sychodelix
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- Dec 31, 2007
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[citation][nom]ossie[/nom]It's "obsolete" since m$ "developers" weren't capable (or willing) to write some decent support - originally it's Apple technology - so just crappy USB support is "in" - wintel "technology", great to unnecessarily load the CPU (wasn't nicknamed "unused serial bus" for years, for nothing). Winmodem anyone?Don't forget, TH is bend over to glorify any m$ $hit - the two m$ fanbozos (yummy boy & tuanny boy) are representative for this trend ($$$ involved).[/citation]
I keep telling people it's not about opinions, it's about being right. All you trolls know how to do when faced with facts is hurl insults?
The only reason FireWire is obsolete is because people don't use it very often. In fact, it's about as popular as floppy and IDE tech, and all three are on the decline. Yet some people will use the floppy to load AHCI or RAID drivers with WinXP, so that almost qualifies as a "need", and you have to ask yourself how many people actually "need" FireWire.
Are there more FireWire users than Windows XP users?
I don't expect any honest answers from a troll, just more insults. Go ahead, I can take it, and it weakens your position.
I keep telling people it's not about opinions, it's about being right. All you trolls know how to do when faced with facts is hurl insults?
The only reason FireWire is obsolete is because people don't use it very often. In fact, it's about as popular as floppy and IDE tech, and all three are on the decline. Yet some people will use the floppy to load AHCI or RAID drivers with WinXP, so that almost qualifies as a "need", and you have to ask yourself how many people actually "need" FireWire.
Are there more FireWire users than Windows XP users?
I don't expect any honest answers from a troll, just more insults. Go ahead, I can take it, and it weakens your position.
Ok, great to see mATX articles like this. Bravo. But, I'd like to see the airport test. Let's see how well an mATX machine vs. a full sized machine survive.
On the one hand, with the mATX, you can store it carefully in the overhead bin. The full sized machine can weigh a hefty 20kg taking up a significant chunk of your weight allowance - all of it if you're flying around in Asian airlines. I've also seen the inspectors' bashing, not to mention baggage handling bashing, that the machine can take in its voyage.
On the one hand, with the mATX, you can store it carefully in the overhead bin. The full sized machine can weigh a hefty 20kg taking up a significant chunk of your weight allowance - all of it if you're flying around in Asian airlines. I've also seen the inspectors' bashing, not to mention baggage handling bashing, that the machine can take in its voyage.
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[citation][nom]wordsworm[/nom]Ok, great to see mATX articles like this. Bravo. But, I'd like to see the airport test. Let's see how well an mATX machine vs. a full sized machine survive. On the one hand, with the mATX, you can store it carefully in the overhead bin. The full sized machine can weigh a hefty 20kg taking up a significant chunk of your weight allowance - all of it if you're flying around in Asian airlines. I've also seen the inspectors' bashing, not to mention baggage handling bashing, that the machine can take in its voyage.[/citation]
Airport test would be for PC cases.
Airport test would be for PC cases.
[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]I keep telling people it's not about opinions, it's about being right. All you trolls know how to do when faced with facts is hurl insults?The only reason FireWire is obsolete is because people don't use it very often. In fact, it's about as popular as floppy and IDE tech, and all three are on the decline. Yet some people will use the floppy to load AHCI or RAID drivers with WinXP, so that almost qualifies as a "need", and you have to ask yourself how many people actually "need" FireWire.Are there more FireWire users than Windows XP users?I don't expect any honest answers from a troll, just more insults. Go ahead, I can take it, and it weakens your position.[/citation]
If you like to stick with the m$ fanbozos bunch, or even be a part of it, it's your own right. But don't come up with the "being right" tune, supported by the "popularity" argument. If you can't support your opinions with technical arguments, you just paint anyone of different opinions (aka "not right" in your vi$ion) a "troll".
Floppy "need", in windblow$ xpire and $erver 2k3 installation, is just another aspect of m$ incompetence - extended by incompatibilities with some USB drives, which work in the BIOS part, to first load the "F6" drivers - but fail in the subsequent parts of the installation process.
