News AMD Encourages Radeon RX 5600 XT Owners To Upgrade Memory To 14 Gbps

kyletg

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I have the Gigabyte card...It can't last 5 minutes with the "Fast" new bios. Based on the AMD support forums, I'm not alone in this realization. Of course Gigabyte support wants me to try a new motherboard and new power supply as part of the trouble shooting process o_O
 

InvalidError

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I have the Gigabyte card...It can't last 5 minutes with the "Fast" new bios. Based on the AMD support forums, I'm not alone in this realization.
The joys of AMD making a launch-day product specifications change, not all manufacturers designed their models with sufficient headroom to accommodate the bump so it ends up with a bunch of people feeling screwed over and manufacturers having to deal with support and RMA costs.
 
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Thing is, the EVGA 2060 KO can be found cheaper than an RX 5600XT, has more performance (or equal performance) than a 5600XT, has more features than a 5600XT, has much better drivers than the 5600XT...so why wouldn't you buy a 2060 KO? AMD's pricing structure for Navi is so FUBAR there's really no reason not to...
 

cfbcfb

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Ah yes, the "mysterious" upgrade that came after Nvidia launched a faster card at the same price point. You didn't get a free boost, you were being artificially held back to fit a price/performance slot.

Article also fails to mention that at least one card maker, MSI IIRC, put slower ram on their cards, out of spec, to save a couple of dollars. Those won't OC with stability.
 

spongiemaster

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Article also fails to mention that at least one card maker, MSI IIRC, put slower ram on their cards, out of spec, to save a couple of dollars. Those won't OC with stability.

The memory and the GPU are shipped as a package from AMD to the board partners, so there is no way for an AIB to "cheap out" on the RAM.
 

Deicidium369

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The memory and the GPU are shipped as a package from AMD to the board partners, so there is no way for an AIB to "cheap out" on the RAM.
Why would you think that they are shipped as a package? EVGA regularly uses components out of spec - and some people view them as a top tier manufacturer, rather than a bargain basement product.
 

cfbcfb

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The memory and the GPU are shipped as a package from AMD to the board partners, so there is no way for an AIB to "cheap out" on the RAM.

Eh...whoops....facts.

https://techreport.com/news/3468208/msi-rx-5600-xt-15-gbps-memory-speed/

"MSI is reticent to drop this update on all its cards, though; AMD specced the GDDR6 memory onboard the RX 5600 XT to run at 12 Gbps, and that the update could cause more RMAs for consumers. "

So no, AMD doesn't provide/ship anything other than the gpu, manufacturer chooses the dram and MSI cheaped out. Other, specifically small form factor 5600XT's can't do it either, as their cooling solutions called for the slower, cooler ram speed.
 

spongiemaster

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Why would you think that they are shipped as a package? EVGA regularly uses components out of spec - and some people view them as a top tier manufacturer, rather than a bargain basement product.
When these card were released, GamerNexus interviewed some board partners off the record about what they thought about the last minute spec change. One of the board partners stated that AMD ships the RAM and GPU as a package.
 
Thing is, the EVGA 2060 KO can be found cheaper than an RX 5600XT, has more performance (or equal performance) than a 5600XT, has more features than a 5600XT, has much better drivers than the 5600XT...so why wouldn't you buy a 2060 KO? AMD's pricing structure for Navi is so FUBAR there's really no reason not to...
I'm not sure where you are seeing those prices, but the lowest-priced 2060 listed on PCPartPicker in the US currently starts at $300, while the lowest-priced 5600 XT starts at $260. That 2060 is priced around 15% higher, not less, and that goes when comparing the more premium models as well. It's also possible to get a 5700 for around the same price as a 2060, a card that's on average around 10% faster, and offers more VRAM. Sure, the 2060 offers a few additional features, but you are either paying extra or trading some performance for them.

I would, however, agree that the 5600 XT launch could have been handled better. Rather than having a last-minute BIOS update to increase stock performance, it might have arguably been better to simply leave performance the same and cut the price a bit. At the $280 suggested price, that leaves a rather large price and performance gap between the 5600 XT and AMD's next cards down, priced in the sub-$200 range. There's nothing to directly compete with the $230 1660 SUPER, a card that already made the 1660 Ti mostly redundant. The updated 5600 XT is roughly 50% faster than the 5500 XT, 580 and 590, but only about 10% behind the 5700. At the original clocks and a $250 launch price, it would have filled that gap much more effectively, especially since some models of the 5700 were already priced not much over $300.

