Add or Replace RAM? Model Suggestions?

[matthewshawnharper]

DDR4 RAM question! What should I do about the cheap RAM from my prebuilt.

I just got a prebuilt machine from iBuyPower for $1200 for a PrimeDay deal (now back to $1500) with the following specs:
Motherboard: MSI Z370-A PRO
CPU: Intel 8700k
RAM: 2x8gb DDR4-2400 --- Apacer 78.C1GQB.4032B CL17
GPU: GTX 1070TI --- ASUS TURBO-GTX 1070TI-8G J5C0YZ059753
SSD: WD Green SSD that's being replaced with a 1TB WD Black NVMe drive coming in for just $330 (benchmarks show this 1TB model as being faster than all but the 970 Pro and Optane in almost every test).

So the remaining weak link here is my RAM. Because I run 5 virtual machines at once for work and use a lot of RAM, I need to go to at least 32GB like I have on my other machine (which is going to the wife). DDR4 ram is just shockingly expensive and I haven't messed with components in several years (since before the GPU/RAM prices skyrocketed apparently).

I have the stock RAM at 2666mhz stable at stock voltage so my question is about value. Should I just get 2x8gb of some cheap Ballistix 2400 at $160 and match it to my existing RAM, or should I remove the old RAM altogether and get 2x16gb sticks. The best prices right now seem to be for G.SKILL 3200mhz CL16 for $310 (F4-3200C16D-32GVK) or Corsair Vengeance 3000mhz CL15 for $300.

So 2 questions:
1) Is it worth $140 it to throw out my RAM and get all new stuff? I realize the response time is significantly faster, but what real world advantage is there in this speed increase for a 4 monitor VMware/photoshop poweruser (but not gamer).
2) If so, which of the two (or other suggestions within $10-$25) do you guys recommend? I realize neither of these are Samsung B-Die, both are Hynex M-Die if I'm reading correctly - but both seem to have good stable overclocking results when paired together.

 

[clarkjd]

DDR4 RAM question! What should I do about the cheap RAM from my prebuilt.

I just got a prebuilt machine from iBuyPower for $1200 for a PrimeDay deal (now back to $1500) with the following specs:
Motherboard: MSI Z370-A PRO
CPU: Intel 8700k
RAM: 2x8gb DDR4-2400 --- Apacer 78.C1GQB.4032B CL17
GPU: GTX 1070TI --- ASUS TURBO-GTX 1070TI-8G J5C0YZ059753
SSD: WD Green SSD that's being replaced with a 1TB WD Black NVMe drive coming in for just $330 (benchmarks show this 1TB model as being faster than all but the 970 Pro and Optane in almost every test).

So the remaining weak link here is my RAM. Because I run 5 virtual machines at once for work and use a lot of RAM, I need to go to at least 32GB like I have on my other machine (which is going to the wife). DDR4 ram is just shockingly expensive and I haven't messed with components in several years (since before the GPU/RAM prices skyrocketed apparently).

I have the stock RAM at 2666mhz stable at stock voltage so my question is about value. Should I just get 2x8gb of some cheap Ballistix 2400 at $160 and match it to my existing RAM, or should I remove the old RAM altogether and get 2x16gb sticks. The best prices right now seem to be for G.SKILL 3200mhz CL16 for $310 (F4-3200C16D-32GVK) or Corsair Vengeance 3000mhz CL15 for $300.

So 2 questions:
1) Is it worth $140 it to throw out my RAM and get all new stuff? I realize the response time is significantly faster, but what real world advantage is there in this speed increase for a 4 monitor VMware/photoshop poweruser (but not gamer).
2) If so, which of the two (or other suggestions within $10-$25) do you guys recommend? I realize neither of these are Samsung B-Die, both are Hynex M-Die if I'm reading correctly - but both seem to have good stable overclocking results when paired together.

Here's the deal: getting unmatched ram to work together is problematical at best, and impossible at worst. They sell ram in matched sets for a reason! Sometimes even two of the exact same kits won't play well together, especially if acquired at different times. You could sell your current ram, and use that to offset the cost of a 2x16 32GB kit. If you could just get any two sticks of ram to work, there wouldn't be a need for matched sets of ram.

 

[matthewshawnharper]

Here's the deal: getting unmatched ram to work together is problematical at best, and impossible at worst. Sometimes even two of the exact same kits won't play well together, especially if acquired at different times. You could sell your current ram, and use that to offset the cost of a 2x16 32GB kit. If you could just get any two sticks of ram to work, there wouldn't be a need for matched sets of ram.

The way it used to work is that it was relatively easy to get RAM to work together as long as they could be matched to the same speed/timings - is that no longer the case? I haven't built a computer in over 10 years so I am not at all familiar with more than the basics of modern configurations.

I'm leaning towards replacing them especially after hearing your words - do you have any input on the two options I suggested?

 

[cryoburner]

I think some tend to exaggerate the likelihood of running into incompatibilities when adding RAM. There's always been a chance that adding RAM won't work, but it usually does. Personally, I would probably take the chance and try adding some RAM with identical timings, unless you're going to sell the RAM that you already have. Higher timings might help a bit, but I would not expect much more than around 5% more performance out of the CPU with DDR4-3200. I'm actually not sure exactly how performance could be affected when running multiple VMs though.

I take it that your existing system uses something like DDR3 memory that couldn't be used in the new system? If your wife doesn't need 32GB of RAM (I'm guess she probably doesn't) you could likely try selling some of that as well, as 16GB should be enough for general desktop use and even gaming for some years to come.

And yeah, RAM is priced rather high right now. It was priced quite low for a while there a couple years back, but then prices skyrocketed around late 2016 into early 2017, and have been around double what they had previously been since.

 

[clarkjd]

Here's the deal: getting unmatched ram to work together is problematical at best, and impossible at worst. Sometimes even two of the exact same kits won't play well together, especially if acquired at different times. You could sell your current ram, and use that to offset the cost of a 2x16 32GB kit. If you could just get any two sticks of ram to work, there wouldn't be a need for matched sets of ram.

The way it used to work is that it was relatively easy to get RAM to work together as long as they could be matched to the same speed/timings - is that no longer the case? I haven't built a computer in over 10 years so I am not at all familiar with more than the basics of modern configurations.

I'm leaning towards replacing them especially after hearing your words - do you have any input on the two options I suggested?

As computers (and ram!) have gotten faster, the ability to use unmatched ram has gotten more and more difficult. Especially if the manufacturer makes changes to design, like using higher capacity memory chips on newer versions of the same model.
As you are running multiple VM's the more system ram, the better, so IMHO it would be worth it to acquire a matched 32GB set, even if you couldn't use your current ram.(You could always try to sell your old ram. It works and is a matched set.)
As for question 2: Is either kit listed in the QVL for your motherboard, or is your motherboard listed as compatible to the ram on the G.Skill or Corsair website? If both are listed, I would go with the less expensive set, otherwise, I would recommend whichever is listed. You may be able to contact either G.Skill or Corsair and get their recommendations.

 

[matthewshawnharper]

Thanks both, very informative. That's correct, old system is DDR3 and I'm not sure it's worth selling old tech used RAM when wife can just use it on 137 Chrome tabs. Because of the compatibility uncertainty combined with possible performance improvements, I'm leaning towards purchasing new RAM and going with the Corsair since it's free same day shipping and would arrive with my NVMe drive tomorrow (convenience is how I make most important life decisions).

That said, I remember when I built my DDR2 system years back, I could change the speed of individual channels - IF that does work, should I put the Corsair in 1/3 and the no name stuff in 2/4 if I can get the channels clocked separately in the BIOS - or should I just ditch the old RAM? Being that it's not a name brand, I can't imagine I get much selling it online.

 

[clarkjd]

Thanks both, very informative. That's correct, old system is DDR3 and I'm not sure it's worth selling old tech used RAM when wife can just use it on 137 Chrome tabs. Because of the compatibility uncertainty combined with possible performance improvements, I'm leaning towards purchasing new RAM and going with the Corsair since it's free same day shipping and would arrive with my NVMe drive tomorrow (convenience is how I make most important life decisions).