IEEE 1394 is there to stay, even if m$ and their lu$er crowd$ try to deny it. I won't dig into the aspects of it's technical superiority, they are clear to all, except m$ fanbozo$.
I would also expect a diatribe about the obsolescence of SCSI...
If you like to stick with the m$ fanbozos bunch, or even be a part of it, it's your own right. But don't come up with the "being right" tune, supported by the "popularity" argument. If you can't support your opinions with technical arguments, you just paint anyone of different opinions (aka "not right" in your vi$ion) a "troll".
Floppy "need", in windblow$ xpire and $erver 2k3 installation, is just another aspect of m$ incompetence - extended by incompatibilities with some USB drives, which work in the BIOS part, to first load the "F6" drivers - but fail in the subsequent parts of the installation process.
IEEE 1394 is there to stay, even if m$ and their lu$er crowd$ try to deny it. I won't dig into the aspects of it's technical superiority, they are clear to all, except m$ fanbozo$.
I would also expect a diatribe about the obsolescence of SCSI...
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[citation][nom]ossie[/nom]m$ fanbozos bunch...can't support your opinions with technical arguments.IEEE 1394 is there to stay, even if m$ and their lu$er crowd$ try to deny it.[/citation]
The thing about being right is having facts. You don't seem to have any, so, point me to a few recent IEEE-1394 devices. Show me how well they're selling.
It's like External SCSI peripherals, a great concept that died because too few people adopted it. It's not my fault, it's yours, so go buy a couple million FireWire devices and hand them out to all your favorite people, to keep the market moving.
The thing about being right is having facts. You don't seem to have any, so, point me to a few recent IEEE-1394 devices. Show me how well they're selling.
It's like External SCSI peripherals, a great concept that died because too few people adopted it. It's not my fault, it's yours, so go buy a couple million FireWire devices and hand them out to all your favorite people, to keep the market moving.
IEEE 1394 is "pour le connaisseur", not for some dumbed down m$ lu$er - for which USB fits the bill. Ever tried to make a comparison between FW and USB to connect a DA/V device, external HD, etc.?
Almost any high-end devices you'll search will have support for it (FW not USB, keep dreaming). Consumer junk doesn't apply.
Do you really believe USB will replace FW in studio equipment?
FW was specifically designed to replace those external (low/medium speed) SCSI device interfaces, as it supports the SCSI protocol stack - no SW changes necessary - it's cheaper, allows external device powering, etc.
External SCSI peripherals (also with the newer SAS transport) are doing well enough. All high performance tape drives are using it. I could also mention FC, mostly for external storage racks. Any external device that needs the BW, uses it.
If you have the impression that, if some technology isn't used as wide as possibly, it's obsolete, then I already pity you as a technical reviewer. Just try to get your head out of the m$ $hit bowl, you might have a surprise at how well fresh air smells.
Almost any high-end devices you'll search will have support for it (FW not USB, keep dreaming). Consumer junk doesn't apply.
Do you really believe USB will replace FW in studio equipment?
FW was specifically designed to replace those external (low/medium speed) SCSI device interfaces, as it supports the SCSI protocol stack - no SW changes necessary - it's cheaper, allows external device powering, etc.
External SCSI peripherals (also with the newer SAS transport) are doing well enough. All high performance tape drives are using it. I could also mention FC, mostly for external storage racks. Any external device that needs the BW, uses it.
If you have the impression that, if some technology isn't used as wide as possibly, it's obsolete, then I already pity you as a technical reviewer. Just try to get your head out of the m$ $hit bowl, you might have a surprise at how well fresh air smells.
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[citation][nom]ossie[/nom]Just try to get your head out of the m$ $hit bowl, you might have a surprise at how well fresh air smells.[/citation]
Well, like I said, trolling. Anyway, it's nice to see how the other half live, but here on this side of reality it doesn't matter how good something is if it doesn't sell.
