Athlon Vs. Atom: Duel Of The Energy Savers

[Guest]

My Socket 939 Opteron 185 runs fine at 800MHz / 0.8V. Normally you only see notebook CPUs with that clock rate; the trick is that K8s require the processor clock to be at least as fast as the HyperTransport clock. So, you also have to drop the HT multiplier from x5 to x4 before lowering the processor clock, otherwise the CPU will hang. Dunno if the same applies to AM2, but I wouldn't be surprised if it does - that would give you an even lower idle power consumption than your 1GHz / 0.9V setting.

 

[tim851]

The Athlon64 2000+ comes in at 90$ which makes it useless, since AMD has started to sell those 35W Athlon X2s for around 30$. A 35W CPU can still be passively cooled with the right kind of cooler (e.g. Ninja Mini). And it has like 3 times the performance.

The AMD setup in the article will set you back at least 140$, while you can get the Atom board for just over 50$. At 4W more power consumption, you'd have to run the system 24/7 for about 25 years to make up for the initial cost disadvantage. The Athlon might have higher performance, but on an abysmal level.

 

[Guest]

mini itx 780G

http://www.miniitx.biz/mini-itx-motherboard/jw-mini-itx-motherboard/jw-minix-780g-sp128mb-780g-mini-itx/

Don't know when it's coming out.

 

[ZyxMEvEuuxcZ]

Power consumption on ATOM msi wind(Atom mobile motherboard):
http://www.vr-zone.com/articles/MSI_Wind_PC_Dissection_and_Power_Consumption_Test/5802-3.html

 

[apache_lives]

SOI? the thing blows twice the power of the intel cpu at a lower frequencies, the platform is the key not SOI. SOI is rubbish compared to Intel tech.

Optimizer - true, but the option to later upgrade to a quad, or 8+ gb ram, or whatever is more valuable.

Next thing they need is a 800mhz quad or something.

 

[yuhong]

"certainly Intel could make a chipset that can handle all that is done by the 945GC and its laughable GMA 950 in even less power"
In fact they already did, it is called the Intel 945GSE.

 

[Guest]

What I find pretty weird, is that they can't run a Sempron LE-1100 CPU at 0.9V at 1GHz.

This is exactly what I did for my NAS.
Maybe a bad sample...

 

[nirgal]

So, where are the VIA offerings?

 

[geok1ng]

The article only made clear what every enlighted person already knows: Atom is a plataform on the build, and AMD dominates with iron grip the IGP-HTPC market.
Can AMD build a 779G mobo ( smaller and capable of fitting a 7" mininotebook)- YES they can, probably on less than 100 days, Will it help AMD- NOPE they LOST THE TIDE, its a VIA vs Atom game already. They can not produce embebbed mobo+cpu to compete on prices with the current market options, BUT they can make mininotebooks with EXCELLENT IGPS FOR CASUAL GAMERS!

Can Intel make an IGP that can display Blu-Ray movies on a HTPC- nope, they wont do it in the next 18 MONTHS. But atom isnt HTPC geared, its geared towards mobile devices, and currently it lacks a suitable mobo.

 

[MrMilli]

The AMD platform has one disadvantage, however: at present, the 780G chip set is only available on a microATX board, where Intel offers a significantly smaller miniITX board.

This is wrong:
Jetway NC81-LF
http://www.jetway.com.tw/jw/ipcboard_view.asp?productid=515&proname=NC81-LF

J&W 780G-SP128MB
http://www.jwele.com/motherboard_detail.php?419

You also mention that the 780G uses 0.95w TDP compared to 22.2W of the 945GC. This is wrong.
From Wikipedia:

The 780G Northbridge, sporting DirectX 10 support, consumes only 11.4 W on full load, 0.94 watt when idle.

A bit of googling won't hurt before posting the article!

 

[enewmen]

Nice find. Just surprised by the results. I think the Atom is also 32bit, so the Athlon is more future proof (can run a 64bit OS).
Also, like others, I want to see a mini AMD board (system on a chip). Intel should at least get the Atom more mature to run full vista 64 or full windows 7 (smoothly!)
If I'm completely wrong, please yell.

 

[Guest]

What chipset does AMD recommend for this CPU ?
Athlon 64 2000+ can't use the capabilities of the 780G and an older chipset negates the power savings.

So what is AMD thinking releasing this CPU ? Do they really think they will sell and make money on it or is just a PR battle to show that they can do it too.
I don't think AMD is really competing with Atom, it can't. Atom was designed to be cheap and AMD will need to create a totally new CPU to be in the same price range.
AMD should stop chasing ghosts and start delivering what the market is crying for. A cheap, fast and economical CPU that can use 100% of the features of the 780G chipset.

