Question Wifi issues

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Right then,

back at the beginning of February, I bought a custom PC for my workshop.

Specs:
MoBo: Gigabyte A320M (BIOS 11/03/20)
CPU: Ryzen 5 2600X
RAM: 16GB Crucial
On Board Graphics: NVIDIA GeForce GT 710

I bought from Amazon a uBit Wifi - Bluetooth PCIe card. The first few days all was well. No issues. Then once or twice a week, in the morning when I'd boot the computer, it was no longer listed in the Device Manager. A restart wouldn't find it. I would shut the PC down, unplug the card's power cord from the MoBo, wait about 20sec, plug back in, reboot, and it would work again.

After a few weeks, it became a daily event. I was in contact with the seller during this time, which was unhelpful. I sent the card back and exchanged it for the more expensive TP-Link card. Aye, Wifi and Bluetooth.

Now it's doing the same bloody thing! Both yesterday and today I've had to go through the same steps to get it to work.

There is another PCIe slot on the mainboard and I've tried that as well. No difference.

Not sure if this has any effect, but I have a rather old Logitech Webcam. It's perhaps 10-11 years old. I use it on occasion. Could it be causing a conflict somehow?

I can't seem to understand a reason for this. Starts off fine and slowly begins to become a pain in the arse.

Ideas?

Cheers!
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
Does the following link show the card you were using and returned?

https://www.amazon.com/Ubit-2-4Ghz-300Mbps-5Ghz-867Mbps-High-gain-Bluetooth/dp/B07G3385K7

Can you provide a link to the TP-Link card you purchased?

Windows 10?

I think a webcam conflict would be just that - a conflict. An immediate and just "will not work" conflict versus some growing issue.

However, if the webcam is not needed or rarely used. Uninstall it. Just as a matter of elimination.

Look in Reliability History for error codes, warnings, or even informational events that you can associate with the PCIe card issues.

When you first start the "work again cycle" look in Task Manager and Resource Monitor to observe what resources are being used, to what extent (%), and what is using any given resource.

Continue monitoring - you may catch some change. For the most part turning off the computer should delete any accumulating files, if any, related to the card.

Next time you are forced to do the "unplug restart reboot" process do so. And immediately check Resource Monitor and Task Manager again.

If you do this:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/bluetooth-connection-logging/e9168ec9-7b49-44f9-ae42-b5a8a16d5c11

Do you see any " setupapi" logs? If so what dates and file sizes?

I found 8 on my system. Some time-stamped? What do see on your system?

Do not immediately do anything with those files.

I am just exploring the possiblity that the problem grows with the size of those files. Which does not change when the system is powered off.....
 
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hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Does the following link show the card you were using and returned?

https://www.amazon.com/Ubit-2-4Ghz-300Mbps-5Ghz-867Mbps-High-gain-Bluetooth/dp/B07G3385K7

Can you provide a link to the TP-Link card you purchased?

Windows 10?
Aye, that is the uBit I had. This is the one I have currently: TP Link PCIe card

And yes, Windows 10.

I eliminated the webcam this morning. It was not listed again this morning. It is old and I've had complaints about the quality. Gone.

I did an sfc scan this morning also. Numerous errors and all were repaired. We'll see how it gets on tomorrow.

As far as the bluetooth, I rarely use it. I think I've used it twice since the PC arrived. It works well without issue.

I looked at the setupapi.dev files. There are 5, four of which are from Feb and one from 16 March. Each one is a wee over 4MB.

Not sure if this helps, but if I restart the PC during the day, there is no issue. An immediate restart is fine. It's only when I shut it down for the day and the next day it happens. Did again today.

Thanks for the assistance mate!

Cheers!
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
You are welcome.

Not sure what to suggest.

Give it all a few days to see what develops or otherwise changes.

Try running Resource Monitor in the background. See if you can identify (via the Memory tab) some Process that either appears or disappears with respect to restarts or cold boots (after being shut down for the day and powered up the next day).
 

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Give it all a few days to see what develops or otherwise changes.

Try running Resource Monitor in the background. See if you can identify (via the Memory tab) some Process that either appears or disappears with respect to restarts or cold boots (after being shut down for the day and powered up the next day).
with the Resource Monitor, what might I need look for?

At the same time... a resource monitor. I understand to a degree, what it does, but don't follow how it would involve a device disappearing.
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
I had memory usage in mind.

Memory filling up and not being released until the computer is physically shutdown.

With respect to a "device disappearing" that is a fair and good point.