Well, like I said, trolling. Anyway, it's nice to see how the other half live, but here on this side of reality it doesn't matter how good something is if it doesn't sell.
[citation][nom]Crashman[/nom]Well, like I said, trolling. Anyway, it's nice to see how the other half live, but here on this side of reality it doesn't matter how good something is if it doesn't sell.[/citation]
Oh, yes, the old m$ supreme argument - quantity trumps quality (we have xx% of marketshare) - parroted all over again. No wonder the world is in that big $hithole, with all those idiot$ around. Happy m$ a$$ licking... in your $ad "reality".
Oh, yes, the old m$ supreme argument - quantity trumps quality (we have xx% of marketshare) - parroted all over again. No wonder the world is in that big $hithole, with all those idiot$ around. Happy m$ a$$ licking... in your $ad "reality".
- Dec 31, 2007
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[citation][nom]ossie[/nom]Oh, yes, the old m$ supreme argument - quantity trumps quality (we have xx% of marketshare) - parroted all over again. No wonder the world is in that big $hithole, with all those idiot$ around. Happy m$ a$$ licking... in your $ad "reality".[/citation]
What I'd like to know is who gave your comment a thumbs up, since it's obvious that you are only complaining to see yourself complain. Did you get a second account set up on a second browser so you could give yourself plusses and me minuses?
When you do finally hunt down those modern FireWire devices, make sure you pick up a few modern AGP video cards for me.
And like I said, it's your fault FireWire died anyway, blaming me serves no purpose. FireWire support is no longer a matter of software, it's a matter of marketing, and you haven't promoted it enough to keep that market open.
Tell me this: Why is it when I say "FireWire Good" you continue on some inane rant about software? Simply because I said you were trolling?
You shouldn't feel insulted to be called a troll, after all I wouldn't feel insulted to be called a realist. It's what we do.
What I'd like to know is who gave your comment a thumbs up, since it's obvious that you are only complaining to see yourself complain. Did you get a second account set up on a second browser so you could give yourself plusses and me minuses?
When you do finally hunt down those modern FireWire devices, make sure you pick up a few modern AGP video cards for me.
And like I said, it's your fault FireWire died anyway, blaming me serves no purpose. FireWire support is no longer a matter of software, it's a matter of marketing, and you haven't promoted it enough to keep that market open.
Tell me this: Why is it when I say "FireWire Good" you continue on some inane rant about software? Simply because I said you were trolling?
You shouldn't feel insulted to be called a troll, after all I wouldn't feel insulted to be called a realist. It's what we do.
so these articles were well underway, even complete, before the SBM, yet you still refused to use the GENE in at least 1 build? Still not impressed.
And OSSIE, dude, just sit down with your mac in the corner and be happy silently, please. You chose a mac, the rest of us chose compatibility and upgradeability. Agree to disagree. Firewire was great in its day, but is now viewed as a proprietary mac device. And as eSATA is very common now, YES, it is obsolete. USB (when used for external hard drives) can also be considered obsolete, if it makes you feel better. eSATA is just faster.
And OSSIE, dude, just sit down with your mac in the corner and be happy silently, please. You chose a mac, the rest of us chose compatibility and upgradeability. Agree to disagree. Firewire was great in its day, but is now viewed as a proprietary mac device. And as eSATA is very common now, YES, it is obsolete. USB (when used for external hard drives) can also be considered obsolete, if it makes you feel better. eSATA is just faster.
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Or, let's put it in terms everyone can understand. Do you refuse to drive an F1 trainer car? Yes, it has to be made available to you before you can refuse, or accept, to use it.
Tom's Hardware used retail parts in the SBM's and Newegg didn't properly list the Gene in its catalog until after the second SBM article was published. All the nagging in the world can't change it since it's impossible to change. If you're one of the six or so people who complained about it in the SBM, you should be crying to Newegg about the mistake in its catalog. But since they fixed the mistake last week, they probably won't even know what you're talking about.
When I choose the DFI LANParty Jr X58 to build a new desktop machine, it was the only game in town. The ASUS solution was months in coming. Since an important issue for me was heat and fan noise, I'm glad I ended up with the most power efficient solution. It has proved a solid worker in daily use for months.
