[announce]Angband 3.0.6 alpha 1 released

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Julian Lighton wrote:
> In article <d2opic$226$04$1@news.t-online.com>,
> Robert Ruehlmann <rr9@thangorodrim.net> wrote:
> >I've prepared an alpha version of Angband 3.0.6 to test the various
tiny
> >changes, tweaks, and bugfixes that have been added since the 3.0.5
release.
> >
> >Changes in Angband 3.0.6 alpha 1:
> >- Wands and staves are no longer destroyed when a recharge attempt
> > backfires. Instead all the charges are drained.
>
> I don't like this. What's the problem with the current system?

+1 to OP.

T.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

> I think scrolls of *recharge* are useless already. Why create something
> like that, so rare and expensive that it's much better and far far far
> easier to find a new staff than the tool used to recharge it ?

heh. the tool used to recharge it is very cheap. and common.
scrolls of recharging.
The proposal of scrolls of *recharging* is relative to V 305 and
before blowabe staves, INSTEAD of as it is now.
Scrolls of recharging - recharge as usual, chance to blow
the staff / wand / whatever
Scrolls of *recharging* - recharge fully, NO chance to blow.

> It's akin to :
> - We want feature A !
> - Feature A is overpowered, we'll create an impossible to find item
> which does that instead. That way it isn't overpowered because nobody
> will use it.

It´s common to me in my characters that get to dlvl 60 or so to
find lots of staves of (useful effect). I use heal staves and generally
throw them away to carry something else useful, recharging only if i
come by scroll.
Recharging 99 staves of Healing (or whatever) fully and
with 0% chance of destruction is really overpower.
Tell me it´s not overpower now.
I bet you´d be happy finding one of these scrolls having back
home a stack of say, only 10 staves of healing.
My last deep char found ~4 scrolls of *aquirement* under 3m
game turns, so i don´t think it would be very rare. Stacking
home staves of (whatever) would be a nice option.

--
I will hold the candle till it burns up my arm.
I'll keep taking punches until their will grows tired.
I will stare the sun down until my eyes go blind.
I won't change direction and I won't change my mind...
How much difference does it make?

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Atriel wrote:

>> I think scrolls of *recharge* are useless already. Why create something
>> like that, so rare and expensive that it's much better and far far far
>> easier to find a new staff than the tool used to recharge it ?
>
> heh. the tool used to recharge it is very cheap. and common.
> scrolls of recharging.
> The proposal of scrolls of *recharging* is relative to V 305 and
> before blowabe staves, INSTEAD of as it is now.
> Scrolls of recharging - recharge as usual, chance to blow
> the staff / wand / whatever
> Scrolls of *recharging* - recharge fully, NO chance to blow.
>
>> It's akin to :
>> - We want feature A !
>> - Feature A is overpowered, we'll create an impossible to find item
>> which does that instead. That way it isn't overpowered because nobody
>> will use it.
>
> It´s common to me in my characters that get to dlvl 60 or so to
> find lots of staves of (useful effect). I use heal staves and generally
> throw them away to carry something else useful, recharging only if i
> come by scroll.
> Recharging 99 staves of Healing (or whatever) fully and
> with 0% chance of destruction is really overpower.
> Tell me it´s not overpower now.
> I bet you´d be happy finding one of these scrolls having back
> home a stack of say, only 10 staves of healing.
> My last deep char found ~4 scrolls of *aquirement* under 3m
> game turns, so i don´t think it would be very rare. Stacking
> home staves of (whatever) would be a nice option.

Recharging stacks of staves is somewhat of a hack already, there's no need
to imporve in that way

What about making scrolls of recharge only give around 1-2 charges for
staves of healing with a very low success probability each. That way, if
you really want to get a few more charges from that staff, you'll have to
carry the scrolls around or take 5lbs/charge with you

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

"Michael Hadjivassiliou" <maniakos@otenet.gr> writes:

> "Raymond Martineau" <bk039@ncf.ca> wrote in message
> news:sf3151ddb32fu9mb8rb840dv09ahbvnnfd@4ax.com...
> > On 03 Apr 2005 20:54:21 -0400, grabiner@alumni.princeton.edu (David J.
> > Grabiner) wrote:
> >
> >>Robert Ruehlmann <rr9@thangorodrim.net> writes:
> >>
> >>> Changes in Angband 3.0.6 alpha 1:
> >>> - Wands and staves are no longer destroyed when a recharge attempt
> >>> backfires. Instead all the charges are drained.
> >>
> >>Not a good idea; a staff of healing now becomes a source of unlimited
> >>healing, since you can recharge when it runs out, and do it a second
> >>time if the first one fails.
> >
> > Agreed. This is unlike weapons where increasing their charge takes a
> > *lot*
> > of time and resourses, as opposed to staves which are good for a few more
>
> I disagree:

> Loosing a staff due to a recharge attempt near the endgame is just
> annoying; not
> catastrophic. You simply spend time finding another one in an earlier
> depth, and
> money is not an issue, so if it comes up in a store you will buy it.

