Question Bad electricity causing input lag... :(

Jan 11, 2020
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Hi guys. For years I have suffered with input lag and I've recently noticed something fishy in hardware info 64. I was looking at my 12v rail. MAX 12.024V, MIN 11.952. Mouse seemed okay, not great but okay. Later on after gaming a bit more, mouse went to crap (like really bad input lag). I checked the MIN and it had dropped to 11.880v then 11.808v. Now when the voltage drops to those two numbers, thats when the mouse gets a lot worse. The weird part is, even once it goes back up to 11.952v or 12.024v, the mouse stays messed up, no matter what. Before anyone says its the PSU, I have had input lag on 2 different PSU in the same apartment. Is it possible my electric is absolute trash and would you recommend I get an UPS APC with surge protection, power conditioning, and battery backup? Also I've bought new parts which I specify below but I had input lag with all the old parts too so its nothing to do with the new parts.

My specs are:

Gigabyte GTX 1060 3GB WINDFORCE (OLD)
RYZEN 7 3700X (NEW)
16GB CORSAIR VENGEANCE 8GBX2 2400MHZ (OLD)
1TB SSHD (OLD)
Aorus X570 Elite (NEW)
Corsair CX650W Bronze



Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks guys!
 
Last edited:

Ralston18

Titan
Moderator
Update your post to include full system hardware specs and OS.

I think if the electricity in your apartment was trash you would be having more than computer mouse problems.

Make and model mouse? Wired, wireless?

Have you tried another known working mouse on your computer?

Have you tried your mouse on another known working computer?

Determine if the problem follows the mouse or stays with the computer.

However, the 12 volt rail is overall quite important. What you experience as a mouse problem could instead be related to the PSU. Just manifesting via the GPU which cannot or may not be able to keep up with mouse movements.

In addition, the problem having occurred with two different PSU's could indeed make one believe and eliminate the PSU(s) as the problem.

But if both PSUs were under wattage to support the system then all sorts of things can happen...

Make, model, wattage, age, condition of PSUs?

For more information:

https://www.lifewire.com/computer-power-supply-wattage-832368

https://www.lifewire.com/power-supply-voltage-tolerances-2624583

Note that the voltages you are seeing via hardware info 64 are, if accurate, well within tolerances.
 
Jan 11, 2020
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Update your post to include full system hardware specs and OS.

I think if the electricity in your apartment was trash you would be having more than computer mouse problems.

Make and model mouse? Wired, wireless?

Have you tried another known working mouse on your computer?

Have you tried your mouse on another known working computer?

Determine if the problem follows the mouse or stays with the computer.

However, the 12 volt rail is overall quite important. What you experience as a mouse problem could instead be related to the PSU. Just manifesting via the GPU which cannot or may not be able to keep up with mouse movements.

In addition, the problem having occurred with two different PSU's could indeed make one believe and eliminate the PSU(s) as the problem.

But if both PSUs were under wattage to support the system then all sorts of things can happen...

Make, model, wattage, age, condition of PSUs?

For more information:

https://www.lifewire.com/computer-power-supply-wattage-832368

https://www.lifewire.com/power-supply-voltage-tolerances-2624583

Note that the voltages you are seeing via hardware info 64 are, if accurate, well within tolerances.
Updated parts. thanks for your response.

Wired mouse - razer deathadder chroma

I have tried different mice.
Mouse works fine on other computers.
PSU 1-2 years old (Corsair CP-9020122 CX 650W)
 
Mar 21, 2020
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BRO me too i feel like i have electricity issues as well. No matter what I do with my settings, it's a new PC . It doesn't feel smooth to me and the input lag is too high. Dota 2 is really unplayable for me because of input lag :/ -.-
 

CrucialNUGS

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Nov 24, 2011
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It's not the electricity.
Actually it is something to do with grounding (which is in relation to electricity). I have some compelling reasoning for this and am having trouble proving it. If you would like to know more I can provide info. Maybe someone with your expertise can tell me more about why a high impedance ground will cause our systems to behave this way. I posted on your site and did not get much info, but I need to consult experts about this problem which seems to be affecting many people. I happen to think there is a cause for our grounding systems to be high impedance which in turn does not allow interference to dissipate properly (short to ground) from our PSUs.
 
Mar 1, 2020
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Hi guys. For years I have suffered with input lag and I've recently noticed something fishy in hardware info 64. I was looking at my 12v rail. MAX 12.024V, MIN 11.952. Mouse seemed okay, not great but okay. Later on after gaming a bit more, mouse went to crap (like really bad input lag). I checked the MIN and it had dropped to 11.880v then 11.808v. Now when the voltage drops to those two numbers, thats when the mouse gets a lot worse.
Well, I have a old house that has some funny old fashioned wiring and had two PCs that kept doing strange things on the same electrical circuit.. and like you assumed it was "bad wiring".
But I recently replaced the PSU in my main rig and it solved all the issues.. and I will likewise be doing the same with the other one and expect the same result.
Just my 2cents.

A bad PSU will cause all kinds of bad issues like that.
 
Mar 1, 2020
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Why are you using a PC without an Earth ground?
Well if you live in New England a lot of old houses have no grounds from when the wires were installed originally in the 60-70s.
And electricians are not cheap.

My house has a mix of old vs new wiring.
I replaced my porch light recently and found it had no ground. Most of my upstairs sockets and lights do have ground wires though, since it was updated when work was done on the house more recently.
 