If there is one item that I do not understand is that there is so much comment on how hardcore overclocking looks at speed and performance yet there is one item that is constantly taken for granted, HDD performance.
Everyone that knows about raid loves to use it and for an overclocker you wont find much faster. Not even just for overclocking but even your general user that would like to have the security of not loosing their data from a HDD crash. So many boards have onboard raid controllers yet if you enable it all of your SATA ports are useless unless its for the raid. It is sad that such a simple concept of being able to use a SATA optical drive with a raid system is impossible on nearly all of the boards that support Raid. I find it so sad that such a concept that has so much potential to improve on overall system performance and user experience is left in the dark. A simple layout that includes 1 optical drive and 2 drives in Raid 0 or 1 is nearly impossible without getting addon cards. And I state nearly because I have not checked every board out there but out of the number of the ones I have looked into its not possible.
Everyone that knows about raid loves to use it and for an overclocker you wont find much faster. Not even just for overclocking but even your general user that would like to have the security of not loosing their data from a HDD crash. So many boards have onboard raid controllers yet if you enable it all of your SATA ports are useless unless its for the raid. It is sad that such a simple concept of being able to use a SATA optical drive with a raid system is impossible on nearly all of the boards that support Raid. I find it so sad that such a concept that has so much potential to improve on overall system performance and user experience is left in the dark. A simple layout that includes 1 optical drive and 2 drives in Raid 0 or 1 is nearly impossible without getting addon cards. And I state nearly because I have not checked every board out there but out of the number of the ones I have looked into its not possible.
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[citation][nom]Biolitt11[/nom]If there is one item that I do not understand is that there is so much comment on how hardcore overclocking looks at speed and performance yet there is one item that is constantly taken for granted, HDD performance.Everyone that knows about raid loves to use it and for an overclocker you wont find much faster. Not even just for overclocking but even your general user that would like to have the security of not loosing their data from a HDD crash. So many boards have onboard raid controllers yet if you enable it all of your SATA ports are useless unless its for the raid. It is sad that such a simple concept of being able to use a SATA optical drive with a raid system is impossible on nearly all of the boards that support Raid. I find it so sad that such a concept that has so much potential to improve on overall system performance and user experience is left in the dark. A simple layout that includes 1 optical drive and 2 drives in Raid 0 or 1 is nearly impossible without getting addon cards. And I state nearly because I have not checked every board out there but out of the number of the ones I have looked into its not possible.[/citation]
Tom's tests integrated RAID controllers per chipset, not per motherboard, since the implementation is the same for a variety of boards that use the same chipset. Please look for corresponding articles that compare the ICH10R to other solutions, I'm sure I've seen those. Patrick and Achim specialize in those types of tests.
Tom's tests integrated RAID controllers per chipset, not per motherboard, since the implementation is the same for a variety of boards that use the same chipset. Please look for corresponding articles that compare the ICH10R to other solutions, I'm sure I've seen those. Patrick and Achim specialize in those types of tests.
petar
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- May 16, 2004
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I am not confident in this article as it doesn't state any problems with DFI mobo; I had many issues and took me long time to make it run properly and still having problem with starup after shutdown.
I have this famous X58-T3H6 (DFI) board and I have impression that mobo is not tested enough while the bios is not high quality as other DFI boards that I have. At first glance it has all features as other DFI boards, but many of features are not working properly. Here are my objections:
- Spell errors in bios features until latest version (solved in very late bios release around may 2010).
- In bios, when selecting new value for e.g. cpu cache clock, numbers are partially overwritten with text from help. Instead of "4800 MT/s" it says "480 Internal cach".
- Once I shut it down, it can't be started up easily. I need to unplug the cord for few secs and then click on power to start it up.
- It has only 6 phase cpu power supply, while minimum on now days boards is 8. Gigabyte has 32 phase. This makes me suspicious on overclocking capabilities and reaching 4Ghz with i7 920.