The important staffs near the end of the game are the high-level ones,
such as healing and banishment. They are very rare, almost never found
in the black market, and have only a few charges, so you need to
conserve the charges.

> At the start of the game, money matters. So loosing a staff or wand is
> catastrophic
>
> especially if you bought it on the black market.

If you buy (or find) a powerful staff or wand early in the game, you buy
it for limited use. A wand of dragon's flame and a pile of recharging
scrolls (or a spell) should not be a source of unlimited fire balls
which can be cast repeatedly. In contrast, a rod of fire balls is a
source of unlimited fire balls, but only one can be cast per battle.

--
David Grabiner, grabiner@alumni.princeton.edu, http://remarque.org/~grabiner
Baseball labor negotiations FAQ: http://remarque.org/~grabiner/laborfaq.html
Shop at the Mobius Strip Mall: Always on the same side of the street!
Klein Glassworks, Torus Coffee and Donuts, Projective Airlines, etc.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 13:10:54 -0400, Twisted One <twisted0n3@gmail.invalid>
wrote:

>Raymond Martineau wrote:
>>>Only rings of speed and the artifact rings have effect on the level
>>>feeling. And as far as I know, there are no cursed artifact rings.
>>
>> The Plain Gold Ring is cursed. (But that's a special case.)
>
>Doesn't any out of depth object also affect level feelings, including as
>a special case rings?

It doesn't seem to kick in if the object is cursed or "broken".

But there are still other items that give an automatic boost. For example,
Dragon Scale Mail gives +30 in a_m_aux_2(), regardless of if it's cursed or
not. These rating boosts appear to be hard-coded rather than included in
the data file.

(From what I see, it seems that Rings of Speed shouldn't have gotten this
bonus in the first place in 3.0.5 - wonder how the bug slipped through -
I'll find out after the download.)

>So a ring of dex at 50' should make it "strangely
>lucky" or some such -- even if it's a ring of dex (-3) {cursed}.

Unless it boosts the rating in another method, then it won't affect a
thing.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

"Christophe Cavalaria" <chris.cavalaria@free.fr> wrote in message
news:42518696$0$11978$626a14ce@news.free.fr...
> Atriel wrote:
>
>>> I think scrolls of *recharge* are useless already. Why create something
>>> like that, so rare and expensive that it's much better and far far far
>>> easier to find a new staff than the tool used to recharge it ?
>>
>> heh. the tool used to recharge it is very cheap. and common.
>> scrolls of recharging.
>> The proposal of scrolls of *recharging* is relative to V 305 and
>> before blowabe staves, INSTEAD of as it is now.
>> Scrolls of recharging - recharge as usual, chance to blow
>> the staff / wand / whatever
>> Scrolls of *recharging* - recharge fully, NO chance to blow.
>>
>>> It's akin to :
>>> - We want feature A !
>>> - Feature A is overpowered, we'll create an impossible to find item
>>> which does that instead. That way it isn't overpowered because nobody
>>> will use it.
>>
>> It´s common to me in my characters that get to dlvl 60 or so to
>> find lots of staves of (useful effect). I use heal staves and generally
>> throw them away to carry something else useful, recharging only if i
>> come by scroll.
>> Recharging 99 staves of Healing (or whatever) fully and
>> with 0% chance of destruction is really overpower.
>> Tell me it´s not overpower now.
>> I bet you´d be happy finding one of these scrolls having back
>> home a stack of say, only 10 staves of healing.
>> My last deep char found ~4 scrolls of *aquirement* under 3m
>> game turns, so i don´t think it would be very rare. Stacking
>> home staves of (whatever) would be a nice option.
>
> Recharging stacks of staves is somewhat of a hack already, there's no need
> to imporve in that way
>
> What about making scrolls of recharge only give around 1-2 charges for
> staves of healing with a very low success probability each. That way, if
> you really want to get a few more charges from that staff, you'll have to
> carry the scrolls around or take 5lbs/charge with you

You are talking about non-linear recharge costs here:

1) Each staff or wand has a unit charge recharge cost x which depends on
it's type: big for staves of healing and really small for light
2) A Scroll of recharge restores say 100 charge cost. It would be 2 charges
of healing if x=50 or 10 charges of light if x=10 WITH the fail rate
causing staff/wand destruction.
3) A Scroll of *Recharge* restores say 10000 charge cost WITHOUT fail.

This prevents the staff stack exploit, and balances recharging w.r.t. staff
type.
I like it.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Yep, very good idea!

