News AMD RX 7000-series' high idle power draw finally appears to be fixed with the latest 23.12.1 drivers

Status
Not open for further replies.
AMD are such saints for taking months to fix this, meanwhile if it was anyone else they'd be crucified here lmao
You're absolutely, 100% wrong on that one.

It's been a known and very nudged issue with the 7000 series cards since day one and everyone has been annoyed by it. As it's IDLE power, most people probably don't care as much, but it is still an issue. Specially on laptops.

So no: no one I know of and reading here at the forums and the Discord has given AMD a pass on this one.

Regards.
 

bit_user

Polypheme
Ambassador
Thank you very much for testing this, @JarredWaltonGPU .

any activity beyond moving the mouse cursor around will start to increase the power draw.

For example, having the PCAT window open and visible, which shows a constantly changing real-time power draw, increased the power use to over 30W on the 7900 XTX. Opening a web page in Chrome — it's surprising how much power Chrome can use — depending on the content, saw power use jump to anywhere between 30W and 90W.
I'm going to hazard a guess that this could be tamed quite effectively by using a custom frequency curve (or something like that). I expect the GPU is just cranking up its clock speeds too aggressively, at the first sign of activity.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Order 66

bit_user

Polypheme
Ambassador
AMD are such saints for taking months to fix this, meanwhile if it was anyone else they'd be crucified here lmao
Alchemist has a "high idle" problem that was mitigated somewhat, but remains an ongoing issue and I've read will require a hardware change to fully fix. You could poll the public sentiment on that, for comparison.

Also, the MTT S80 reportedly had completely massive idle power draw, at launch - I forget exactly how much, but into the hundreds of Watts. I haven't heard updates on that issue, perhaps because its ongoing performance saga has captured too much attention.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Order 66

bit_user

Polypheme
Ambassador
My idle power is lower than what you are seeing in your charts at 3440x1440 at144hz I see 6-10 Watts on the desktop with a 7900XTX.
Note that the article says they measured it with a hardware meter. The article describes it as a "Nvidia PCAT v2 device". That could account for some differences, perhaps.

@JarredWaltonGPU , do you have a sense of how the software self-reported power compares with your measurements, on your specific GPUs?
 

Order 66

Grand Moff
Apr 13, 2023
2,159
903
2,570
Isn't that valid for everything you didn't know existed because you didn't experience it because you didn't own it? That's a weird thing to say IMHO.
Good point, I suppose you could say that, but my point was that it only affects users with 7000 series cards which I am not one of.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bit_user
Note that the article says they measured it with a hardware meter. The article describes it as a "Nvidia PCAT v2 device". That could account for some differences, perhaps.

@JarredWaltonGPU , do you have a sense of how the software self-reported power compares with your measurements, on your specific GPUs?
Succinctly: The software lies. LOL. But it really depends on what you're looking at, and it can "lie" in the wrong way as well. I do think that the monitor can impact power use still. 3440x1440 @ 144Hz is fewer pixels and thus less data than 3840x2160 @ 144Hz. To be precise, 4K has 67% more pixels than ultrawide 1440p. I don't know precisely how power use scales, but as noted, 4K @ 60Hz significantly dropped power use (by around 35%). That's less than half the data transmitted, though.

Anyway, I just checked using the reference 7900 XTX, and there are a few different options for power that I have readily available. MSI Afterburner clearly isn't getting the correct data, as at one point it showed a steady 35W for a minute or so. The PCAT readings were bouncing between ~30W and ~45W, literally changing every sampling period (I'd guess it updates the display at least 10X per second, possible 20X). Using AMD's drivers, the performance tab showed around 42~45W for Total Board Power.

So of those options, AMD's drivers and TBP were slightly higher than what the PCAT was reading, while Afterburner appeared to only show the GPU power. Older (pre-RDNA3) AMD GPUs I'm pretty sure only report GPU power and don't show TBP in the drivers (I'd need to swap GPUs to verify for certain, though). Note also that all of these required having windows open and visible that were updating portions of the screen, so all of these resulted in higher than "idle" power draw on my system.

Incidentally, bit_user, I have also collected Intel Arc GPU power draw, again at 4K 144Hz with the same monitor. And yeah, it's still not great:

pcat-idle Arc A380,18.21 <-- Gunnir
pcat-idle Arc A580,41.90 <-- Sparkle
pcat-idle Arc A750,35.62 <-- Intel
pcat-idle Arc A770 8GB,40.60 <-- ASRock
pcat-idle Arc A770 16GB,44.66<-- Intel

Sort of funny that the A580 used more power than the A750 and A770 8GB. Not sure if that's Sparkle's fault or something else (probably Sparkle is to blame). I have to go through a bunch more GPUs (AMD 6000-series first, haven't even started checking all the Nvidia GPUs for idle power), but I do plan to add this to reviews in the future.

