Question z690 w/ 64g DDR4 or z690/ z790 w/ 32g DDR5?

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zmihlrad

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Nov 20, 2018
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I am absolutely stuck on what to do for a motherboard on ram...

It is by far the most confusing part of the build to me.

This is where I stand so far
https://pcpartpicker.com/list/vkp3v3

Originally I was going to do a z690 Aorus elite with 2x32 of DDR4 3600.

Now after basically everything saying over 32g isnt really worthwhile, Im wondering should I get a z690 or z790 that supports DDR5 and do 2x16 of DDR5 for roughly the same price as the 64g of DDR4.

It seems the z790 is just wasted money for an extra PCI 4.0 lane that I probably wont use.

That said, I don't really know what speed DDR5 to aim for. 5000-6000 seems realistic on price value but I really don't know what I'm doing...
 
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Gam3r01 said:
What are you using the system for?
Do you have a need for that capacity of RAM?
Adding additional RAM only benefits you if you actually use it.
Click to expand...

I'm using it for Autocad Fusion 360 for CAD design and gaming.

Fusion 360 operates on a single core from the processor, and probably uses RAM for rendering models.

Games self explanatory.

Realistically, if I go the DDR5 route, I can always say this is bogging down and buy 2 more sticks.

With the plan of having this unit for the next ~5 years, I feel like going DDR4 would be setting myself up to be antiquated.
 
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Are you considering Z690 rather than Z790 purely for budget reasons?

I'd lean to Z790 and 32 GB of DDR 5 unless budget forces otherwise. Maybe 5600 speed.

You know yourself better than we do.....

What would frustrate you more (buyer's remorse):

1: "I goofed....I could have had performance X but I settled for the lesser Y for about the same money". Regardless of if that is true.

or

2: "I goofed....I could have saved myself X dollars if I had chosen something else and never noticed the difference". Regardless of if that is true.

I assume you have rejected B series boards for a good but unstated reason.

Regardless...there's an excellent chance you wouldn't notice the difference between any two reasonably close configurations other than in a benchmark. But maybe you are very conscious of benchmarks and very prone to second-guessing yourself. Either of those factors increases the possibility of disappointment.
 
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Lafong said:
Are you considering Z690 rather than Z790 purely for budget reasons?

I'd lean to Z790 and 32 GB of DDR 5 unless budget forces otherwise. Maybe 5600 speed.

You know yourself better than we do.....

What would frustrate you more (buyer's remorse):

1: "I goofed....I could have had performance X but I settled for the lesser Y for about the same money". Regardless of if that is true.

or

2: "I goofed....I could have saved myself X dollars if I had chosen something else and never noticed the difference". Regardless of if that is true.

I assume you have rejected B series boards for a good but unstated reason.

Regardless...there's an excellent chance you wouldn't notice the difference between any two reasonably close configurations other than in a benchmark. But maybe you are very conscious of benchmarks and very prone to second-guessing yourself. Either of those factors increases the possibility of disappointment.
Click to expand...

Honestly my budget isn't really limited. It is a b usiness expense (out of my personal business), but I try my best not to spend money for the sake of spending money if it has no real return. My current machine handles every task I do but it gets bogged down and its an inconvienience when I do use it to make money in the end.

Buyers remorse is definitely more of a concern, than an extra $100. I will say so far i've added $700 to the original price of this build, at some point I do need to throttle down...

If you were to go with a Z790 board, which would be your go to? Preferably in the $250-300 range if thats possible.
 
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zmihlrad said:
Honestly my budget isn't really limited. It is a b usiness expense (out of my personal business), but I try my best not to spend money for the sake of spending money if it has no real return. My current machine handles every task I do but it gets bogged down and its an inconvienience when I do use it to make money in the end.

Buyers remorse is definitely more of a concern, than an extra $100. I will say so far i've added $700 to the original price of this build, at some point I do need to throttle down...

If you were to go with a Z790 board, which would be your go to? Preferably in the $250-300 range if thats possible.
Click to expand...