 

[Guest]

Processor's price is not important? Do you notice that ATOM's UMPC cost as much as more powerful laptops?

ATOM maybe cheap but those UMPC's running ATOM are not.

 

[Guest]

O Please in any case AMD is Beatin Intel in all factor what can intel say whit processor of US$ 1000 please if AMD do the same all of us know the result AMD beat Intel

 

[Guest]

My Athlon 64 X2 5600+ (2.9 GHz, 65nm, 65W) is perfectly running at 0,875 V and 1 GHz. It's not like that I own a preselected CPU (3,1 GHz maximum with air cooling), so I dont know why the regular Athlons you tested had crashes with settings like 1 GHz and 0,9 V. My CPU even has two cores instead of the single-core LX-Series Athlon you tested.

But I cant tell you if it's as cold as the A64 2000+, 'cause my Barebone does not allow passive cooling.

 

[Guest]

The form factor is not a factor in comparison, if not, soon, you'll only comparing intel cpu A to intel cpu B, if you are really strict enough. This article is about to ENLIGHTEN AMD to create the smaller form factor.

 

[Guest]

>The AMD platform has one disadvantage, however: at present, the 780G chip
>set is only available on a microATX board, where Intel offers a
>significantly smaller miniITX board.

This seems to be wrong as there is a J&W MiniITX board on it's way using the AMD 780G. It will cost 180,- EUR instead of 55,- EUR for the Gigabyte mATX.

J&W MINIX-780G-SP128MB
http://62.75.219.46/netzladen24-p1055h230s234-J-W-MINIX-780G-SP128.html

 

[Guest]

Look's like I should have read all posts as MrMilli already pointed to the J&W MiniITX board.

 

[Guest]

Very interesting stuff, showing that the old architectures may still have life in them in the low power arena.

Practical applications? Sure the Athlon64@1Ghz will not go in any netbook, but it could well be practical to build a nettop system based on it. Lock the multiplier in the BIOS, and you can forget about a fan , even if it won't be the smallerst nettop, it should work pretty well.

If AMD released it on a smaller package (practical since it needs less cooling) together with smaller MBs, then you could even have netbooks based on it.

Also the Celeron220@1.2Ghz looked good from what was available. It could well turn out that many of these older architectures, when underclocked, give Atom and the VIA nano a run for their money, which I find very interesting. Now Intel has no incentive to promote such solutions. AMD does though, given that they are far behind Intel and VIA in this market.

 

[yasker]

Why you use 945GC rather than 945GM or Poulsbo SCH?
If you can't get Poulsbo SCH(TDP 2.3w), you can still try 945GM(TDP 7w, used by EeePC). You just choose the most power consumption desktop one to do this test(945GC TDP 22.2W), for what? Attract eyes?! I can't believe here is tom's hardware...

 

[dr_disciple]

There is a 780G Mini ITX in the market. Its from J&W and its called the MINIX. I don't see why AMD is lacking in the ITX department....

 

[calyth]

It's nice to see that AMD's designs to have nice longevity and utility, despite that the K8 isn't particularly competitive in the performance realm.

Clocking a K8 to 1GHz with 0.9v will use less energy than the Atom, and can outperform it too.

I don't see not having a commonly used miniITX board as a giant disadvantage. miniITX case cost a good amount, while uATX can be put in an ATX case for cheaper, and we can reuse an old PSU if the case's short of the supply.

What I'm really concerned is that AMD is doing this as a stopgap. The wafer size difference is what will eventually bleed AMD if they continue selling A64 2000+ vs Intel Atom. Intel's chip would cost quite a bit less.

I don't know how much Intel spent R&Ding the Atom - it's a good chunk, that I know - but as they keep up with the A64 vs Atom fight, eventually the cheaper die cost could recoup.

 

[photonboy]

High-Def and CPU:
It's interesting to note that my Athlon X2 4800+ used only 3% to playback several 720p AVC and VC-1 movie trailers. This was done usine Nero Showtime which offloaded basically 100% of the video to my ATI HD3870 video card.

I expect Intel will add power saving support so the 1.6GHz Atom can drop to 1GHz or below in idle.

I'm glad AMD is holding in there. The competition really drives progress. I'd like to build an HTPC in 2010 optimized for video playback and minimal power expenditure in idle and when playing video. I'm hoping to get down to wall power of 5Watts Idle and 15Watts for a BluRay movie.

 

[KyleSTL]

I expect Intel will add power saving support so the 1.6GHz Atom can drop to 1GHz or below in idle.

Really?!?! Because I definitely don't see that EVER happening. It is far more important to lower the NB/SB power consumption and make a IGP worth a crap than to make a form of Speedstep that would drop power consumption by 1W (or less).

 

[knowom]

My E7200 will run as low as 900MHz at 1.12v I wonder what wattage that translates to.