability of 3rd party developers to create and sell add-on hardware are what made the growth of the personal computer so fantastic. Some go so far as to say that we would still be working on text based machines using text only CRT's if that 3rd party development didn't occur. We'll never know.
The proprietary machine is somewhat analogous to buying a car that only the car dealership can maintain. There would be no 3rd party mechanics because they would all have to pay a fee to the manufacturer to be licensed to work on that manufacturer's car. There would be no auto parts stores because you could only buy parts at the dealership. You could only buy tires, oil, antifreeze, etc from the car manufacturer. Imagine what the prices would be.
To a large extent, that is why Apple's machines are more expensive to buy and maintain than PCs with the same capabilities.
Anyone can build a PC to fit their own requirements at home and, if need be, develop their own circuit boards to add custom functionality. Not so with Apple.
If the user isn't interested in any of that and only wants to use the computer it doesn't really matter other than the cost to buy and maintain.
Remember that the PC is based from the IBM PC. IBM tried later to make the PC proprietary when they developed the PS/2. It was a huge flop. In essence, developers had to pay IBM a royalty to develop hardware for the PS/2 and the developers weren't going for it.
A case can be may that the published PC specifications and the ability of 3rd party developers to create and sell add-on hardware are what made the growth of the personal computer so fantastic. Some go so far as to say that we would still be working on text based machines using text only CRT's if that 3rd party development didn't occur. We'll never know.
The proprietary machine is somewhat analogous to buying a car that only the car dealership can maintain. There would be no 3rd party mechanics because they would all have to pay a fee to the manufacturer to be licensed to work on that manufacturer's car. There would be no auto parts stores because you could only buy parts at the dealership. You could only buy tires, oil, antifreeze, etc from the car manufacturer. Imagine what the prices would be.
To a large extent, that is why Apple's machines are more expensive to buy and maintain than PCs with the same capabilities.
Anyone can build a PC to fit their own requirements at home and, if need be, develop their own circuit boards to add custom functionality. Not so with Apple.
If the user isn't interested in any of that and only wants to use the computer it doesn't really matter other than the cost to buy and maintain.
- Oct 30, 2004
- 32,252
- 14
- 99,960
Like in the car analogy tho.... there's a time cost associated with those perplexing little issues. In a business environment, help desk / IT costs on PCs are significant.
- Oct 17, 2011
- 3,166
- 8
- 27,115
Also, Macs can also have issues. When I used to work in tech support, we would also get calls from Mac users...& they were just as clueless about how to self-diagnose/fix their issues as the Windows users were -- perhaps more so, because unlike the Windows users they "knew" that their Macs were "malware-proof" (they're not), they "knew" that they would "always work without a hitch" (they don't), & they "knew" that there couldn't ever possibly be compatibility or glitch issues with Mac OS & their apps (they did happen & continue to happen).
And even the whole "proprietary hardware" isn't the same as it used to be. Ever looked at the specs on Macs & Macbooks anymore? They use the same types of Intel CPUs & DDR3 RAM that you can get in Windows/Linux laptops & desktops, & even some of the x86-based Chromebooks. The difference is that Apple has "tested & certified" the hardware...so you're paying the extra cost involved for that.
And even the whole "proprietary hardware" isn't the same as it used to be. Ever looked at the specs on Macs & Macbooks anymore? They use the same types of Intel CPUs & DDR3 RAM that you can get in Windows/Linux laptops & desktops, & even some of the x86-based Chromebooks. The difference is that Apple has "tested & certified" the hardware...so you're paying the extra cost involved for that.
Moonstick2
Distinguished
- Oct 3, 2014
- 996
- 246
- 19,790
A look at http://www.mac-forums.com finds plenty of examples of them not 'just working'. It was perhaps comparatively true back in the days of Win 9x, but these days I'd say Windows and OSX are pretty close in terms of just workingness. I use a home-build Win7 machine and a MacBook and both rarely cause me problems; if I were forced to choose one then I'd say the Win7 machine 'just works' far more, simply because the MacBook can occasionally have insanely annoying WiFi connection issues that are impossible to predict, diagnose and solve, even though lots of other people have had the same problem. The Win7 machine though I'm hard pressed to think of anything that hasn't resolved itself in a minute or less.
Solandri
Illustrious
- Jan 4, 2012
- 4,919
- 98
- 39,240
Best as I can figure, a large portion of the population bases their sense of self-worth on what others think of them. That's why people lease cars more expensive than they could afford to buy, or buy designer handbags. It's not that these items better suit their needs, it just makes others look up to them, which makes them feel better about themselves.
