Why We Won't Install Windows 10 (in its present form)

[JackNaylorPE]

The argument behind Windows 10 force feeding us Windows Security, Windows Feature and Hardware Driver updates is that Security Updates "will make us safer". So much for making you safer ...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/17/windows-10-forced-automatic-updates/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/25/windows-10-automatic-update-problems/

50% of the non user caused IT problems I am forced to solve at user sites have involve some one allowing WU to install hardware drivers. Now, even before it's released it's causing havoc.

nVidia SLI installations are now unfunctional, and uninstalling the update just has it being put right back.

And the avalanche continues .....

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/27/windows-10-automatic-update-security-problems/

"KB3074681 had no detailed information about what it contained but as it was classified as a ‘security’ patch it installed immediately and without warning to all versions of Windows 10 (Home, Pro and Enterprise) then promptly caused Windows Explorer to crash for a number of users.

And in reality bad updates will happen. Historically there have been some epic Windows patch meltdowns and Woody Leonhard at InfoWorld notes that: “40 or so” problematic patches have been released by Windows Update in 2015 alone."

http://www.infoworld.com/article/2889295/microsoft-windows/20-epic-microsoft-windows-auto-update-meltdowns.html

http://www.infoworld.com/article/2949622/microsoft-windows/windows-10-forced-updates-dont-panic.html

And now it turns out that even Windows Pro users will be force fed security updates. It seems that Pro users have the option to install new features, but not security updates which are the source of most problems.

When Windows XP SP1 broke the AutoDesk Licensing Control, many of my colleagues had whole departments sitting around twiddling their thumbs because the update prevented them from obtaining an authorization from the company server. Yes, I want our computers to be secure, but the one thing more important than "secure" is "operable".

 

[James Mason]

Maybe this will force companies to not make such crappy software then?

A lot of problems is caused because people use super old and outdated software that often isn't even supported by the companies anymore.
And the software companies themselves are usually pretty lazy considering the huge licencing costs and fees they charge.

 

[WildCard999]

I didn't realize how bad the initial issues were with SLI and the whole "Win10 auto downloads everything for you" is complete BS. Even though I did my reserve I won't be downloading it unless I can gain more control of what is downloaded to my system.

Thanks for the info!

 

[JackNaylorPE]

Maybe this will force companies to not make such crappy software then?

A lot of problems is caused because people use super old and outdated software that often isn't even supported by the companies anymore.
And the software companies themselves are usually pretty lazy considering the huge licencing costs and fees they charge.

No, SLI isn't old and outdated....

Look at the links, the MS Windows Update breaking Windows.... the update given in the example, broke WINDOWS Explorer. All these security updates that cause the majority of the problems are OS problems, not software problems.

 

[McHenryB]

Whole departments shouldn't be left twiddling their thumbs because of a Windows Update. Any responsible IT department pushes out updates via their own WUS server and thouroughly test each update on the standard configuration of company PCs before releasing it.

As far as the home situation goes, I understand it Microsoft have released a tool to allow Windows Update to function as it curently does.

 

[Mr Soup]

I can't say I'm surprised. I'm glad I still have some Windows 7 licenses for my home computers. I'm guessing it will be around the time of service pack 1 before Windows 10 has enough updates and fixes to be worth the "upgrade". So that would be what, Fall of 2016 maybe?

Luckily, my IT department is slower than dirt to upgrade anything. We still have IE8: we see you are browsing from an antiquated pile of crap. Please use a real browser you pathetic loser. sigh. It's amazing I don't drink more.

 

[James Mason]

@ Soup, Windows 10 won't have service packs. And the free upgrade is only free until july 29th 2016.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

Windows 10 is free for "the life of the device", your window to get it free lasts one year from tomorrow.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/14/windows-10-unanswered-questions/

And the length of support....

Microsoft has now updated its lifecycle support page to list Windows 10. It states the end of Mainstream Support as October 13, 2020 and the end of Extended Support (security) as October 14, 2025.

 

[captaincharisma]

MS is only enabling the auto update in the home versions because the mainstream crowd is too dumb to even know how to update their computer and because of that they keep getting hacked and scammed. its a free upgrade anyway so you may be able to get a good price on upgrading to the pro version in the end

 

[JackNaylorPE]

1. Auto update is not ONLY on the Home Versions. From above link

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/14/windows-10-unanswered-questions/2/

Windows 10 Home’ users (which will be the vast majority of consumers) have no way of bypassing anything Microsoft wants them to install, while ‘Windows 10 Pro’ business users can delay (but not stop) upgrades for up to eight months. Only premium ‘Windows 10 Enterprise’ users can veto updates indefinitely.......

Much detail here

http://www.infoworld.com/article/2949622/microsoft-windows/windows-10-forced-updates-dont-panic.html

that means all Windows 10 Home users and Windows 10 Pro users who aren't attached to a server are going to get security patches as they're rolled out, all around the clock, all months long.

Security Updates will be force fed to both Home and Pro *
Hardware Drivers will be force fed to both Home and Pro
Added features will be force fed to Home Users but not Pro

* These can be delayed but not stopped.

