win98 -- what would cause a dropped frame every 20 minutes?

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i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
frame. any ideas what?


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
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"wowfabgroovy" <wowfabgroovy@wowmail.com> wrote in message
news:40e735db.44741296@news.easynews.com...
> i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
> for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
> installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
> capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
> mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
> and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
> service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
> to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
> savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
> kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
> frame. any ideas what?

might be the capture driver/app compensating for audio stream drift
by inserting/dropping a frame to bring things back in line.

you won't notice it, in any case...

(1 frame out of 30,000)

>
>
> --
> warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
> stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
> a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 

Rick

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Is this machine on a network? If DHCP is enabled try disabling it.

Rick

"wowfabgroovy" <wowfabgroovy@wowmail.com> wrote in message news:40e735db.44741296@news.easynews.com...
> i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
> for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
> installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
> capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
> mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
> and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
> service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
> to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
> savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
> kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
> frame. any ideas what?
>
>
> --
> warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
> stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
> a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
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"wowfabgroovy" <wowfabgroovy@wowmail.com> wrote in message
news:40e735db.44741296@news.easynews.com...
> i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
> for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
> installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
> capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
> mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
> and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
> service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
> to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
> savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
> kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
> frame. any ideas what?

It seems far from the normal topic where I have read your advice so often
about compressed audio:

Boot up, start - run - type in msconfig - choose selective startup - reboot
and start capturing again. Bob's your uncle.

I don't have a 98 box on my network right now, so I don't have the exact
process at my fingertips, but I beleive that the same thing that restarts
defrag in W98 and W98SE could be plaguing your capture.
 
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wowfabgroovy wrote:
> i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
> for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
> installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
> capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
> mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
> and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
> service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
> to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
> savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
> kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
> frame. any ideas what?
>
>
Could it be win98s file size limitation and you are shifting from one
2/4 gig file to the next file?

GA

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> you won't notice it, in any case...
>
> (1 frame out of 30,000)

I would disagree - if a dropped frame is in the middle of a panning shot it
would be very jarring indeed and unless you're compiling a family video of
the kids it'd be unacceptable.
 
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"Damien Evans" <guest@anon.com> wrote in message
news:2kp146F4sevnU1@uni-berlin.de...
> > you won't notice it, in any case...
> >
> > (1 frame out of 30,000)
>
> I would disagree - if a dropped frame is in the middle of a panning shot
it
> would be very jarring indeed and unless you're compiling a family video of
> the kids it'd be unacceptable.
>
>

I would disagree with your disagree...

An event of 1/25 of a sec will not be noticeable
UNLESS you're looking for it ;-)

Try it yourself, with your editing s/w-
yank a frame out of a clip and then watch it.

Bear in mind what I said, YOU will
be purposefully LOOKING specifically
for the glitch, so show it to somebody else.
 
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> I would disagree - if a dropped frame is in the middle of a panning shot
it
> would be very jarring indeed and unless you're compiling a family video of
> the kids it'd be unacceptable.

I use a program called Virtual VCR for capturing which resamples the audio
'on the fly' to avoid the need to add/drop frames.
 
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Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:

>Could it be win98s file size limitation and you are shifting from one
>2/4 gig file to the next file?

no, if it was that it would happen every 5 minutes and 30 seconds.
that's how long a 2gig avi file with my settings lasts for.


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
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wowfabgroovy wrote:

> changed streamerrorhandler to 0.

What is this? And why?
 
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Bariloche <bariloche@bariloche.com> went:

>wowfabgroovy wrote:
>
>> changed streamerrorhandler to 0.
>
>What is this? And why?

it's a setting in the registry for the dc10plus driver. by default
it's set to 1 and will cause a dropped frame every time there is a
very slight fault on the video tape. it seems to have been removed
from the xp drivers, hence the reason for using win98 for capture.


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
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W98 has a capture limitation of 18minutes because of the file size
limitation of W98. Wxp does not have this limitation.
Personally I never felt it was a limitation for after all in the REAL world
of film making they only have 10 minute film loads. As the transision
progresses to HD you will be able to let the cameras roll all week long,
space available of course.
Yours,
tom
"wowfabgroovy" <wowfabgroovy@wowmail.com> wrote in message
news:40ff9b8a.34602687@news.easynews.com...
> Bariloche <bariloche@bariloche.com> went:
>
> >wowfabgroovy wrote:
> >
> >> changed streamerrorhandler to 0.
> >
> >What is this? And why?
>
> it's a setting in the registry for the dc10plus driver. by default
> it's set to 1 and will cause a dropped frame every time there is a
> very slight fault on the video tape. it seems to have been removed
> from the xp drivers, hence the reason for using win98 for capture.
>
>
> --
> warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
> stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
> a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 

Brian

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wowfabgroovy <wowfabgroovy@wowmail.com> wrote:

>i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
>for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
>installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
>capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
>mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
>and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
>service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
>to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
>savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
>kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
>frame. any ideas what?

Try defragging your hard drive.

Regards Brian
 
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Brian <bclark@es.co.nz> went:

>Try defragging your hard drive.

the hard drive is always empty when i capture.


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
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wowfabgroovy wrote:

> Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:
>
>
>>Could it be win98s file size limitation and you are shifting from one
>>2/4 gig file to the next file?
>
>
> no, if it was that it would happen every 5 minutes and 30 seconds.
> that's how long a 2gig avi file with my settings lasts for.
>
>
So it is a factor of 4 (to get to 20 min) or an 8 gig file. Maybe that
is a limit on the partition and the recording program shifts to another
partition? I know some programs (like vdub) do allow you to set limits
in a partition and shift to another partition.

Still guessing.

GA

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"twobirds" <notareal@eaddy.com> went:

>I don't have a 98 box on my network right now, so I don't have the exact
>process at my fingertips, but I beleive that the same thing that restarts
>defrag in W98 and W98SE could be plaguing your capture.
>

any idea what it's called? i couldn't find any reference to anything
like that in any of the usual startup places.


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
G

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Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:

>wowfabgroovy wrote:
>
>> Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:
>>
>>
>>>Could it be win98s file size limitation and you are shifting from one
>>>2/4 gig file to the next file?
>>
>>
>> no, if it was that it would happen every 5 minutes and 30 seconds.
>> that's how long a 2gig avi file with my settings lasts for.
>>
>>
>So it is a factor of 4 (to get to 20 min) or an 8 gig file. Maybe that
>is a limit on the partition and the recording program shifts to another
>partition? I know some programs (like vdub) do allow you to set limits
>in a partition and shift to another partition.
>
>Still guessing.
>
>GA

i think that's a bit of a red fish. changing the compression rate (and
therefore increasing the number of minutes per 2gig file) doesn't make
any difference to the frequency of dropped frames. it's still one
every 20 minutes.


--
warning -- bbc7 and an increasing number of other stereo radio
stations are broadcast in 1960s style mono on dab digital radio,
a system that is supposedly "the future of radio".
 
G

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wowfabgroovy wrote:
> Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:
>
>
>>wowfabgroovy wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Gordon Abbot <gabbot@mmo.net> went:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Could it be win98s file size limitation and you are shifting from one
>>>>2/4 gig file to the next file?
>>>
>>>
>>>no, if it was that it would happen every 5 minutes and 30 seconds.
>>>that's how long a 2gig avi file with my settings lasts for.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>So it is a factor of 4 (to get to 20 min) or an 8 gig file. Maybe that
>>is a limit on the partition and the recording program shifts to another
>>partition? I know some programs (like vdub) do allow you to set limits
>>in a partition and shift to another partition.
>>
>>Still guessing.
>>
>>GA
>
>
> i think that's a bit of a red fish. changing the compression rate (and
> therefore increasing the number of minutes per 2gig file) doesn't make
> any difference to the frequency of dropped frames. it's still one
> every 20 minutes.
>
>
run Sisoft Sandra and see what is running.

GA

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"Gordon Abbot" <gabbot@mmo.net> wrote in message
news:aK-dnWl6c_hBEXfdRVn-gQ@suscom-maine.net...
> >
> > i think that's a bit of a red fish. changing the compression rate (and
> > therefore increasing the number of minutes per 2gig file) doesn't make
> > any difference to the frequency of dropped frames. it's still one
> > every 20 minutes.
> >
> >
> run Sisoft Sandra and see what is running.

How old is the HD you're running? If it's older, you may be experiencing
thermal recalibration - that's more likely to hit the 20-minute interval.
 
G

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I'm sorry, but exactly what is your problem. I doubt anyone can even see, let
alone miss one frame every twenty minutes.

That being said, it probably has do to with the odd frames per second of NTSC
TV, which is 29.97, not 30 FPS. If it were a problem with your hard drives are
something else serious, you would be dropping massive frames which would be
totally obvious to the human eye.

"Tony" <tony23@dslextreme.com> wrote in message
news:10em0th7kl2k7d7@corp.supernews.com...
> "Gordon Abbot" <gabbot@mmo.net> wrote in message
> news:aK-dnWl6c_hBEXfdRVn-gQ@suscom-maine.net...
> > >
> > > i think that's a bit of a red fish. changing the compression rate (and
> > > therefore increasing the number of minutes per 2gig file) doesn't make
> > > any difference to the frequency of dropped frames. it's still one
> > > every 20 minutes.
> > >
> > >
> > run Sisoft Sandra and see what is running.
>
> How old is the HD you're running? If it's older, you may be experiencing
> thermal recalibration - that's more likely to hit the 20-minute interval.
>
>
 
G

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>i've set up a clean install of win98 (on a removable hard disk) just
>for running studio 9 and capturing with a dc10plus. i haven't
>installed anything else, and i've disabled all hardware except for the
>capture card and sound card (and anything else that's necessary, like
>mouse, etc). i've disabled read ahead and write behind optimisation,
>and disabled auto insert for the cdroms. i've disabled all run and run
>service programs through the registry and changed streamerrorhandler
>to 0. resolution is set at 800x600 16bit colour. there are no screen
>savers or power management settings active. but something seems to be
>kicking in like clockwork every 20 minutes or so and causing a dropped
>frame. any ideas what?

Vance is definately right with his statement. The drop is here to
compensate a very minor audio / video drift.

As he pointed out you will not be able to notice this in the final
production. Resampling the audio as Damien sugested would be a
similar aproach and while some people say that they could see one
missing or double frame out of 30'000 there are also people which say
they could hear the resampling of the audio...

Markus
 

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