I am always astounded by how much can be going on with respect to the CPU, and Processes in general.

For more on the latter, try Process Explorer (free) via Microsoft's website.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/process-explorer

Key is to tie the observed behavior, directly or by some pattern, to what the system doing or even not doing.

A missing device could be missing simply because some necessary process etc. is not there.
 

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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For more on the latter, try Process Explorer (free) via Microsoft's website.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/process-explorer

Key is to tie the observed behavior, directly or by some pattern, to what the system doing or even not doing.

A missing device could be missing simply because some necessary process etc. is not there.
I'll give the process explorer a wee go. At the same time, would it not make sence that if there was a missing process, then the card would not work at all. It works on restart, but not when I shut down at night. Unless, that is causing the process to disappear.

And yes, same thing this morning. And I did FA with the PC yesterday. Music, a few YouTube videos, email. Nothing extraneous. This is odd, indeed.

Ralston, I do appreciate your assistance on this. Cheers!
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
Agree it does not make sense....

My thoughts:

When the computer is running (and all is well) at some time a process is getting launched and into memory.

Or something is being triggered that perhaps corresponds with the disappearance...

Manages to stay there during restarts.

But is gone/lost when the computer is powered off and volatile memory cleared.

Take a look at Task Scheduler (Task Scheduler Library).

Look for any entries that you can associate with "uBit Wifi" or "Bluetooth PCIe card" and the subsequent disappearing act.

Need another clue or two.
 

hondoman

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Take a look at Task Scheduler (Task Scheduler Library).

Look for any entries that you can associate with "uBit Wifi" or "Bluetooth PCIe card" and the subsequent disappearing act.

Need another clue or two.
I've looked at the Task Scheduler the past two days. Nothing really there. I wish I could add a screen shot, but seems a non-starter.

The Scheduler has CCleaner, Windows and Nvidia entries. Roughly 15 entries for two days.

Thoughts?
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
Is CCleaner being launched at startup (see Task Manager > Startup tab)?

If so, disable. At least temporarily.

[Note: For the most part CCleaner is not really necessary and I uninstalled it quite some time ago.]

If not, try to determine via Task Scheduler what and when CCleaner is being started/triggered.

My thought is that CCleaner (perhaps along with other TBD circumstances) may be removing files that are necessary for the PCIe card to fully and properly function.
 

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Is CCleaner being launched at startup (see Task Manager > Startup tab)?

If so, disable. At least temporarily.

[Note: For the most part CCleaner is not really necessary and I uninstalled it quite some time ago.]

If not, try to determine via Task Scheduler what and when CCleaner is being started/triggered.

My thought is that CCleaner (perhaps along with other TBD circumstances) may be removing files that are necessary for the PCIe card to fully and properly function.
CCleaner does two things each morning. One is an updater and the second is CCleanerSkipUAC. As I understand it, CCleanerSkipUAC is nothing more than an entry designed to prevent the user from having to click yes to the UAC pop-up when opening CCleaner.

Something interesting happened this morning. Interested to see your take on this Ralston.

This morning, I booted up the PC. Again, no WLAN. I shut it down, frustrated over this, I went for a coffee. Gone about 20 minutes. I returned and booted the PC. The WLAN was and is working. Odd indeed! What are your thoughts on that?

Whilst on the topic of oddities.... This PCIe card is a TP-Link Archer TX50E AX3000, the Device Manager shows it as Intel Wi-fi 6 AX200. You're the expert, but is that odd or is the Device Manager showing the generic name or chip name?

I truly appreciate you sticking this out with me. I am sincerely grateful.

Cheers!
 

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Run "ipconfig /all" (without quotes) and post the results.


Wireless LAN adapter WLAN:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : home
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Intel(R) Wi-Fi 6 AX200 160MHz
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : E0-D4-E8-DF-76-6D
DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
IPv6 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 2a02:810d:12bf:fb54:fd33:2306:9715:b52e(Preferred)
Temporary IPv6 Address. . . . . . : 2a02:810d:12bf:fb54:3d6b:d82:f172:c420(Preferred)
Link-local IPv6 Address . . . . . : fe80::fd33:2306:9715:b52e%10(Preferred)
IPv4 Address. . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.135(Preferred)
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : 29 March 2021 08:13:24
Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : 05 April 2021 08:13:27
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : fe80::5e35:3bff:fec4:acf6%10
192.168.0.1
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.0.1
DHCPv6 IAID . . . . . . . . . . . : 427305798
DHCPv6 Client DUID. . . . . . . . : 00-01-00-01-27-B0-8E-85-2C-F0-5D-6E-02-EF
DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 2a02:810d:12bf:fb54:5e35:3bff:fec4:acf6
192.168.0.1
NetBIOS over Tcpip. . . . . . . . : Enabled
Connection-specific DNS Suffix Search List :
home

Ethernet adapter Bluetooth-Netzwerkverbindung:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected
Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : Bluetooth Device (Personal Area Network)
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : E0-D4-E8-DF-76-71
DHCP Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
 

hondoman

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Are you sure that Bluetooth is enabled on your system?
Aye, I keep it turned off unless I need it. Works a treat.

