AMD CPU speculation... and expert conjecture

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Slight advantage? Nope. Sony/Microsoft preferred ARM. They didn't select finally because ARM64 was not ready then. They will switch in the next gen. The same that Apple switched from PPC to x86 and is now preparing the switch to ARM. No problem with that.

I already explained before that Tegra is not a primary project by Nvidia, but a secondary project to get experience in the market, before they get ready their custom cores (Denver project).



The problem is that those are claims made by AMD. This is what AMD says about Warsaw:

He also told us that “Warsaw”, AMD’s follow up in the 2P/4P server market, will cater for a declining but still large market with institutional customers that will take longer to migrate to an ARM ecosystem.
Click to expand...

He is Andrew Feldman, AMD’s Data Center Server Solutions Team.

I already gave this quote before, but people don't read.
 


I agree with you entirely!!

However, a pair of days ago I posted a recent slide about Kaveri and Richland. It is reported in several tech new sites now, but nobody here commented on it. Beside me, I don't see anyone here posting relevant info about Steamroller and Kaveri. I have some news but I am not posting because people doesn't seem interested. However, I see people discussing about ARM.

About ARM, I have a doc with a project for a high-performance SoC that gives diagrams and even the die size. It is not a project for 2104, neither for 2015 nor 2016. I will only say that this SoC has more performance than 10 GTX Titans. Yes I said 10 (ten) in a die bigger than Kaveri APU. I will not say more.

Therefore I expect you to understand that it was very funny for me to read people here asking if an ARM machine can run Crysis...
 
Juan would you stop with the complete insane amount of arrogance in your posts?
"Beside me, I don't see anyone here posting relevant info about Steamroller and Kaveri." Are you serious?!
Could you just stop posting? No offence, I don't mind when you post links, and discussing.... as long as it does not turn into 30 pages of nothing but insults, excuses.(Not just you) (Like it was with Halifur)

"I have some news but I am not posting because people doesn't seem interested." Please do not decide what I find interresting.. Just because I do not post does not mean I am not interested...
 


I am interested in the News you have!!!
I am with you on the ridiculous amount of posting that is off topic and adds nothing to this thread! All I want to know about is Steamroller and AMD tech that relates, all the arm talk is getting old!
 


Personally I think it's possible if AMD can get access to a solid SOI node to make the chips.

Intel is off trying to make their HEDT parts energy efficient at the cost of performance gains. It's like if ARM stopped pushing for efficiency and instead just released high TDP monsters that went fast.

But Juaranga that is what I was talking about. ARM will work for HPC with GPGPU and the CPU is almost useless in those situations and it will work for microservers.

I have suggested several times that AMD is going to switch to releasing Gaming PC chips first instead of releasing server chips and then porting them to desktop. There is no point in doing that anymore, because x86 Opteron is completely uncompetitive with Intel's offerings unless you're trying to cram more ram per socket or use extensive virtualization. Which of course is another thing the ARM guys keep forgetting, Opteron x86 has been absolutely bleeding market share for years and last I checked they were at about 4% and shrinking.

Meanwhile Gaming PC segment is growing (though not as fast as desktop shipments are shrinking).

Which is why I'm thinking we'll see AMD going ambidextrous where x86 cores are made for gaming PCs and those who need traditional workstations (but with HSA enabled of course) while leaving servers and most of mobile up to ARM.

AMD's current plan of making server chips and porting them to desktop is so bad. The big dies don't allow for good profits on desktop and AMD no longer has significant enough x86 server marketshare to justify it. Which is why I believe AMD is waiting on a smaller node to release a 4m/8c part, which would be significantly smaller than the 315mm^2 needed for an Orochi die.

AMD could make good money off of FX style chips and it caters to a market they pretty much have control of now with the console wins and Mantle. They just need to fix the fact that they're selling a chip larger than 4960x for as cheap as $109. And releasing Steamroller HEDT chips on 32nm SOI is absolutely not the answer to it.

Which is why I continue to make the point that AMD is pushing ARM right now to hide the fact that they completely failed HEDT. It's a marketing move and instead of the internet talking about how AMD is doomed, 20nm SOI is delayed yet again, and all AMD can offer are mid-range parts at best, we now have people talking about how HSA Is going to change things and how Mantle is going to change a ton of things.

Anyways please share your Steamroller or future SOI news Ranth, this thread gets off topic because there's not a lot to talk about with Steamroller. It's quite clear AMD has no intentions of releasing a FX class chip on 28nm bulk and no one has faith in GloFo delivering 20nm SOI in 2014 (I don't even really).
 
It's not Ranth who has the news. He was quoting juanrga, who predictably is acting like the lord amongst the peasants and will only share his news after being worshipped sufficiently beforehand.
 

AMD has the advantage now as games are starting to love Vishera (ala BF4).
 
It was a quote from Juan (The "I have news, but don't wanna share", part) Might not have been too clear about that sorry 😀
Though I share what little that is not posted here.
 


If mantle actually does have games running on 8 cores then Intel will have to update their I5 to keep up BF4 does not even have mantle yet and the 8350-I5 give similar performance just wait. Intel is not as far ahead in newer games and older games should run just fine on a 8350fx. Arm is a side project i do know that is a fact the one and only person i know who works at Amd even says that. Its a SIDE PROJECT.

In 2017 or so Arm will have 10% market share in servers and Amd wants some of that. APU's with Arm+GPU is enough to get that as well. Compared to other brands that make Arm AMD actually has a relationship with Arm and their the only ones who make high-end GPU graphics capable of producing some power. Nvidia is actually behind in Compute power in total Amd just needs to unleash the power more efficiently
 


Steamroller will have 20-25% more Performance per clock BUT it will be clocked lower so i expect a 10-15% increase at best in CPU tasks(for the APU). Either way the 8 core PD will only get better and better.
 


The basic way I look at it is this.

Battlefield (in other words, the people associated with Mantle) saw that AMD was cheaper and they may have a better market since AMD released their new APUs and they're selling so nice.

Mantle is basically a way for AMD to get more business and for game dev's to get more business as well.

Really though only 10-20% of the top games are going to have this implementation at the moment, but it is sure of a kick in the balls to Intel (and to me since I got my I5-3570k only 2 months ago ;_😉.

Well played AMD, well played. >.>
 
As a secondary note, anyone know how to use a second GPU to do video capture? I've heard from a couple people you could do it. For example, I'm using a GTX 770 for my gaming, but I have a 9400 GT that's laying around. Plus it might be better than getting an avermedia card.

 


Mantle is a graphical API, not a CPU ISA.

Using Mantle on an Intel chip will yield the same benefits as it would on and AMD chip.

The GPU is the variable here, NOT the CPU.
 


Mantle allows more cores to work not just 4 cores like on the I5 and the 8350fx does have more multiasking performance giving it an edge.

Read up on Mantle which allows rendering to be done on multiple cores.


 


Correct me if I'm wrong, but Mantle isn't needed to allow CPUs to utilize more than 4 cores. Source to your claim?

 


http://hothardware.com/News/How-AMDs-Mantle-Will-Redefine-Gaming-Doesnt-Require-AMD-Hardware/

"One of the other ideas behind Mantle is that of expanding parallelism. Under DirectX and OpenGL, CPU0 might be handling game compute, CPU1 sets up rendering, and CPU2 handles the driver setup and data passing. Using Mantle, CPU0 handles the CPU-centric computation, but CPU1-CPUx (maximum multi-threading) are all dedicated to the render path with no need to tie up cores with driver interfaces."

This is Amd's main selling point
 



Intel has nothing that can compete with the APUs that AMD designed for Sony and Microsoft.

Intel really can't compete with the Trinity/Richland/Kabini/Temash APUs either in graphics performance or in price/performance . Still they're not Intel-killers because it's just a subset of the overall PC marketplace.
 


In terms of APU's Intel kinda lost. But there is to mention CPU power. Almost every APU unless overclocked wont have more power than a 3570k or 8350, so that is the downfall, but since AMD is a CPU and GPU based company, they can make these lower price point APU's for these beginner users or low budget users.

The market is out there, but it isn't big enough to be a "Intel-killer"
 

Those are so sexy pictures. Anyways, The jaguar cores look exactly the same from kabini as in the ps4 but the xbox one has 2 extra little blocks on the sides. Also theres a block of esram in between the CPUs in the xbox one. MS probably has some customization on the uncore but the internals looks the same. Everything else looks like what you'd expect.
 
Juaranga, you seem to be forgetting that game developers pestered Sony and MS for an x86 console to make PC porting easier. I don't think we will ever see a non-x86 console again. x86 consoles cut development costs and time for multi-platform games between consoles and PC and PC gaming is growing rapidly (although admittedly not as fast as DT sales are shrinking overall).

We are at a time where AAA games cost a significant amount of money to create. Game developers want solutions where they can write once and run run on as many platforms as possible without making massive amounts of tweaks. It's why they're jumping on Mantle so fast and it's why they wanted x86 in consoles.

The cost of developing games and getting them to as many customers as possible by porting to different platforms is a massive one facing the industry right now, and the best solution is a set of common software tools that spans a somewhat common set of hardware.

You don't find it curious at all that XBone and PS4 both have APUs which don't differentiate from each other in any meaningful way beyond how much of the nearly identical chip is disabled or enabled? Last generation there was all this talk about how Cell gave a huge advantage and RSX was superior to what MS had and MS was touting their triple core and Xenos.

Now they're both completely mum on the issue because they've somehow managed to do an industry first and offer two similarly specd machines.

The whole idea of two competing consoles using the same x86 CPU and slightly different GPU is completely ridiculous and there's no way Sony or MS would want to create products that are so similar to each other when there's so much competition between the two.

This has never happened and there's always been some sort of hardware gimmick to get people to move to a platform that had something unique. 64 bits while the competition doesn't have. Blast processing, etc. This generation we have different memory and a console you can talk to and different exclusives. It's like if SNES and Genesis were almost identical hardware-wise and if everyone was arguing over if Genesis or SNES was better because one had sonic and one had mario.

Or if PS1 and N64 were nearly identical hardware-wise and you had to choose between Crash Bandicoot or Banjoo Kazooie.

That's not what it's been like ever, and it's because game developers pushed for a common platform so they could cut development costs. Game developers won't let Sony or MS go anything but x86 in the next gen consoles unless by that time x86 is dead on HEDT.
 
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