Air Force Still Using PS3 as 33rd Largest Computer

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bourgeoisdude

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[citation][nom]distanted[/nom]Didn't Iraq try to buy hundreds of these or xboxes to use as missile guidance systems before the invasion? Looks like the new battle front is at Toys R Us.[/citation]

No, that was PS2's.
 

K-zon

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The question would be really what would they sell that cluster for once they upgrade? Or are they going to just exchange on the difference? And in doing so on that, how much would that cost? It might probably sometimes cost more to the bank and cash just one dollar onto one of those systems. At those kind of numbers.

10k for a ps3, so at about a 2-5k investment, should be a fairly decent all-in-one system. Idk, least the Air Force is still allowed to have access to say the open-source parts of the PS3.
 

commhealy

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[citation][nom]k-zon[/nom]The question would be really what would they sell that cluster for once they upgrade? Or are they going to just exchange on the difference? And in doing so on that, how much would that cost? It might probably sometimes cost more to the bank and cash just one dollar onto one of those systems. At those kind of numbers.10k for a ps3, so at about a 2-5k investment, should be a fairly decent all-in-one system. Idk, least the Air Force is still allowed to have access to say the open-source parts of the PS3.[/citation]
Why have one when you can have two for twice the price.
 

mj4358

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[citation][nom]nottheking[/nom]This "supercomputer" is purely a marketing gimmick by the Air Force, to make them attract people from the gamer audience. The Air Force, as I'd learned, is desperate to reach out to that sort of demographic, and they feel that by boasting they have a lot of PS3s, they can make themselves seem better to these potential recruits.Well, here's the lowdown: the the PS3 makes a terrible supercomputer node. Why's that? It's because its Cell processor was not designed for double-precision. The PS3's CPU gets an admirable 211.2 Gigaflops of performance in single-precision math... But single-precision is only good for media and gaming tasks. Actual scientific, engineering, and HPC tasks NEED double-precision. And at that... The Cell trails badly, dropping to about 32 gigaflops.Computers are an engineering thing: you CAN'T have a design that's best at everything. You have to sacrifice one thing to get another. The PS3 sacrifices any real supercomputing capability in order to be good at being both a gaming machine, and a high-definition media center/Blu-ray player. The flip side is that for this "PS3 cluster," the Air Force is only getting a measly 56.32 Teraflops of actual supercomputer power. (the RSX is a GeForce design that pre-dates CUDA)If they wanted a real supercomputer, they'd use IBM's modified supercomputer variant of the Cell, the PowerXCell 8i. This is what's ACTUALLY used for supercomputers: it natively handles double-precision, and gets 108.8 gigaflops instead of only 32. That would bump the machine up to nearly 200 teraflops of power, which would put it in REAL major supercomputer territory. That, and IBM MAKES PowerXCell blades that are made for this, and are VASTLY more energy-efficient than using PS3s.It's kinda telling: you look at the most powerful supercomputers in the world, and not a single one uses a PS3. But many of them use the PowerXCell. (including a former #1, RoadRunner) That demonstrates that this Air Force machine is all for show.[/citation]


"The supercomputer, nicknamed the Condor Cluster, will allow very fast analysis of large high-resolution imagery -- billions of pixels a minute, taking what used to take several hours down to mere seconds, Barnell said.
Its sophisticated algorithms also will allow scientists to better identify objects flying in space, where movement and distance create blurring, with higher-quality images than possible before."

You rant is really a moot point since the AF is looking and Hi-res photos!
 

mj4358

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[citation][nom]mj4358[/nom]"The supercomputer, nicknamed the Condor Cluster, will allow very fast analysis of large high-resolution imagery -- billions of pixels a minute, taking what used to take several hours down to mere seconds, Barnell said.Its sophisticated algorithms also will allow scientists to better identify objects flying in space, where movement and distance create blurring, with higher-quality images than possible before."You rant is really a moot point since the AF is looking and Hi-res photos![/citation]

Your rant is really a moot point since the AF is looking at Hi-res photos!
Sorry for the repost.....
 

mowston

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According to the WPAFB site they use 168 GPGPUs, and 84 dual, six-core processors in addition to the PS3s. They also claim that it uses 1/10 the electricity of comparable systems, and is 500 TFLOPS.
 

badaxe2

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[citation][nom]nottheking[/nom]This "supercomputer" is purely a marketing gimmick by the Air Force, to make them attract people from the gamer audience. The Air Force, as I'd learned, is desperate to reach out to that sort of demographic, and they feel that by boasting they have a lot of PS3s, they can make themselves seem better to these potential recruits.Well, here's the lowdown: the the PS3 makes a terrible supercomputer node. Why's that? It's because its Cell processor was not designed for double-precision. The PS3's CPU gets an admirable 211.2 Gigaflops of performance in single-precision math... But single-precision is only good for media and gaming tasks. Actual scientific, engineering, and HPC tasks NEED double-precision. [/citation]

So that's why PS3 still leads all platforms in Folding @ Home? Maybe the Air Force doesn't need double precision for analyzing pictures. At least not enough to where the benefits would outweigh the cost.
 

badaxe2

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[citation][nom]tipoo[/nom]How well does their supercomputer get on with only 256MB of RAM per processor?[/citation]

It's not trying to run Crysis man, it's just crunching numbers; something it's extremely efficient at doing.
 

chindoboi

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Although technology seems impressive with the amount of processing power they have at the moment... The human brain of which scans images daily has a theoretical processing power 38 petaflops.
 

dalethepcman

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[citation][nom]skyviper[/nom]@nottheking did you take into consideration the air force developed this system 5-6 years ago ...[/citation]

/cough /cough - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_3
"The PlayStation 3 was first released on November 11, 2006"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CUDA
"CUDA SDK was made public on 15 February 2007"

The ps3 is 4 years old, and so is CUDA, If they wanted this to use as an actual cost efficient system they didn't have to use PS3's, this is just a toy that the american taxpayer foot the bill for.
 

dalethepcman

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[citation][nom]rhino13[/nom]Incorrect The Cell was designed for double-precision, it actually has a special instruction set to handle them.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cell_ [...] _.28PPE.29[/citation]
wow, do you even read the article you posted? Let me highlight this sentance for you from the wiki you linked.

"Cell is optimized towards single precision floating point computation. The SPEs are capable of performing double precision calculations, albeit with an order of magnitude performance penalty"
 

zaznet

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[citation][nom]americanherosandwich[/nom]$10,000? Divide that by 1,760, it means they bought each PS3 for $5.68? I don't think that's accurate. Hell, they have laptops that cost $10k.[/citation]

The $10,000 price tag is per unit not the entire cluster. To get the same kind of calculations per minute they achieve from the PS3 an individual server would have cost $10,000 each. Their end of life issues and lack of support from Sony are examples of why the $10,000 price tag would be justified.
 
It seems to me that this was probly put together about the time the PS3 first came out, around 2006. You're comparing modern tech to 4 (almost 5) year old tech and wonder why it seems silly? In 2006, they decided a bank of PS3s at $699 each, plus other things totaling $2,000,000 was better than 10 times that for a more traditional supercomputer. What the heck. It works fine.
 
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