Yesterday morning, the same thing occurred that happened on the Monday. Powered on - no WLAN - power off - wait 15-20 min - power on again - WLAN works. I find that odd.

Last night, I decided to look a bit more online. Initially, I was searching for TPLink Archer TX50E. So I searched for the Intel AX200 instead. Seems this PCIe card has issues. I also found a few that were having issues similar to mine.

One site said to do clean install of the wee card. I did so. Uninstalled and deleted the drivers for both the WLAN and BT.

I also read to always install the BT first.

I did both - clean install and on re-install, BT first, then the WLAN. After, I shut down for the night and went home.

This morning, I powered up the PC and...the WLAN was working! Could be a fluke. I'll see what happens tomorrow and Friday.

The thing I find odd is my second line above...the 15min wait and then it works. I can't get my head around what causes that. Might you have an idea on that matter?

Cheers!
 

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
15 - 20 minute wait...

Very odd indeed.

The key will be discovering something that happens when the system is first powered on. Some update, backup, power saver, etc. that get launched, does whatever, and thus interferes with WLAN. However that "whatever" also may set some flag that lasts for some period of time.

Meaning that the restart determines that whatever took place does not need to be immediately done again. At least within some given period of time.

Look in Task Manager > Startup.

Also use Reliability History and Event Viewer to determine what all is running right after an initial boot. Especially if WLAN is not working.

And you can find even more via Task Scheduler and Process Explorer.

Then look again after the restart - you may find something now running or perhaps not running.

May now be moot if the installs fixed the problem....

= = = =

Another way to look:

You may also be able to use a Powershell "Get" cmdlet to look for network related processes: Some difference (either way) between WLAN not working and then working again 15 - 20 minutes later. Then again, the problem may not be network related per se so broader view is needed anyway.

Open Powershell as admin and run "Get-Process" (without quotes) to see all the running processes.

FYI - for more information if you are interested in such things,

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/module/microsoft.powershell.management/get-process?view=powershell-7.1
 

hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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Good morning Ralston,

Aye, I'm always interested in learning... especially PC matters. At 57, this still interests me. I owned my first PC in 1992, built my first one in 1998 (don't recall all the specs, except for the VooDoo graphics card). I did some computer forensics between 1999 and 2005, but have since taken different roads in life. Regardless, it still fascinates me.

Now, to the matter at hand. I continue to look at Task Manager, Task Scheduler, Powershell, etc. I'm not seeing anything that 'red flags' my attention. Not even 100% sure what I should be looking for. I do this both on the initial boot-up (no WLAN) and second boot-up (with WLAN). But I do agree with this thinking, that there is a process that is affecting the card.

I'm presently down to a 4min wait time between the first and second boot-up. The card works only on the second. Tomorrow I'll try at 3min.

I've joined the TP-Link and Intel forums. Goes without saying that both sites claim the Mainboard is the issue. My argument is, if that were the case, then explain why other people with different mainboards are experiencing the same issue. That, they cannot contradict.

A restart after the initial boot-up does not repair it. One must shut down and wait.

A restart after the second boot-up does not effect the card. The card is still there and working.

This past week, I shut down between 17.30 and 18.00. Came back to the shop between 21.00 and 21.30, booted the PC and the card was working.

Something is happening after midnight?

Date change - BIOS - Windows 10 - PCIe card.

Also, my brain is telling me it might not be the WLAN side of the card causing the issue. Could the BT be effecting it in some manner?

I don't have a **** [ Moderator deleted profanity] load of programmes on this PC. Aside from Windows, I have Thunderbird and Firefox, Adobe Acrobat, WhatsApp, Belarc, CPU-Z, Kasperky Logitech and Spotify. I am seriously considering a clean reinstall of Windows. Perhaps as Windows re-installs itself with the card in-place, it could correct itself. Dunno.

What are your thoughts?
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
I wish I had some specific thing to "look for" but (full disclosure) I do not.