That said, I remember when I built my DDR2 system years back, I could change the speed of individual channels - IF that does work, should I put the Corsair in 1/3 and the no name stuff in 2/4 if I can get the channels clocked separately in the BIOS - or should I just ditch the old RAM? Being that it's not a name brand, I can't imagine I get much selling it online.

Be advised that DDR3 ram is incompatible with DDR4 ram, and no amount of BIOS tweaks will make it work. Also DDR4 ram will not physically fit into a slot made for DDR3 ram, and vice versa.

 

[matthewshawnharper]

Be advised that DDR3 ram is incompatible with DDR4 ram, and no amount of BIOS tweaks will make it work. Also DDR4 ram will not physically fit into a slot made for DDR3 ram.

Oh you actually misunderstood my question, I'm talking about the 16GB of DDR4 2400mhz RAM that's already in the system of the new computer. Assuming I purchase the 32GB Corsair kit, should I see if I can get the previously existing DDR4 working or would that not be worth the hassle and/or speed loss (if downclocking the new kit would be required)?

My DDR3 mention was in reference to the other guy's suggestion to sell the DDR3 RAM in my old computer I'm giving my wife. Although I am not up to date on the latest details, I am definitely familiar with the fundamentals and wouldn't try to mix DDR3/DDR4 - I apologize for not being more clear.

 

[clarkjd]

Be advised that DDR3 ram is incompatible with DDR4 ram, and no amount of BIOS tweaks will make it work. Also DDR4 ram will not physically fit into a slot made for DDR3 ram.

Oh you actually misunderstood my question, I'm talking about the 16GB of DDR4 2400mhz RAM that's already in the system of the new computer. Assuming I purchase the 32GB Corsair kit, should I see if I can get the previously existing DDR4 working or would that not be worth the hassle and/or speed loss (if downclocking the new kit would be required)?

My DDR3 mention was in reference to the other guy's suggestion to sell the DDR3 RAM in my old computer I'm giving my wife. Although I am not up to date on the latest details, I am definitely familiar with the fundamentals and wouldn't try to mix DDR3/DDR4 - I apologize for not being more clear.

No problem! It wouldn't hurt anything to try the new ram with the old. Who knows? it may work! The worst that could happen is your system would fail to boot. I would try to run the new at the speed of the old, though.

 

[matthewshawnharper]

No problem! It wouldn't hurt anything to try the new ram with the old. Who knows? it may work! The worst that could happen is your system would fail to boot. I would try to run the new at the speed of the old, though.

Running new at the speed of the old is what I'm kind of asking about - 2400 at 17 vs 3000/15 is almost 40% "faster" in terms of latency so if I'm not really going to use more than the 32GB anytime soon, does it make sense to take the old ram out even if it works or is there a way to set them at different timings?

 

[clarkjd]

No problem! It wouldn't hurt anything to try the new ram with the old. Who knows? it may work! The worst that could happen is your system would fail to boot. I would try to run the new at the speed of the old, though.

Running new at the speed of the old is what I'm kind of asking about - 2400 at 17 vs 3000/15 is almost 40% "faster" in terms of latency so if I'm not really going to use more than the 32GB anytime soon, does it make sense to take the old ram out even if it works or is there a way to set them at different timings?

If you don't think you would use more than the 32GB of rm, then, I would suggest using only the new ram at its rated speed(if the motherboard will support that), and not try to get two kits with different speeds to work together. I don't think your motherboard will support running two kits at the rated speed of each, in other words I think that only one speed for all ram is supported.

 

[cryoburner]

Running new at the speed of the old is what I'm kind of asking about - 2400 at 17 vs 3000/15 is almost 40% "faster" in terms of latency so if I'm not really going to use more than the 32GB anytime soon, does it make sense to take the old ram out even if it works or is there a way to set them at different timings?

While the DDR4 3000 may be somewhat faster, in practice that difference in speed typically won't amount to much more than a 5% increase in real-world CPU performance. The processor will tend to temporarily hold data that it's actively working with in its cache, which tends to negate much of the gains from going with faster memory. Again, I'm not sure whether running lots of VMs could potentially have an impact on that though.