You are putting yourself in a bind to an extent if you need to buy soon.

There are limited boards available with minimal reviews

The reviews you can find are likely gaming-centric and concentrate on "maximum" settings that may have very little relationship to how you personally use the machine.

Have you pounded on Autocad forums to see where the 700 dollars you have added might best be spent?

When push comes to shove....does gaming performance trump work/Autocad performance? Are you 80 work/20 gaming or the reverse?

I have no idea about your video card choice. Could be perfect for you.

13700K versus 13600K? The former might have cooling issues not seen on the latter. For how much gain?

Did you go with liquid cooling for a particular reason beyond "somebody said I needed it" or "I'm afraid of temp X"?

Boards....I have no recommendation, but I would not assume 300 dollars rather than 200 would result in a better experience. Quality control rears its head at all times on PC stuff, other than the CPU itself.
 
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Lafong said:
You are putting yourself in a bind to an extent if you need to buy soon.

There are limited boards available with minimal reviews

The reviews you can find are likely gaming-centric and concentrate on "maximum" settings that may have very little relationship to how you personally use the machine.

Have you pounded on Autocad forums to see where the 700 dollars you have added might best be spent?

When push comes to shove....does gaming performance trump work/Autocad performance? Are you 80 work/20 gaming or the reverse?

I have no idea about your video card choice. Could be perfect for you.

13700K versus 13600K? The former might have cooling issues not seen on the latter. For how much gain?

Did you go with liquid cooling for a particular reason beyond "somebody said I needed it" or "I'm afraid of temp X"?

Boards....I have no recommendation, but I would not assume 300 dollars rather than 200 would result in a better experience. Quality control rears its head at all times on PC stuff, other than the CPU itself.
Click to expand...

You think wait X amount of time before buying the new release basically?

The radiator was just becasue I like the look in the case mostly.


Either way I need to pick a MOBO and ram :/
 
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zmihlrad said:
You think wait X amount of time before buying the new release basically?

The radiator was just becasue I like the look in the case mostly.
Click to expand...

I don't buy new generation stuff when first released, BUT waiting is no guarantee of anything.

You are rolling dice regardless of your choices more than you'd prefer. No way out of that.

I don't buy coolers based on look. My cases don't have glass to see anything. I would have no qualms about air cooling on a 13600K given my work loads.

You may have extreme work loads that demand liquid cooling. Might take you weeks or months to research that properly given your specific board, CPU, case airflow, ambient temps, etc.

Most users are at idle or low loads most of the time. Me probably 95% of the time. Maybe not you.

How often is it important to you that task X takes 11 seconds or minutes rather than 15? Quite rarely for most people, including me.

Maybe frames per second is a major factor to you..more than Autocad.

There are a number of ways of "de-tuning" 13th gen CPUs to tame their power use if necessary. May not matter to you.

Obviously, a person can get into "analysis paralysis" easily with this stuff. Maybe you've been there for days.
 
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Lafong said:
I don't buy new generation stuff when first released, BUT waiting is no guarantee of anything.

You are rolling dice regardless of your choices more than you'd prefer. No way out of that.

I don't buy coolers based on look. My cases don't have glass to see anything. I would have no qualms about air cooling on a 13600K given my work loads.

You may have extreme work loads that demand liquid cooling. Might take you weeks or months to research that properly given your specific board, CPU, case airflow, ambient temps, etc.

Most users are at idle or low loads most of the time. Me probably 95% of the time. Maybe not you.

How often is it important to you that task X takes 11 seconds or minutes rather than 15? Quite rarely for most people, including me.

Maybe frames per second is a major factor to you..more than Autocad.

There are a number of ways of "de-tuning" 13th gen CPUs to tame their power use if necessary. May not matter to you.

Obviously, a person can get into "analysis paralysis" easily with this stuff. Maybe you've been there for days.
Click to expand...

Its probably 60% gaming 40% work.

The liquid cooling was $100 it was cheaper than a DH15 especially considering it also replaces 3 fans at the case front.