However, I do know that continuing to look may eventually reveal some event or some stream of events that correspond to the problem.

Including "Gremlins"..... :)

Intermittent problems are the toughest. There may be some relationship between working/not working and the host computer "warming" up. Problem when cold but works on the restart after TBD components have warmed up and expanded. But only if the system had cooled below some threshold temperature overnight. If not below that threshold - then boots and works.

Reading back, there are still things to look at try.

"sfc /scannow" and "dism".

References:

https://www.lifewire.com/how-to-use-sfc-scannow-to-repair-windows-system-files-2626161

https://www.howtogeek.com/222532/how-to-repair-corrupted-windows-system-files-with-the-sfc-and-dism-commands/

[Noted that in Post #4 that you did run "sfc /scannow". I would still run it another time or two. If "sfc" finds and has to repair numerous errors then that indeed makes a case for a clean reinstall.]

Another thought is the PSU: make, model, wattage, age, condition? Power to the PCIe slots could be starting to falter. There are problems no matter which slot is used - correct? Or what card is used for that matter.

No harm in checking as a matter of elimination.

https://www.lifewire.com/how-to-manually-test-a-power-supply-with-a-multimeter-2626158

All the more so as the system appears to have a history of varying problems.

Decide on whatever you wish to test and try.

Including perhaps installing and testing a dedicated USB WIFI dongle. Use a USB extension cable to move the dongle up and away from the back of the host computer.

Or in the interim someone else following this thread may spot some error of omission or commission on my part. I have no problem with that....

If nothing turns up or a permanent fix is not found then do the clean reinstall. Use the Reinstall process by @Darkbreeze
here in Tom's Forum.

https://forums.tomshardware.com/faq/windows-10-clean-install-tutorial.3170366/

(Be sure all data is backed up x 2 and proven recoverable and readable. And that those backups are not on drives not connected to the problem computer.)

My thoughts:

Overall, we could probably continue trouble-shooting for a long time. At some point (up to you to determine) just do a reinstall and hope that doing so removes some deeply embedded software glitch or, if not, adds weight to a possible motherboard or PSU problem.
 
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hondoman

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Jul 24, 2014
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My thoughts:

Overall, we could probably continue trouble-shooting for a long time. At some point (up to you to determine) just do a reinstall and hope that doing so removes some deeply embedded software glitch or, if not, adds weight to a possible motherboard or PSU problem.
Good morning Ralston,

Since the Saturday last, I continued to look each morning through the various programmes you recommended. Both on the initial (failed) boot-up and the second (working) boot. Nothing to report there.

However.... since Tuesday, the bleeding card is working on the first boot! Aye, the past four mornings, the card was recognised on the first boot. I have no clue why not do I expect this to continue. Odd, indeed.

One thing I also learned on the weekend last. It would seem I made a massive mistake. I bought the TP Link PCIe card thinking it would be better or different. How wrong I was. Both the TP-Link and the uBit card are the same bloody thing! Both are the Intel AX200. I feel like a bawbag. I had no idea that was a thing these days. Both companies buy the same card from Intel and place their branding on it.

If the fail continues, I will sell the TP-Link and look for either a different card or look to separate the WLAN and BT. I had a USB WLAN from TP-Link in the past. It was ok, but over time began to have issues. As I also learned, it is quite normal as USBs tend to weaken over time. The Mainboard has two PCIe slots and a PCI slot, plus USB 3 and 2. So, I have several options.

I have spoken with Intel, TP-Link, Gigabyte and Microsoft. The only advise each had was to point a corporate finger at the others. Even when I explained to both MS and Intel that this is not a mainboard issue, as the same problem exists with other mainboards. FFS! What a bloody mess.

Again, thanks for your assistance and the ideas. Learning various new things is always great fun!
 
wifi6 stuff is still fairly new so you always see strange issues for a couple years. Almost nobody that sell wifi stuff actually makes the chipsets. Intel is one of the very few that sells end user stuff and make chips. Almost all other wifi stuff is made by broadcom or mediatek or a small number of other companies. Every router or nic card uses these chips. Mostly this is relelated to the difficulty in getting all the FCC license stuff done. So pretty much all devices that use the same chipset perform more or less the same. The key difference is how good is things like warentee support and do they actually give you the drivers updates or do you have to know to get them directly from the chipset vendor.

Note do not get too hung up on wifi6. Wifi6e is just coming to market and all this driver stuff starts over again but wifi6e should solve most the problems of overcrowding radio bands for a while.
 

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