When one of these people buys a PC or a Mac and they hear someone badmouth it, since their sense of self-worth is based on what others think, they interpret this as an attack on their self-worth. If the other person is right, they must have made a bad purchase decision, and they couldn't have made a bad decision, so the other person must be wrong, and they must prove it. Get two of these people together who made opposite purchase decisions, and you get a self-sustaining feedback loop.
Those of us who don't really care about this social posturing take a completely pragmatic view. Which device better suits your needs? Buy that. If someone badmouths it, then obviously the device doesn't suit his needs. But you know that the device better suits your needs, so you can easily ignore him.
I recommend a lot of hardware to clients and friends, and the ones who are especially clumsy with computers or work in the audio or visual arts I tend to steer towards Apple products. For the rest, PCs are usually better for cost and maintainability reasons. (And yes the "Apple tax" exists. One look at Apple's profit margin will confirm that - about 25% vs about 3%-10% for most other electronic product suppliers.) Unix gurus and programmers I'd steer towards Macs too (OS X is based on BSD Unix), but those people know enough to make their own computer buying decisions so don't ask for my advice.
Most of the internals of a Mac use the same components as PCs. SATA HDDs, DDR3 RAM, Intel CPU, etc. They just cost more because Apple modifies the interface slightly to make it proprietary. e.g. extra connector on the HDD for fan speed, which makes the fan run at full speed (noisily) if you try to swap in a regular HDD. (That always gives me a laugh about some of the Apple faithful. In their opinion Samsung makes inferior products, while they blissfully use a Mac or iPhone with a Samsung screen, Samsung RAM, Samsung flash, etc. The truth is aside from software and a few small things like CPU mods, Apple doesn't actually make anything. They buy components from other companies, and wrap them in a pretty package.)
The proprietary components drive up maintenance and repair costs for Apple products far above what you pay for in terms of variance in PCs. If you look at the Dell or HP business lines, they take the opposite approach that Apple does - easy access and swapability of parts. If a business needs to minimizee "perplexing little issues", they'll buy few thousand of the exact same model. Their IT department can then learn all the idiosyncrasies. Just like they'd learn the idiosyncrasies of Macs if they bought all-Macs. (This is actually the rationale used by Southwest and their all-737 fleet - minimize maintenance and training costs.)
The OS X GUI doesn't give you enough info to diagnose most problems. But if you pop open a Terminal and use Unix commands (sometimes slightly modified by Apple), you can usually figure out what's wrong. OS X is just a pretty shell sitting on top of Unix.
When one of these people buys a PC or a Mac and they hear someone badmouth it, since their sense of self-worth is based on what others think, they interpret this as an attack on their self-worth. If the other person is right, they must have made a bad purchase decision, and they couldn't have made a bad decision, so the other person must be wrong, and they must prove it. Get two of these people together who made opposite purchase decisions, and you get a self-sustaining feedback loop.
Those of us who don't really care about this social posturing take a completely pragmatic view. Which device better suits your needs? Buy that. If someone badmouths it, then obviously the device doesn't suit his needs. But you know that the device better suits your needs, so you can easily ignore him.
I recommend a lot of hardware to clients and friends, and the ones who are especially clumsy with computers or work in the audio or visual arts I tend to steer towards Apple products. For the rest, PCs are usually better for cost and maintainability reasons. (And yes the "Apple tax" exists. One look at Apple's profit margin will confirm that - about 25% vs about 3%-10% for most other electronic product suppliers.) Unix gurus and programmers I'd steer towards Macs too (OS X is based on BSD Unix), but those people know enough to make their own computer buying decisions so don't ask for my advice.
Most of the internals of a Mac use the same components as PCs. SATA HDDs, DDR3 RAM, Intel CPU, etc. They just cost more because Apple modifies the interface slightly to make it proprietary. e.g. extra connector on the HDD for fan speed, which makes the fan run at full speed (noisily) if you try to swap in a regular HDD. (That always gives me a laugh about some of the Apple faithful. In their opinion Samsung makes inferior products, while they blissfully use a Mac or iPhone with a Samsung screen, Samsung RAM, Samsung flash, etc. The truth is aside from software and a few small things like CPU mods, Apple doesn't actually make anything. They buy components from other companies, and wrap them in a pretty package.)