2. You can no longer do an "anytime upgrade" from Home to Pro for Win7. You can however buy a new license.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

The *good* new just keeps on comin'

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/08/02/windows-10-vs-windows-8-vs-windows-7-whats-the-difference/2/


Win10 Forced Update breaks SLI
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/25/windows-10-automatic-update-problems/

WU KB3074681 breaks Windows Explorer
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/07/27/windows-10-automatic-update-security-problems/

WU breaks Windows Explorer causing continuous reboot loops
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/08/08/windows-10-forced-updates-causing-endless-crash-loop/

WU not only will force updates on the OS but apps as well
http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/08/13/windows-10-forced-updates-silent-changes/?utm_campaign=yahootix&partner=yahootix

Why was Win 10 free ? It's been surmised that selling the data they obtain by tracking you as well as the an anti-privacy "features" are worth well more than what they make of the OS.


http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/08/most-torrent-sites-banning-windows-10-users/

Parental Controls gone wild
http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/08/windows-10-spying-on-kids-surfing-details-for-parents/

 

[jimmysmitty]

http://www.tomshardware.com/faq/id-2763685/stop-windows-automatically-updating-device-drivers.html

You can turn off forced drivers pretty easily actually.

In any corporate environment, properly run, they will be running Enterprise level Windows which will be allowed to control updates via WSUS as companies are not really fans of having updates bork their systems.

I do like how you link an article for a torrent site blocking it when most torrent sites are piracy related. SO do you promote piracy? While not all are and I have nothing against torrenting, even some big companies have used it to distribute, I think if a site is blocking it for those reasons then it is because they have tons of pirated media and losing that media would kill their traffic.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

So we are led to think.

1. It has already been widely reported that this is ineffective in protecting privacy and only eliminates, or appears to eliminate, **some** of the activity. Despite the paid for infomercial like stories disguised as news poking fun at "privacy paranoia", the threat after those steps are taken are still real. You can shut off every privacy setting on all 13 pages and data will still be sent to MS. Why is Windows 10 Free ? Because they have adapted the same model as free software and free web content ... MS finance model is now centered on selling data instead of software licenses.

2. Even if you could plug the holes, the EULA specifically authorizes MS to remove said functionality, increase it or basically read, collect and distribute any content on your PC to anyone they choose. The language is not subject to interpretation; it's quite clear. And if you argue, legally and successfully, that you weren't aware you were getting into this situation when you upgraded..... MS will gladly refund your purchase price. Will MS monitor your e-mails / web activity on say knifecollector.com, rarepets.com, ashelymadison.com and sell the information to law enforcement, fish and game, American Association of Divorce Attorneys ? Who knows, but nothing in the EULA prohibits such.

3. One "feature" pundits like to refer to is, if it discovers a game that is pirated, it will disable it. Well what happens when it isn't. When my son is home from college and he plays one of his (non-steam) games that was originally installed on his PC at college, will it shut it down if he plays on my machine ? What happens when it shuts down an entire offices by "mistake" as when Windows XP SP1 killed every licensed networked AutoCAD installation, costing legitimate license holders thousands of dollars per day, per seat ?

4. As for this linked article ... Mainstream media has to much to lose by not singing the praises of Windows 10, as they did with Vista, as they did with ME, as they did with Win95. These **articles** generate way too many clicks / ad revenue to be poo pooing the new shiny thing.

5. Interesting that we also saw several articles yesterday on the 20 year anniversary of Win95. One had 7 things that the "great leap forward...revolutionary" Windows 95 OS was **introduced** that we still use today.... except that we don't actually have Win95 to thank as they already existed. "People waited on line for it" one article proclaimed ... none reported that it was actually 40% slower than W4WGs on identical hardware.

http://www.cheatsheet.com/gear-style/7-ways-windows-95-still-influences-computing-today.html/?a=viewall

1) Start Menu - Sorry this was provided in plain ole Windows via utilities like HPs Dashboard
2) Taskbar - Sorry, ditto
3) Long File Names - Nope again, W4WGs (aka Win 3.11) had LFN support
4) The Internet - Nope again, maybe te author wasn't there because web access actually required that you install something by yourself but Compuserve / Netscape were.
5) Plug 'n Play - While the concept might have been popularized w/ Win95, plug 'n play at the time was more troublesome as it didn't work as often as it did. No more fixing things w/ a simple edit of the autoexec.bat file using instructions we found on on a web site (w/o win95 even), now we had the pleasure of uninstalling a misbehaving driver only to have windows reinstall it right back. PnP wasn't really reliable until after Win2k.
6) Gaming - Really ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_7th_Guest
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doom_%281993_video_game%29
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Return_to_Zork
7) Your own desktop - In 30 years of using / building PCs and managing networks, I have never set up a 2nd desktop for another user. However, W4WGs also had user account functionality.


6. Interesting note also about the torrent thing as all Windows 10 users are by default running a torrent site. That's the new way to get Windows Updates.

7. The most nefarious feature however is the force fed updates. Why can Business and Pro users delay at least some of the force fed windows updates ? Cause they can afford lawyers, something a Home user is very unlikely to undertake.

8. Why is MS sending parents e-mails about their on-line activity of the parent did not ask them to ?

In short MS is a business not a philanthropist, there is one and only one reason why Win10 is free and cause they have an alternate income stream from selling the collected data just as google does.

 

[jimmysmitty]

3. This is the only one I will address. Again that has been shown to be part of the Service Agreement which refers to Microsoft services, such as the Store app and the XBox app. Not Windows itself. This is voided if you use a local account.

It does not mean they have the ability to disable a pirated game on Windows but through one of their services so say a XBox live game or Windows Store game.

Having a legitimate game on different PCs is not what it is looking for, it is looking to protect the Store from being hacked. I am sure Google would love to do this and Apple sure as hell has tried to stop it (remember when they permanently bricked jail broke iPhones???)

 

[JackNaylorPE]

I think we're focusing on different things, what it's doing now versus what the EULA permits. When Apple pay came out the reviews screamed "It's only accepted by a small number of retaiilers". That has changed much since.

Had they put this out where it was a "Lemme think about this" decision ... in other words ....not free, I think most peeps would have considered these issues more thoroughly.