- Power on after power fail feature doesn't work.
- Can't start mobo with keyboard or mouse
- Power on usb and keyboard not working (after setting proper jumpers).
- sometimes forgets from which disk to boot.
- additional Power supply socket (they used female floppy connector) that is on mobo is too close to 16x PCIe, same goes for audio connector (front pannel). When Graphic card is plugged into this 16x slot it presses them so hard that they are being strongly bended below. Heat of graphic card might melt down cables. Although graphic card can be put on other 16x slot I needed it for some other card.
There are all kind of this little problems there as you see above that I simply have perception that this mobo was left behind and no one cares to fix bios issues nor to fix layout problems.
I raised questions on DFI forum whether anyone else has these bios issues, but it seems that mobo is not often owned. I will RMA board, but I need replacement one first.
I don't know why none of above problems were mentioned in article, there are few important issues : e.g. 6 phase not mentioned in overclocking section. Spellcheck problems in bios. Power up with keyboard, etc..
I was lead by this article to buy this mobo and this mobo made my life quite difficult so I want to warn Guys @ tomshardware to check standard features as well not only advanced stuff.
I have this famous X58-T3H6 (DFI) board and I have impression that mobo is not tested enough while the bios is not high quality as other DFI boards that I have. At first glance it has all features as other DFI boards, but many of features are not working properly. Here are my objections:
- Spell errors in bios features until latest version (solved in very late bios release around may 2010).
- In bios, when selecting new value for e.g. cpu cache clock, numbers are partially overwritten with text from help. Instead of "4800 MT/s" it says "480 Internal cach".
- Once I shut it down, it can't be started up easily. I need to unplug the cord for few secs and then click on power to start it up.
- It has only 6 phase cpu power supply, while minimum on now days boards is 8. Gigabyte has 32 phase. This makes me suspicious on overclocking capabilities and reaching 4Ghz with i7 920.
- Power on after power fail feature doesn't work.
- Can't start mobo with keyboard or mouse
- Power on usb and keyboard not working (after setting proper jumpers).
- sometimes forgets from which disk to boot.
- additional Power supply socket (they used female floppy connector) that is on mobo is too close to 16x PCIe, same goes for audio connector (front pannel). When Graphic card is plugged into this 16x slot it presses them so hard that they are being strongly bended below. Heat of graphic card might melt down cables. Although graphic card can be put on other 16x slot I needed it for some other card.
There are all kind of this little problems there as you see above that I simply have perception that this mobo was left behind and no one cares to fix bios issues nor to fix layout problems.
I raised questions on DFI forum whether anyone else has these bios issues, but it seems that mobo is not often owned. I will RMA board, but I need replacement one first.
I don't know why none of above problems were mentioned in article, there are few important issues : e.g. 6 phase not mentioned in overclocking section. Spellcheck problems in bios. Power up with keyboard, etc..
I was lead by this article to buy this mobo and this mobo made my life quite difficult so I want to warn Guys @ tomshardware to check standard features as well not only advanced stuff.
- Dec 31, 2007
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[citation][nom]petar[/nom]- additional Power supply socket (they used female floppy connector) that is on mobo is too close to 16x PCIe[/citation] Not used in the test, IMO it's there just because someone asked for it, but its otherwise useless and certainly not a feature.[citation][nom]petar[/nom]same goes for audio connector (front pannel). When Graphic card is plugged into this 16x slot it presses them so hard that they are being strongly bended below.[/citation]That's already mentioned in the article[citation][nom]petar[/nom]I don't know why none of above problems were mentioned in article, there are few important issues : e.g. 6 phase not mentioned in overclocking section.[/citation]It's mentioned in the features table and not listed elsewhere because it's not very important. For example, Six 40A phases would have as much power as 24 10A phases, and the only good way to figure out which board has the better power regulator is to overclock it and find out what happens.
The only things from your list not mentioned in the article are problems that did not occur during the evaluation.
The only things from your list not mentioned in the article are problems that did not occur during the evaluation.
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