The proprietary components drive up maintenance and repair costs for Apple products far above what you pay for in terms of variance in PCs. If you look at the Dell or HP business lines, they take the opposite approach that Apple does - easy access and swapability of parts. If a business needs to minimizee "perplexing little issues", they'll buy few thousand of the exact same model. Their IT department can then learn all the idiosyncrasies. Just like they'd learn the idiosyncrasies of Macs if they bought all-Macs. (This is actually the rationale used by Southwest and their all-737 fleet - minimize maintenance and training costs.)
The OS X GUI doesn't give you enough info to diagnose most problems. But if you pop open a Terminal and use Unix commands (sometimes slightly modified by Apple), you can usually figure out what's wrong. OS X is just a pretty shell sitting on top of Unix.
- Oct 30, 2004
- 32,252
- 14
- 99,960
As the person responsible for keeping our boxes up and running, I can attest that it is by no means a myth. I am the help desk. In our SOHO, we have 12 machines, 1 is a Mac that was purchased 6 years ago. Personally, since I need Windows for AutoCAD, I can't use a Mac if I wanted to and after 25+ years of building PC's I don't want to simply because I am more familiar with the platform.
But I can say that the 6 year old Mac has not taken up 1 minute of my time in 6 years where as every single PC requires my attention at least monthly. Colleagues with similar responsibilities report the same. Some recent issues involving a switch in AV vendors.
-AV Software is incompatible with motherboard utilities .... installation req'd uninstall of AV, install of AV Software, reinstall of utilities.
-AV software is incompatible with software version control utility (scans machine reports any software that is out of date).
-Uninstall of old AV software went awry, uninstall left Device Manager with errors on all networking components...as yet unresolved.
-Just yesterday had a new problem where user can not save to a network drive (can open files, edit files and save files.... but can not save as to a different name) while AV is active (as yet unresolved). Developed a workaround (disable AV, save file, re-enable AV) but still no permanent solution.
Macs are for people who don't wanna know how a computer works, just want it to work. PC users tend to be enthusiasts. It's the PC's strength .... ability to work with thousands of different components that is also it's weakness. All those different possibilities leads to many possibilities of conflicts. For me, I'll take the good with the bad, I enjoy the tinkering and I'll put up with the conflicts. But I can certainly appreciate the outlook of peeps who just don't wanna be bothered.
Moonstick2
Distinguished
- Oct 3, 2014
- 996
- 246
- 19,790
That highlights the contradiction though, in that for a system that's sold on 'just working' and being highly user-friendly in contrast to Windows, a user might be expected to go into Terminal and start entering Unix-flavoured commands just to try and connect to their WiFi.
jsmithepa
Polypheme
- Jun 14, 2014
- 13,091
- 264
- 60,840
I agree. Apple stuff is great if everything works, but if one has to peel the onion and get underneath, Windows is actually friendlier.
For example, to access my Apple Airport I have to install some App, which is version dependent BTW, WHAT? can't get to it via a stupid browser like the rest of the World does?
Actually, the analogy to cars is not quite correct. Recently John Deere (tractors and such) and General Motors have been saying that if you work on your own equipment you are violating their DCMA rights and can be prosecuted. They are saying that you may own the vehicle but you don't own the firmware that controls it.
They're not saying you void your warranty. They are saying you commit a crime. Apple could, I suppose, go the same route.
Link: GM Says That While You May Own Your Car, It Owns The Software In It, Thanks To Copyright
I personally won't be buying any John Deere or GM products any more.
They're not saying you void your warranty. They are saying you commit a crime. Apple could, I suppose, go the same route.
Link: GM Says That While You May Own Your Car, It Owns The Software In It, Thanks To Copyright
I personally won't be buying any John Deere or GM products any more.
TRENDING THREADS
-
AMD RDNA 4 and Radeon RX 9000-series GPUs: Specifications, release date, pricing, and more revealed- Started by Admin
- Replies: 69
-
News AMD Radeon RX 9070 series prices leak on Micro Center — starting at nearly $700 for XT versions
- Started by Admin
- Replies: 138
-
-
News Sapphire Nitro+ RX 9070 XT hides its 16-pin connector inside, offers cableless look
- Started by Admin
- Replies: 9
-
News AMD estimates of Radeon RX 9070 XT performance leaked: 42% – 66% faster than Radeon RX 7900 GRE
- Started by Admin
- Replies: 88
-
Discussion What's your favourite video game you've been playing?- Started by amdfangirl
- Replies: 4K
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram