AM2: AMD Reinvents Itself

[pschmid]

The AMD generation grows up. To introduce you to the new AM2 socket, we bring you a comprehensive analysis of the platform, processors and memory, along with benchmarks and purchase recommendations.

 

[weilin]

Yay first to a thread!!

Anyways, it looks like AMD has finally delived their AM2 platform, now its the wait for intel. This is going to be a "interesting" summer.

 

[smokenmirrorz]

Fascinating, not a single mention of Intel's Conroe. I guess that would seriously rain on AMD's AM2 launch parade wouldn't it? Also, the mention of AMD's nonexistent price/performance advantage when compared to Netburst. Let's see how long it takes for the AMD fanboys (Tom's Hardware included.....obviously) to jump the sinking ship when Conroe hits the streets.

 

[weilin]

women and children first of course... the men will go down with the ship

 

[kitchenshark]

I'm frankly quite disappointed that AMD hasn't lowered the prices on current CPU's, or even the new CPU's yet. If Intel goes through with the pricing that they have stated, and the performance is even 10-15% better than AMD....crud; Intel will make some serious inroads in AMD's market share.

Sure, AMD may have something fantastic to pull out, Intel may be a flop...but indicators seem to point that Intel looks really good now.

My question is WHY would AMD risk their marketshare? They'd better either be ready with something REALLY great, or ready to slash prices dramatically. Anything else seems to be stupidity.

Can't wait for benches on the Conroe/Core 2 chips, I'm eager to see how they really do. It will influence my next build AND I want to see what AMD has up their sleeves (if anything).

 

[Spikke]

Fascinating, not a single mention of Intel's Conroe.

Maybe it wasn't obvious, but they are comparing cpu's that are currently available. Core 2 Duo hasn't been released yet. I have no doubt that Tom's will do plenty of benchmarks comparing AM2's cpu's and the Core 2 Duo stuff when it is released.

 

[gudodayn]

The new DDR2's been reported for months that it doesnt not provide the A64s any boost in performance.....what I dont get is, why are the prices so high??
Intel's next generation chip has certainly been proving itself worthy of the performance crown though its not yet released.

As a 939 CPU owner, I am not looking at an upgrade anytime soon....if I had to, it's definitely not going to be AM2 nor a Conroe!!!

AM2 provides little to no improvement, Conroe will require a new board, CPU and memory but will provide some improvement on gaming , conversion (lets face it, gaming at 50fps, its smooth as already, running it at 100fps wont make a difference; an extra minute is not the end of the world), etc. The Intel setup wont come cheap either and I will not be running SuperPI 24/7!!!!!!!!!

I'd wait for Quad-core CPUs and skip the dual core generation just so it justifies the money spent!!!

 

[theaxemaster]

An Impressively complete article, considering the time between release and this publishing.

As to kitchenshark's question about why AMD would risk their marketshare, the answer is relatively simple: servers. AMD has been showing more and more lately that they're primarily in the server business and their upgrade schedules have been built around that. They are still the best there, and if things go on as they've been predicted to, they'll be the best there for a long while.

Notice that no one in the desktop market really cares about quad cores, but that's the major milestone they have planned next. Who cares about quad cores? servers. 65nm is hardly a milestone from what I've read about what they've got planned. As far as I can tell, its just a die shrink and a few tweaks. It allows higher clocks, sure, but what it really does is a) lower the cost per chip and b) lower TDP. 65nm means its cheaper to make a quad core processor and it runs cooler, which will make the server makers VERY happy.

I'm fairly convinced at this point that AMD is fine with their processor line "as-is" and doesn't plan on making major changes for a few years.

 

[Hawkeye22]

Hopefully AMD will impress us with their upcoming roadmap on technology day.

 

[FatFunkey]

well i dont know about kids but AM2 sucks ass.....yay 4 frames....

like i said all AM2 is is the same chip just with DD2 Support...if conroe benchmarks are true then AMD is about to get its ass handed to it this summer untill they relase there new chips :L

 

[gudodayn]

I agree with you that this is an amazing detail article on new AMD processors!!

Isnt Quad-core CPUs on the 2007 roadmap?

I too, think AMD is OK for now with that processor line as prices are the more or less then same except for a few odd CPUs. When competition comes with a 65nm processor that can easily out do your high end CPU....you gotta be concerned!!!

I just believe that upgrades should always skip a generation just to see a big enough improvement thats all!!!

 

[Spikke]

like i said all AM2 is is the same chip just with DD2 Support...

No Shit. AMD didn't claim it to be anything more then that.
Edit: Forgot to add, AM2 isn't a chip, it's a socket.

 

[benjamin]

The AMD generation grows up. To introduce you to the new AM2 socket, we bring you a comprehensive analysis of the platform, processors and memory, along with benchmarks and purchase recommendations.

Quite absurd.

 

[blueangel]

I would recommend anyone looking to upgrade, wait at least 4-6 months after it is released. I say this to allow for a leeway for bug fixes, as well as the price will have dropped a little. You will also be able to know what Intels response to this is, and its capabilities.

 

[Skidd]

I would recommend anyone looking to upgrade, wait at least 4-6 months after it is released. I say this to allow for a leeway for bug fixes, as well as the price will have dropped a little. You will also be able to know what Intels response to this is, and its capabilities.

Hey?!?

Where have you been? This is AMD's response to Intel’s 775 architecture. Long over due if you ask me. DDR2 has proven its worth for long enough now and AMD has never taken advantage of that until now.