Really, Warriors (and whatever) non mage class that wants
to play with mage toys (staves/wands) should have an
explosion in their faces sooner or later. The explosion
from MDs should have nastier effects...
but instead it was completely removed!
BTW
I like swords.

--
I will hold the candle till it burns up my arm.
I'll keep taking punches until their will grows tired.
I will stare the sun down until my eyes go blind.
I won't change direction and I won't change my mind...
How much difference does it make?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 22:41:55 -0400, Raymond Martineau wrote:

>On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 13:10:54 -0400, Twisted One <twisted0n3@gmail.invalid>
>wrote:
>
>>Raymond Martineau wrote:
>>>>Only rings of speed and the artifact rings have effect on the level
>>>>feeling. And as far as I know, there are no cursed artifact rings.
>>>
>>> The Plain Gold Ring is cursed. (But that's a special case.)
>>
>>Doesn't any out of depth object also affect level feelings, including as
>>a special case rings?
>
>It doesn't seem to kick in if the object is cursed or "broken".

Hi Raymond,

Correct - the out-of-depth bonus to rating is only applied if the item
is neither cursed nor broken.


>But there are still other items that give an automatic boost. For example,
>Dragon Scale Mail gives +30 in a_m_aux_2(), regardless of if it's cursed or
>not. These rating boosts appear to be hard-coded rather than included in
>the data file.
>
>(From what I see, it seems that Rings of Speed shouldn't have gotten this
>bonus in the first place in 3.0.5 - wonder how the bug slipped through -
>I'll find out after the download.)

I don't think it's a bug. These are the types of objects that have a
hard-coded boost to rating:

DSM (all types) +30
Ring of Speed (except when cursed) +25
Amulets of Magi, Devotion, Weaponmastery, Trickery +25

The four amulets can't be cursed. I'm not sure about the DSM (never
found a cursed DSM, though), but AFAICT from the source, the +30 would
apply to cursed DSM just as well.


>>So a ring of dex at 50' should make it "strangely
>>lucky" or some such -- even if it's a ring of dex (-3) {cursed}.
>
>Unless it boosts the rating in another method, then it won't affect a
>thing.

Since it's cursed, a Ring of Dex (-3) won't affect the level feeling in
any way.

Best, Hugo
--
Your sig line (k) was stolen! (more)
There is a puff of smoke!

(Remove NO and SPAM to get my e-mail address)

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Thrice the brinded cat hath mewed, and Michael Hadjivassiliou did decree on 4 Apr 2005...

[snippity snip]
> >> A recharge shop service that would cost an insane amount of
> >> money with complete safety i think would be cool.
> >> Like, 5000 per healing charge, etc.
> >
> > I totally agree with this last one.
> >
>
> Adding a shop service is a big change IMHO. And beyond recharging, there are
> many services that could be added. (Zangband has many).
Agreed. Shop services belong in NPP or a similar variant. Much as I
like them, they seem to 'un-Vanilla-ish'.

BTW, are you talking about Cthangband? AFAIK, Zangband doesn't have
store services - not in the regular shops anyhow...
>
> How about adding rare and expensive Scrolls of *Recharge* that recharge to
> full charges without fail, and keep the current fail=destroy behaviour in
> normal scrolls of recharge?
Ah. *Now* you're talking. This would restore the game balance from
wands/staves being easy healing etc., but not tip it too far towards
the old behaviour (recharging being useless IMHO).
--
- Martin Bazley - "The only good zombie is a dead zombie" /
martin@bazley.freeuk.com _____________________________/_
Wimbledon, London, England /|> | < / /\ < |>| | | |_ < /\ |/
__________________________/ |\ | _> \_ \/ _> |\ \/ |_ |_ _> \/ |\

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Thrice the brinded cat hath mewed, and Werner Bär did decree on 4 Apr 2005...

> In the early game, a cursed speed ring can be a nice find.
> Once i got a -1 speed ring around 1000'. I carried it around, until
> i found one of the umbar twins. After that, i was able to sell it to
> the black market for 30.000 Gold (thanks to amnesia).
>
> Werner.
>
Why the Black Market? Magic Shop full up?
--
- Martin Bazley - "The only good zombie is a dead zombie" /
martin@bazley.freeuk.com _____________________________/_
Wimbledon, London, England /|> | < / /\ < |>| | | |_ < /\ |/
__________________________/ |\ | _> \_ \/ _> |\ \/ |_ |_ _> \/ |\

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Thrice the brinded cat hath mewed, and Twisted One did decree on 4 Apr 2005...