CrucialNUGS

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Nov 24, 2011
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Why are you using a PC without an Earth ground?

I'm still not convinced that's the issue. Unless it's some RF interference....
I am not and never have used my PC without a ground. You did not read my post, if you somehow reached that conclusion.
The grounding in my home seemingly has a "high impedance". This in turn causes the problems I and others have wrote about. It is certainly RF interference in some sense however I believe it has to do with my grounding.
 

CrucialNUGS

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Nov 24, 2011
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Well, I have a old house that has some funny old fashioned wiring and had two PCs that kept doing strange things on the same electrical circuit.. and like you assumed it was "bad wiring".
But I recently replaced the PSU in my main rig and it solved all the issues.. and I will likewise be doing the same with the other one and expect the same result.
Just my 2cents.

A bad PSU will cause all kinds of bad issues like that.
I have the issue OP speaks about and have replaced my PSUs numerous times to where I now own 4 Platinum rated PSUs. All of them display the same issues here from the moment they are plugged in, and did not display the issues at my friends house (confirmed good still). This is not a problem of hardware, it is externally caused and is electrically/grounding related.
 

jonnyguru

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I am not and never have used my PC without a ground. You did not read my post, if you somehow reached that conclusion.
The grounding in my home seemingly has a "high impedance". This in turn causes the problems I and others have wrote about. It is certainly RF interference in some sense however I believe it has to do with my grounding.
I did read your post, thank you.

I thought you were implying that lack of Earth ground on the AC was causing high impedance ground on the DC side.

I have seen issues with high impedance DC ground, but these PSUs are still in EVT stage and never see the light of day.
 

CrucialNUGS

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Nov 24, 2011
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No I was implying that my ground connection (to POCO) is high impedance and not allowing some certain interference RF (high frequency?) from surrounding devices/appliances to dissipate (or return to the source?). I spoke to an EE about my problems and this is what he told me:
"As for how all of this works.. impedance is referring to how easy current flows at various frequencies. It does vary with frequency so high frequency stuff will see higher impedance than low frequency stuff. What that means is that when your device generates RF noise the filters will try shorting it to ground. If you have a low impedance ground then you just get RF current on ground, RF current in a wire can radiate into the air and go into other stuff. It's much worse though when you have a high impedance ground. Current into a high impedance ground turns into a voltage on ground. This will also go into your neutral and you'll see a voltage where it will feed into the filters on other devices (they assume ground is zero) and their voltages can swing at RF rates. Essentially most things are designed to assume ground and neutral are zero volts and reference everything to that. RF noise from a device when you have a high impedance ground basically goes into all other devices instead of the actual ground.

So in the end, RF noise can travel through wires, it can jump from wires to the air, interfere with wireless stuff. Also, yea, power is 120V and the noise is typically tiny milivolts, but your electronics has filters that let noise move to ground, so RF voltages can jump right past the filters in many cases without getting reduced (input might be 120V is 30mV of noise and output could be 3.3V with 30mV of noise). The noise can even get amplified if it messes with sensitive parts.

I suspect your problem is likely something is making a whole lot of noise somewhere, because what you describe is pretty rare, but it's going to take work to find out what is causing it."

Here is my post on your site, maybe it can clarify some of the observations I have seen:
http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?17194-Mouse-Keyboard-Input-lag-related-to-possible-electrical-issues-in-home


You can read my electricians breakdown of the problems he found (on the OCN thread), but after having our entire meter box/mast connection redone the problem is still there (alebiet improved marginally). No matter what filtration techniques I use- Double conversion UPS, Isolation Transformer, Ferrite Cores/Toroid cores on cables, Power conditioners, High grade PSUs the problem is always still there. All of these make differences in the severity of the issues however none of them fix it, almost as if the interference cannot be "shorted to ground" as the EE told me.
 

CrucialNUGS

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Nov 24, 2011
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I did read your post, thank you.

I thought you were implying that lack of Earth ground on the AC was causing high impedance ground on the DC side.

I have seen issues with high impedance DC ground, but these PSUs are still in EVT stage and never see the light of day.
Since you seem to not want to assist me in trying to understand more about these issues could you put me in touch with someone who can? I am desperate here, have hired very good electricians, had the POCO out to my home multiple times and had substantial work done on my home. I need to speak to someone that understands the PC side of this issue as I know there are active problems regarding the return path for current to the transformer however I do not know in what ways it is compromising my ground. Something is interferening with the proper operation of my PCs and I want to find a solution as I clearly cannot just replace hardware to fix this - having tried replacing virtually every component, peripheral, and cable in my system multiple times now.
 
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sonexs

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Feb 13, 2019
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Since you seem to not want to assist me in trying to understand more about these issues could you put me in touch with someone who can? I am desperate here, have hired very good electricians, had the POCO out to my home multiple times and had substantial work done on my home. I need to speak to someone that understands the PC side of this issue as I know there are active problems regarding the return path for current to the transformer however I do not know in what ways it is compromising my ground. Something is interferening with the proper operation of my PCs and I want to find a solution as I clearly cannot just replace hardware to fix this - having tried replacing virtually every component, peripheral, and cable in my system multiple times now.
thanks for your effort. i see you posting also in overclock.net
pls keep us updated here if you find any step further. i thinks it is related to electricity bc, i changed so much over the years and the problem still there.
the weird thing is, that you cant measure a difference in online games, like this problem isnt causing a high ping or packet loss or something. this thing just keeps your pc out of sync it seems
 

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