I do get the impression that limited 7nm production might be holding AMD back from being more competitive though, perhaps limiting how low it makes sense to go in terms of pricing on these cards, as they are making their CPUs, GPUs and console APUs all on this node. I suspect they make significantly more profit per 7nm wafer off their CPUs, where up to an 8-core processor requires just a tiny 75 mm2 chiplet, and two of those at a combined 150 mm2 are enough for their 12 and 16-core parts. Sure, there's an additional 12nm IO chip that goes into the CPUs, but there are far more components, including things like GDDR6 VRAM and lots of other parts going into a graphics card, so the margins there have to be far lower. The size of the chip used for even a 5500 XT is over 150 mm2, requiring a similar amount of space on a 7nm wafer as the chiplets used for a $720 Ryzen 3950X or a $430 3900X. The 5600 XT, 5700 and 5700 XT use a chip that is over 250 mm2, not all that far behind the combined area of the chiplets used for AMD's 24 and 32-core Threadripper and Epyc parts. And of course, they are obligated to fulfill orders for those large console processors, also being made on 7nm. So, AMD probably doesn't care all that much about being super-competitive in the desktop GPU space at the moment.
 

gg83

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Gamer's Nexus has a nice video about AMD and the ram speed. why some, MSI in particular shipped cards with the 12Gbps because of cost. pretty interesting story.
 

alextheblue

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Gamer's Nexus has a nice video about AMD and the ram speed. why some, MSI in particular shipped cards with the 12Gbps because of cost. pretty interesting story.
When these card were released, GamerNexus interviewed some board partners off the record about what they thought about the last minute spec change. One of the board partners stated that AMD ships the RAM and GPU as a package.
Has anyone OTHER than him said this? Like... confirmation by an OEM to Tom's? Because if that's the case, it seems strange to see some manufacturers have more issues than others.
 

InvalidError

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Has anyone OTHER than him said this? Like... confirmation by an OEM to Tom's? Because if that's the case, it seems strange to see some manufacturers have more issues than others.
Well, even if AMD did provide VRAM with the GPUs, if the GPUs are only officially spec'd to 12Gbps and you received 14Gbps stock, you may be tempted to use your leftover 12Gbps stock and save the 14Gbps stuff for something else. No point in wasting 14Gbps stock on a 12Gbps part. But then you are screwed when AMD decides to change the specs after the cards are already made.
 

spongiemaster

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Has anyone OTHER than him said this? Like... confirmation by an OEM to Tom's? Because if that's the case, it seems strange to see some manufacturers have more issues than others.


Gamers Nexus quoted two different video card manufacturers in their video.

Video card manufacturer #1 to GN - "Manpower is very intensive for validation, especially if you're trying to factory OC the memory from 12Gbps to 14Gbps."

Look at Nvidia cards, do any manufacturers use higher spec memory than Nvidia claims on the spec sheet? No. Some may overclock, but they aren't running faster spec'd chips. If the manufacturer says the RAM is supposed to be 12Gbps, which AMD said, no manufacturer is going to want to pay for 14Gbps even if it were an option. So, as this manufacturer said, all the memory needed to be factory overclocked because AMD told them the spec was supposed to be 12Gbps.

Video card manufacturer #2 to GN - " There aren't any good tests for memory overclocking that's comprehensive across all applications, so RMA's will go up. Also, the memory vendor may change due to supply availability, and now you might not be able to hit that overclocka at all anymore. AMD provides the memory and the GPU as a package to us."


"to us" That's a first person quote, not GN saying we've heard rumors or whatever. Unless you're accusing GN of just making up the statements they posted, I'm not sure what further validation you want. Why would these companies lie? Again, they are also saying the memory needed to be overclocked, because they weren't provided with 14Gbps memory.
 

alextheblue

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Well, even if AMD did provide VRAM with the GPUs, if the GPUs are only officially spec'd to 12Gbps and you received 14Gbps stock, you may be tempted to use your leftover 12Gbps stock and save the 14Gbps stuff for something else. No point in wasting 14Gbps stock on a 12Gbps part. But then you are screwed when AMD decides to change the specs after the cards are already made.
That's probably the best explanation. It makes me wonder... did AMD bundle the RAM because they were hedging their bets (in terms of final specs)? They may very well have told manufacturers they must use this RAM... and then some of them didn't anyway. Personally if I was looking for one of these cards I'd have avoided any cards that shipped with 12gbps to begin with. I picked up a killer deal on a 5700 a long time ago though, normally I don't spend more than $200-250 for a GPU but $279 was close.
 

spongiemaster

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See above. If you were supposed to use the supplied RAM and you didn't, you'd certainly want to point the finger. Even better if you can do so anonymously via GN.
Wouldn't 14gbps GDDR6 cost more than 12Gbps GDDR6? The only way your scenario makes sense is if AMD was providing both at the same price, which would be stupid if they were paying different prices to acquire them. If you were an AIB, would you want to pay extra for 14bgps RAM from AMD when the given specs say the memory is supposed to run at 12gbps? When considering how many options there are for every model and how slim the margins are, it makes no logical sense that any AIB would voluntarily opt for higher than necessary speeds.
 

gg83

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Wouldn't 14gbps GDDR6 cost more than 12Gbps GDDR6? The only way your scenario makes sense is if AMD was providing both at the same price, which would be stupid if they were paying different prices to acquire them. If you were an AIB, would you want to pay extra for 14bgps RAM from AMD when the given specs say the memory is supposed to run at 12gbps? When considering how many options there are for every model and how slim the margins are, it makes no logical sense that any AIB would voluntarily opt for higher than necessary speeds.
The only way would be if AIB binned the ram themselves, then purchased enough 12Gbps ram from another vendor. Used cheaper/ram for their cheapest cards. Otherwise the companies are just butthurt.
 

InvalidError

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Wouldn't 14gbps GDDR6 cost more than 12Gbps GDDR6? The only way your scenario makes sense is if AMD was providing both at the same price, which would be stupid if they were paying different prices to acquire them.
Since AMD was allegedly selling the GPU and VRAM as a kit, the AIBs likely wouldn't know how much of what they paid AMD is for GPU vs VRAM. However, it would only make sense for AMD to pay more for 14Gbps instead of 12Gbps for a 12Gbps GPU if it expected to do a last-second spec change.
 

spongiemaster

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Eh...whoops....facts.

https://techreport.com/news/3468208/msi-rx-5600-xt-15-gbps-memory-speed/

"MSI is reticent to drop this update on all its cards, though; AMD specced the GDDR6 memory onboard the RX 5600 XT to run at 12 Gbps, and that the update could cause more RMAs for consumers. "

So no, AMD doesn't provide/ship anything other than the gpu, manufacturer chooses the dram and MSI cheaped out. Other, specifically small form factor 5600XT's can't do it either, as their cooling solutions called for the slower, cooler ram speed.

Here is exhibit A of why you should watch the original source of any news and not just post the synopsis while blindly insulting people. Below is a link to the MSI podcast the techreport post was referring to, time stamped to the coup de grâce .

View: https://youtu.be/_jPeWM-okng?t=1216


"AMD decides and delivers, like Nvidia, as well. If we as a company say we want to make this GPU. What they deliver is, they deliver a bundle usually which is both the GPU and the memory. So they decide the memory."

MSI on the record saying gpu and memory are bundled together by both AMD and Nvidia.

Eh...whoops....facts.
 
May 6, 2020
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My understanding of the situation is that AMD used the same components for 5700 XT & 5600 XT for purpose of saving on costs

The AIBs add additional components such as cooling/voltage (including cooling/voltage for VRAM)

AIBs which had fewer number of models such as Sapphire have provisioned sufficient overhead for overclocking memory speed

AIBs which tried to sell multiple different cards such as XFX, ASUS, MSI etc. fitted different circuitry/components to different models & validated them accordingly

This is why even today XFX has not been able to update memory in their original cards. But all their new cards come with higher memory out of the gate
 
May 6, 2020
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My understanding of the situation is that AMD used the same components for 5700 XT & 5600 XT for purpose of saving on costs

The AIBs add additional components such as cooling/voltage (including cooling/voltage for VRAM)

AIBs which had fewer number of models such as Sapphire have provisioned sufficient overhead for overclocking memory speed

AIBs which tried to sell multiple different cards such as XFX, ASUS, MSI etc. fitted different circuitry/components to different models & validated them accordingly

This is why even today XFX has not been able to update memory in their original cards. But all their new cards come with higher memory out of the gate

Paul Lily from hot hardware has the same understanding too

https://hothardware.com/news/amd-radeon-rx-5600-xt-memory-firmware-updates
 

jonnyboy88

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I have the Gigabyte card...It can't last 5 minutes with the "Fast" new bios. Based on the AMD support forums, I'm not alone in this realization. Of course Gigabyte support wants me to try a new motherboard and new power supply as part of the trouble shooting process o_O
What firmware came on your card? My card came with F60, I updated to FA0 but it wasn't stable. I re-flashed to F2 and it has been working okay, albeit at a lower speed. I opened a support ticket about my problems with FA0, and they told me my card doesn't support either FA0 or F2 (despite them being the only versions listed on their website), and to RMA the card "for correct BIOS re-flashing".

Seems like a bait and switch to me. They can say they support 14gbps knowing their cards wont support it and the vast majority of customers won't bother updating. I replied to the ticket with a link to AMD's announcement and asking if I RMA I will receive a card that supports the latest firmware.
 

Shadowclash10

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Wait, but how much of a performance increase do you get (for those of you who have a 5600 XT with 14GBs)? Is there actually a noticeable benefit? I have no idea if this was a marketing tactic of AMD or not, but all I know is that if they planned this, then maybe there is a performance boost without too much more heat, but if they just figured out how to do this, then other parts of the GPU might not benefit so much, resulting in only a little bit more performance, possible with a lot more heat+power consumption