I was really just trying to build a machine that will stay relevant longer. At the cost of an extra hundred dollars here and there it doesn't seem like it makes sense not to.

And yes, been trying to figure this out for a week.
 
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Looking at these two boards. The z690 is pretty tried and true as one of the top selling boards.

I am trying to learn as I go here, the only real benefit I can see from the z790 is the ability to run the top tiers of DDR5, which I certainly do not need. Am I missing anything else there?

If I bought the 790 it seems it would strictly be a matter of latest and greatest with zero actual benefit.

Aorus Elite z690 DDR5- $200
https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-z690-aorus-elite-ax/p/N82E16813145366?Item=N82E16813145366


Aorus Elite z790 AX DDR5 - $250 (releases 10/31/22)
https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813145417?Item=N82E16813145417

Honorable mention, Not really sure what benefit there is here other than Wifi 6E which I can't use without spending $400+ on a new mesh system.

Aorus Master z690 DDR5 - $300
https://www.amazon.com/GIGABYTE-Z69...mzn1.fos.c3015c4a-46bb-44b9-81a4-dc28e6d374b3
 
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Trying to pick out what sticks I am going to use.

I want 32g for now, with the option to expand so I assume I should be going with 2x16gb sticks.

I am looking at the below. I really have no basis for picking a 6000 speed, it just seems like a happy area between speed and the upper echelon of prices for 7000 speed range.

G.Skill trident RGB, 6000-CL36. Its my basic understanding that lower latency is superior. Option here is basically a CL 36 or 40.

https://www.amazon.com/G-Skill-Trid...mzn1.fos.f5122f16-c3e8-4386-bf32-63e904010ad0


Looks like A new version is releasing in a few days that is slightly less expensive however it is a CL40.
https://www.newegg.com/g-skill-32gb-288-pin-ddr5-sdram/p/N82E16820374353
 
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Hellfire13 said:
Memory speed and latency impacts differently between Intel and AMD. For Intel it might not be as much relevant as AMD. So, it depends on which platform you are on.
If you are on Intel, then anything decent in terms of speed/latency is fine. If you are on AMD, it might be more beneficial to get a little bit better specs. than Intel...
https://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/ddr5_ryzen_7_7700_ddr5_memory_scaling_review,19.html
Click to expand...
Looking to use the new 13th gen intel I7.
 
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A few considerations:

Ram must be matched to perform properly.
If you buy a 2 x 16gb kit now, do not assume that you can add another kit and that it will work properly. If you will have a definite need for 64gb in the future, either buy it up front or be prepared to replace the initial 32gb kit.

13th gen I7 supports both DDR4 and DDR5. There is no significant difference in performance.
But ddr4 ram and the supporting motherboards are cheaper.

Is this a gaming build?
If so, you might want to read this article:
www.pcgamer.com

Don't waste money chasing RAM speed for gaming on AMD or Intel

Revisiting the question that every gamer considers when building a new gaming system: does RAM speed matter?
www.pcgamer.com www.pcgamer.com
 
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I am seriously stuck on both MOBO and RAM choice.

This is the build as of right now

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/KYxWwc

Will be used for 50% gaming 50% AutoCAD.

I've never overclocked a PC, might consider it if needed.

Looking to do 2x16gb of ram to leave room for another 2 sticks.

Budget isnt a massive concern but I am by no means a power user either.

It does not seem like I would NEED a z790.

DDR4 seems to remain the msot popular, but planning ahead I wonder if I am better off going DDR5 now its only around $70 more.

Using the compare tool on newegg, I really can't even figure out what the major differences are in an $800 board vs a $200 one aside from some better audio codecs.

I do have a wifi 6E capable router however my mesh network I run the PC off of, is only Wifi 6. At the current price of a Wifi 6E Mesh network ($400+) I cant see myself changing it today but maybe in the future?


Some of the boards I was comparing. Not set on anything by any means. Budget is moderately flexible.

MSI Pro z690 DDR5
https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813144504?Item=N82E16813144504

z690 Aorus elite AX (DDR4 or DDR5)
https://www.newegg.com/gigabyte-z690-aorus-elite-ax/p/N82E16813145366?Description=aorus elite&cm_re=aorus_elite--13-145-366--Product&quicklink=true

Asus Tuf Gaming Wifi (DDR4)
https://www.newegg.com/asus-tuf-gaming-z690-plus-wifi-d4/p/N82E16813119506?Item=N82E16813119506

Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite DDR4 with Wifi 6E.
https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16813145419?Item=N82E16813145419&nm_mc=AFC-RAN-COM&cm_mmc=AFC-RAN-COM&utm_medium=affiliates&utm_source=afc-PCPartPicker&AFFID=2558510&AFFNAME=PCPartPicker&ACRID=1&ASID=https://pcpartpicker.com/&ranMID=44583&ranEAID=2558510&ranSiteID=8BacdVP0GFs-9okdCfuAqtQVw2zJaGCT.A
 
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Building now, I would stay with DDR4 and a 690 board and if you must use wireless instead of Ethernet stay with 6 for now. As far as memory, don't plan on just adding 2 more sticks -- memory is only guaranteed to work if sold as tested sets. Put the extra money into a little better GPU, and keep your total budget lower while newer connections and tech mature a bit more over the next few years. Happy building.
 
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RealBeast said:
Building now, I would stay with DDR4 and a 690 board and if you must use wireless instead of Ethernet stay with 6 for now. As far as memory, don't plan on just adding 2 more sticks -- memory is only guaranteed to work if sold as tested sets. Put the extra money into a little better GPU, and keep your total budget lower while newer connections and tech mature a bit more over the next few years. Happy building.
Click to expand...

So you would need to order 4 sticks in the same package? I've never seen that even for sale. How do people order two sets of two sticks?
 
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zmihlrad said:
So you would need to order 4 sticks in the same package? I've never seen that even for sale. How do people order two sets of two sticks?
Click to expand...

Enter "2" into the quantity when asked how many 2 stick kits you want?

But most would tell you NOT to do that.

If you want 64 total today, buy a 2 stick kit of 32 per stick.

If you want 32 total today, buy a 2 stick kit of 16 per stick.

If you want 32 today and 64 in 2025, you'd have to decide in 2025 if you want to add 32 to the 32 you bought today or instead discard the 32 you bought today and buy 64 new in 2025...a 2 stick kit of 32 per stick.

You can get 32 DDR 5 (a 2 stick kit of 16 each); 5600 speed for under 200 dollars. You have to compare your buyer's remorse to the cost premium over DDR 4.
 
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RealBeast said:
Building now, I would stay with DDR4 and a 690 board and if you must use wireless instead of Ethernet stay with 6 for now. As far as memory, don't plan on just adding 2 more sticks -- memory is only guaranteed to work if sold as tested sets. Put the extra money into a little better GPU, and keep your total budget lower while newer connections and tech mature a bit more over the next few years. Happy building.
Click to expand...

I don't think there is much more room to grow on GPU? The next would be an Nvidia option for 30% more cost with minimal performance return if I am not mistaken.
 
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zmihlrad said:
Nothing, something better will always come out.

But im asking what is best to do in my situation now, not in 6 months. I can control the now.
Click to expand...

You can certainly control what you buy, but that might have less correlation to your satisfaction level than you would hope. All kinds of stuff you can't control.

Not sure what might cause you to choose parts ABC rather than XYZ, considering the variables outside of anyone's knowledge or control. I have the same issue when buying and muddle through, trying not to look back.
 
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Lafong said:
You can certainly control what you buy, but that might have less correlation to your satisfaction level than you would hope. All kinds of stuff you can't control.

Not sure what might cause you to choose parts ABC rather than XYZ, considering the variables outside of anyone's knowledge or control. I have the same issue when buying and muddle through, trying not to look back.
Click to expand...
The issue is I do not have any clue what I need to buy... Its not my concern about funding.
 
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