Speaking of which: What do you (any of you) think is best for showing idle power use? "Full idle" (at the desktop, no active windows visible, which is what I have right now), or would you prefer a light workload like having PCAT's real-time data visible? Or I could launch a web browser and open Tom's Hardware. I've also thought about doing a fullscreen YouTube playback as another data point, though of course that doubles the amount of time per GPU. 🤷‍♂️
 

spongiemaster

Admirable
Dec 12, 2019
2,280
1,285
7,560
Huh? This was a 7000 series issue.
6000 series definitely had idle power usage issues as well. No idea if it ever got fixed.

power-idle.png



This is from a few months ago.

AMD RDNA 2, RDNA 3 GPU Idle Power Draw Reduced By Enabling VRR

Also had high usage for video playback.

power-video-playback.png
 
Speaking of which: What do you (any of you) think is best for showing idle power use? "Full idle" (at the desktop, no active windows visible, which is what I have right now), or would you prefer a light workload like having PCAT's real-time data visible? Or I could launch a web browser and open Tom's Hardware. I've also thought about doing a fullscreen YouTube playback as another data point, though of course that doubles the amount of time per GPU. 🤷‍♂️
I personally think that the "Full Idle" test mentioned is a good baseline and then something like "Light usage" being a 4k60 youtube fullscreen playback would be great. I think those scenarios showcase what people think of when they hear "Idle PC" and what a user might have open when they consider "light usage." I personally use HWinfo Sensors only and set the polling rate to whatever I consider reasonable and stick the TBP on the taskbar bottom right so no additional graphics from software can affect the power numbers. The only graphics moving would be the number readout for wattage in the bottom right. HWinfo also has polling data that you can setup so you don't even have to show that little graphic number in the bottom right, just let it run and get the data from the txt file HWinfo creates.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: KyaraM and bit_user
I personally think that the "Full Idle" test mentioned is a good baseline and then something like "Light usage" being a 4k60 youtube fullscreen playback would be great. I think those scenarios showcase what people think of when they hear "Idle PC" and what a user might have open when they consider "light usage." I personally use HWinfo Sensors only and set the polling rate to whatever I consider reasonable and stick the TBP on the taskbar bottom right so no additional graphics from software can affect the power numbers. The only graphics moving would be the number readout for wattage in the bottom right. HWinfo also has polling data that you can setup so you don't even have to show that little graphic number in the bottom right, just let it tun and get the data from the txt file HWinfo creates.
The power collection isn't the problem. I run the PCAT software, which has in-line power measurement for both the PCIe x16 slot as well as any 8-pin connectors. I just start it logging (after hiding the graph output) and minimize it. When it's showing the window and you can see the real-time updates, power use almost doubles compared to idle, but if the window is minimized it drops back to full idle. I just wipe the first ~1 second and last ~1 second where the window is visible from the CSV file.

So I'll probably try and do that, as well as video playback. I will probably check YouTube versus a local file played via VLC, just because YouTube can be a bit less predictable in terms of network activity and such. Hopefully, VLC and YT are close enough that VLC can work as an easier stand-in. I think there's a good chance that choice of browser would also affect power use for YT playback, as I noticed Edge seemed to routinely kick the 7900 XTX up to around 90W of power use, regardless of what page was open.
 

bit_user

Polypheme
Ambassador
Speaking of which: What do you (any of you) think is best for showing idle power use? "Full idle" (at the desktop, no active windows visible, which is what I have right now), or would you prefer a light workload like having PCAT's real-time data visible? Or I could launch a web browser and open Tom's Hardware. I've also thought about doing a fullscreen YouTube playback as another data point, though of course that doubles the amount of time per GPU. 🤷‍♂️
All of the above sound great. However, if I had to pick one number, I'd go with "full idle" (display on). IMO, having that as the baseline gives more insight into any other numbers.

For "light desktop usage", I wonder if your test automation tools have a way to load up a static web page (full screen) and smooth-scroll from top to bottom at a constant rate? That should be fairly consistent and repeatable, if you use the same HTML file.

Personally, I'd shy away from youtube, since it can use different bandwidth and codecs, depending on the circumstance. For something meant to be a repeatable test, I'd probably use a 4k video file and play it full-screen with Windows Media Player. Probably H.264, since AV1 support won't be universal until at least the next gen.

Lastly, I think "display power saving" idle is also of some interest.

That's my wish list. Thanks for asking!
: )
 
May 31, 2023
63
5
45
Please share more details:
  • GPU model
  • Details about connected monitors: resolution, refresh rate (or range, if VRR enabled), HDMI or DisplayPort?
  • Driver version
  • Any custom settings (e.g. fan curves, voltage, etc.)
  • Any details about how you tested

Thanks!
xfx 7900 xtx
innocn 27m2v 4k 160hz over hdmi hdr with freesync on
driver 23.12.1 only
no custom settings
idle as in staring at desktop with msi afterburner open to see the power usage
 
  • Like
Reactions: bit_user
Status
Not open for further replies.