> Werner Bär wrote:
> > In the early game, a cursed speed ring can be a nice find.
> > Once i got a -1 speed ring around 1000'. I carried it around, until
> > i found one of the umbar twins. After that, i was able to sell it to
> > the black market for 30.000 Gold (thanks to amnesia).
>
> *gasp* That's cheating!
>
> Well, abusing a game mechanic (if you can call the shopkeepers only
> knowing whatever YOU know about any given item a "game mechanic" rather
> than "a really, really unjustifiably unrealistic programming shortcut"...)
>
If they *did* know about Item X being cursed, then they wouldn't buy
it. Hey presto! Primitive, free identify. Could that have something
to do with it?
--
- Martin Bazley - "The only good zombie is a dead zombie" /
martin@bazley.freeuk.com _____________________________/_
Wimbledon, London, England /|> | < / /\ < |>| | | |_ < /\ |/
__________________________/ |\ | _> \_ \/ _> |\ \/ |_ |_ _> \/ |\

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On Wed, 06 Apr 2005 15:31:30 +0100, Martin Bazley
<martin@bazley.freeuk.com> wrote:

>Thrice the brinded cat hath mewed, and Werner Bär did decree on 4 Apr 2005...
>
>> In the early game, a cursed speed ring can be a nice find.
>> Once i got a -1 speed ring around 1000'. I carried it around, until
>> i found one of the umbar twins. After that, i was able to sell it to
>> the black market for 30.000 Gold (thanks to amnesia).
>>
>> Werner.
>>
>Why the Black Market? Magic Shop full up?

Well, if he got 30,000, the Magic Shop may have had a lower payout
limit.

R. Dan Henry
danhenry@inreach.com

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

In article <234e63574d.martin@freeuk.com>,
Martin Bazley <martin@bazley.freeuk.com> wrote:
>Thrice the brinded cat hath mewed, and Michael Hadjivassiliou did decree
>on 4 Apr 2005...
>> How about adding rare and expensive Scrolls of *Recharge* that recharge to
>> full charges without fail, and keep the current fail=destroy behaviour in
>> normal scrolls of recharge?
>Ah. *Now* you're talking. This would restore the game balance from
>wands/staves being easy healing etc., but not tip it too far towards
>the old behaviour (recharging being useless IMHO).

I don't find recharging anything like useless. My recent characters
are carrying around a small stack of scrolls.
--
Julian Lighton jl8e@fragment.com
/* You are not expected to understand this. */

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

On 2005-04-04 13:36:48, Hugo Kornelis <Angband@hugo.is_NO_dit.c_SPAM_om> wrote:

>
> Only rings of speed and the artifact rings have effect on the level
> feeling. And as far as I know, there are no cursed artifact rings.
>

Ah, I forgot about that too...

--
--

Anssi Ramela

anssi.ramela@myy.helia.fi

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

"Martin Bazley" <martin@bazley.freeuk.com> schrieb ...

>> i found one of the umbar twins. After that, i was able to sell it to
>> the black market for 30.000 Gold (thanks to amnesia).

> Why the Black Market? Magic Shop full up?

Lower maximum price.

Werner.

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Robert Ruehlmann wrote:

> Changes in Angband 3.0.6 alpha 1:
> - Added Craig Oliver's Sound FX Patch version 1.1 that adds about 120
> new sound events to the game.
> (see also http://www.chambrook.org/angband/soundfx.php)

Robert, would you be interested in adding my patch to support sounds
under Lunux? I have patches for both 3.0.5 vanilla and Craig's
"soundfx" 3.0.5 version at
http://people.smartchat.net.au/~caboo/angband/

I can supply you with a patch against the 3.0.6. alpha 1 sources if you
like.

Regards,

- Brendon.

 

[bill]

Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

Robert Ruehlmann wrote:
> I've prepared an alpha version of Angband 3.0.6 to test the various
tiny
> changes, tweaks, and bugfixes that have been added since the 3.0.5
release.
>
> Angband 3.0.6 alpha 1 is available as source code:
>
ftp://ftp.thangorodrim.net/pub/angband/Source/angband-3.0.6-alpha1.tar.gz
> and Mac OS X version:
>
ftp://ftp.thangorodrim.net/pub/angband/Macintosh/Angband-306-alpha1-osx.dmg
> DOS and Windows versions will follow in the next few days.
>
> - Added missing tiles and tile assignments for the 32x32 tiles. (Ivan
> Jekic and David Gervais)

Do you have a new tileset available or was this just a change in the
..prf files?

Bill

 

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Archived from groups: rec.games.roguelike.angband (More info?)

> BTW, are you talking about Cthangband? AFAIK, Zangband doesn't have
> store services - not in the regular shops anyhow...

In Z, you can find those services e.g. in the various towers outside the
towns (if you play multiple towns with wilderness). however there are
also shops in the towns that offer services like enchanting items,
identify, healing, restoration etc. The recharge service is imo located
in the sorcery tower.

Dirk G.