As for Intel’s next step, the Conroe / Core 2. Being based on the Centrino / Yonah (We all know what the yonah did to the FX55 with lower clocks and even low power and heat levels is just frightening) I don’t see how AMD's 65nm Chips competing with it. They might be able to push their clocks to 3.2ghz but I personally am not going to go out and spend $1000 on a CPU.

I say this AM2 move should have happened a year ago already. Intel supporters already have the DDR2 and some of them already have the motherboard for the Conroe step becuase intel's "new" architecture is now "old" and well into the market.

 

[zeekle]

The reason the prices are still so high is that as of today they are still the best you can buy. Come July/August prices could change.

 

[Exterous]

I say this AM2 move should have happened a year ago already. Intel supporters already have the DDR2 and some of them already have the motherboard for the Conroe step becuase intel's "new" architecture is now "old" and well into the market.

Given the issues with DDR2 clocking I think its better they waited this long. If we are talking about high priced RAM chips giving the performance increase NOW then if they had released it a year ago the $ of the RAM would be outrageous

 

[kitchenshark]

Heh. Yes, you're right. The logic and pointers are inescapable now that you've directed my attention that way. And there is definitely more money to be made in high-volume server processor sales. Still...as a consumer it would irk me to be ignored for long in the areas where I need good price/performance.

I still don't think it is wise of AMD to ignore the market segment that raised them into the position they are today. My personal opinion only.

 

[Sokolum]

It's is a very good article... very comperhansive and a very good in detail about the differences of the DDR and DDR2.

But personally, i don't care about the M@ socket, just bought few motnhs ago the 939 socket system and i am very happy with it. I prefer to see new CPU X2 for the 939 with a considerable lower price. Those X2 thingies are to expensive, although i would like tp upgrade in the future from my Venice3000+ to a X2 939 cpu, if they still exist.

 

[antlee]

What AMD does is no more than changing the integrated memory controller to match DDR2 RAM, so the result is nothing to surprise us.

However it shows some weak points on the current AMD CPU core design:

1. It can't use full bandwidth of Dual-channel DDR2 RAM, even FX62 clocked at 2.8GHz can use only 8 of 12.8 GB/s bandwidth, and AMD seems to have no way to rock CPU clock up above 3GHz. The K8 core had done a good job considering it is just a slightly improved core of K7 plus an integraded memory controller.

2. The performance hampers due to higher latency of DDR2 RAM, which AMD has to fight against.

The short term solution is to make the core with bigger caches(seems to be L3 cache) so as to hinder the higher latency of DDR2 RAM.

In a longer term, of course AMD has to release a new core, which utilise higher memory bandwidth at the same clock speed of current ones.

==============================================
The current DDR2 K8 core may have short life, but the AM2 socket motherboard should have a long lifetime... as long as DDR2 RAM survives.

 

[theaxemaster]

The AM2 chips are on pricewatch now. The prices aren't that bad on a performance basis though, compared to the current crop of intels. Looking at the X2 4000 vs. the D 840 (approximately the same performance in the game test) the X2 is ~$325 and the D 840 is ~$440. The 3800 non-X2 is a solid game performer for ~$290 and it performs as well as the D 950 which is ~$345. And I expect the prices to drop when intel releases its new architecture.

They're going to have trouble selling any of the processors who's clock speed isn't divisible by 400 though, at least in the performance market. And fast DDR2-800 is still very pricey.

 

[MadBill]

http://www.guru3d.com/article/mainboard/348/1/
Here is another artical where they OC'd both the X2 4000 & FX-62.
It looks like the 4000 OC very well. It appears when OC'd the 4000 gets very close to the non-OC'd FX.

 

[beggerking]

Fascinating, not a single mention of Intel's Conroe. I guess that would seriously rain on AMD's AM2 launch parade wouldn't it? Also, the mention of AMD's nonexistent price/performance advantage when compared to Netburst. Let's see how long it takes for the AMD fanboys (Tom's Hardware included.....obviously) to jump the sinking ship when Conroe hits the streets.

why mention Conroe when its not even out yet?

Your fanboism is getting into your head..

AMD always had price/performance when compare to Netburst...its been constant, even for Pentium D, X2 has better price/performance ratio.

 

[redstar]

Actually, from another site ...all these sites were asked not to mention conroe by AMD as part of the agreement on the coverage.

But, yes all of the hardware sites agree that it is not good to compare a future chip to one that is actually released.

Though hexus just released some preliminary test results on the two conroe's they have:

http://www.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=5692

(In short, it says conroe is all that Inetl claimed)
---
I have not upgraded for 5 years! I planned to last January. But then the new tech over the horizon kept me waiting (something i agree you never should do)

here i am 1 year and 1/2 later..still deciding --and now conroe in July

(dx10/vista in january).

But now i am holding off until at least july...and that is pretty close to xmas....

Close your eyes and just pick!! (i have 8 games, and growing, collecting dust while i stall

---
At the time i picked the cutting edge k7t266 pro-r solution ...and got burned
To this day i have usb/raid problems. Had i waited another month, the problems would have been fixed in the A revision.

Yet, i am fairly sure i will buy whatever first comes out for the conroe.
Its been so long!!

 

[Panzerzero]

Since the AM2 is a down grade when using DDR-2 what is the point of upgrading right now. I guess since WATTs consumed on load is so great but still the price is way to high for a good processor. gone are the good old AMD days of great price great processor. Meet the new AMD starting to look a lot like Intel to me. :roll: