Question Best CPU For <40mm and <70mm Coolers?

Toggle sidebar Toggle sidebar
Regev

Regev

Honorable
Jul 3, 2020
290
18
10,685
I'm creating two small workstations. One of them has space for an <40mm cooler, the other for an <70mm coolers. Prices aren't a factor at all (We get 50% back anyway). Under these constraints, which CPUs would be able to perform at their 100% without producing too much heat and causing the coolers to spin loud (at least when idle)? (please specify adequate coolers too, if you can).

I was thinking the 7800x3D (because I saw it is very easy to cool) or the i5-14500. But I'm open to anything,

Thanks
 
Regev said:
I'm creating two small workstations. One of them has space for an <40mm cooler, the other for an <70mm coolers. Prices aren't a factor at all (We get 50% back anyway). Under these constraints, which CPUs would be able to perform at their 100% without producing too much heat and causing the coolers to spin loud (at least when idle)? (please specify adequate coolers too, if you can).

I was thinking the 7800x3D (because I saw it is very easy to cool) or the i5-14500. But I'm open to anything,

Thanks
Click to expand...
I doubt any cooler of that size could cool those CPUs. 7800x3D has 120W TDP and i5 14500 between 65W and up to 154W in turbo mode.
 
Which one is easier to cool, the i5 or the 7800x3d?

Seems like the AN600, AXP120 and L12 can all do a pretty good job with the 7800x3d, pretty impressive compared to the much larger U12A:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGinUBppUhc


Screenshot-from-2024-02-21-13-24-33.png
 
But I see the AN600 and AXP120 are 67mm height coolers? Would be perfect for the second case (limited to 70mm height).
 
What is the make/model of the two cases?
Any case will need some airflow to get heat out of the case.

The strongest processor is likely the I9-14900:
https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...-36m-cache-up-to-5-80-ghz/specifications.html
It is a 65w processor that comes with an excellent RH1 laminar flow cooler that is 69mm high:
I have used one with a 12900K and it is silent at idle and not at all noisy under maximum load.

As to the 40mm cooler requirement,
Probably the best is the noctua NH-L9I at 37mm:
noctua.at

NH-L9i

The NH-L9i is a premium quality quiet CPU cooler for Intel LGA115x/1200 based HTPCs and Small Form Factor systems. At a super-low profile of only 37mm, the NH-L9i is ideal for extremely slim cases and due to its 95x95mm footprint, it provides full compatibility with tall RAM modules and VGA...
noctua.at noctua.at

Probably the strongest 35w processors around would be the I9-14900T:
https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...-36m-cache-up-to-5-50-ghz/specifications.html

Intel processors have a thermal limit of 100c.
Motherboards will try to boost performance as much as they can until heat touches that limit, then backs off.
 
Is the RH1 really sufficient to cool a 14900 non-K? How does it compare to the AXP120, AN600 or L12S ?

Did it actually cool your 12900K sufficiently? Seems pretty lacking here:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRMmJMvkom0

I can actually get from Intel (we get special deals from them):

14600K - $240
14700 - $275
14700K - $290
14900 - $365
14900K - $380

As for AMD, i can get:

7600 - $275
7600x - $270
7700 - $375
7700X - $360
7800x3d - $460
7900 - $440
7900x - $455

Anyway, I'm getting 50$% tax returns on all these prices, so really I don't mind the extra if it means fewer noise and heat (throttling). I plan to put DDR5 on the system.

Which combination would you go for ?

Thanks
 
For processors, look at the Processor base power.
I think this is, bay another name TDP or thermal design power.

Processor Base Power​


The time-averaged power dissipation that the processor is validated to not exceed during manufacturing while executing an Intel-specified high complexity workload at Base Frequency and at the junction temperature as specified in the Datasheet for the SKU segment and configuration.

The non K processors will have a base power of 65w
The i9-14900K, i9-12900K and i7-14700K power will be 125w
If you can find a T suffix processor, they will be 35w.

For comparison, the TDP of a ryzen 7-7700X is 105w.

Again, can you provide a link or a diagram of the cases you intend to use?
This is important because whatever heat is generated by the processor must be expelled from the case.
That means good airflow through the case.

In my 12900K test. I used the cpu-Z stress test that exercised all threads at 100% utilization.
I assume that the instructions used were a reasonable mix of instructions.
The test was updated some time ago:
https://www.cpuid.com/news/51-cpu-z-1-79-new-benchmark-new-scores.html

There are other benchmark tests out there that are designed to be more stressful.
The Intel burn test, for example uses instructions that generate the most heat.
The most useful test would be your own apps.


What is the nature of the workload that you are planning?
Is it multithreaded and likely to load all available threads?
Or, is it single thread oriented like many simulations?
In by 12900K test I used a ITX case(lian li PC-Q08) which had a stock 140mm front intake fan.

Modern intel and ryzen processors are designed to perform as best they can until they reach their max temperature. For Intel that is 100c. for ryzen, that is, I think around 85c.
When that point is reached, the processor simply slows down.
A much better solution than crashing which previous generations used to do.

Given your case and cooler limitations, do not expect to run full out.
But, your productivity can still be very high.
Here is an article on what a 13900K can do with limited cooling:
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/intel-core-13900k-cooling-tested

With no budget, I would pick the strongest processor, namely the 14900 or similar.
Better processors will have more cache and processing threads.
With your case and cooling limitations, I would opt for A T suffix processor.

If you want ryzen, the X3d processors are a poor choice since they are oriented to gamers and the underlying processor is stronger in a non X3d variant.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Regev
Thank you so much. So which two of those would you get?

14600K - $240
14700 - $275
14700K - $290
14900 - $365
14900K - $380

One of them will sit in a Malkans SF5A / Custom_Mod SLM1m (48-49 cooler clearance). Note, with the latter the only PSU I can use is HDPlex 250W GaN, so might have to undervolt ? Anyway I don't think these 48-49mm coolers can cool the higher-end CPU properly (I know they reach like 300W, right?).

The other case will have more space for a 70mm cooler - it's the CustomMod SL2 3.7L, and I'll also try the LZMOD A24 V5 (69mm). I can use a FlexATX of however amount of watts I need.

So, questions:

1. Do the non-K CPUs allow undervolting and reducing heat/wattage like the K does ?
2. Would you simply get the K version and tinker with it in the Bios, or just get the regular one and let it be as-is ?
3. Or, for the discounts I mentioned above, would you simply get two 14900K and undervolt them like crazy? I noticed in this video, the 13900K capped at 90W (!!!) produced better multithread perforamnce than a fully-loaded 12900K:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4Bm0Wr6OEQ

(minute 4:00 -> 5:50)

4. How'd the Laminar RH1 cooler that comes with the non-K i9? Is it equivalent to a L12S / AN600 / AXP120 ? It's way prettier for sure 😉
 
Last edited:
Are these the cases in question?
https://www.malkans.com/products/sf5a-mini-itx-apu-pc-case
If so, I think I can help here.
I have a fun case , lian li pc q08 which is very much like the larger sf8G case.
In it I have a i9-12900K processor with a base power of 125w and a RH1 cooler that is 69mm tall. It will fit in your sf8g case remarkably similar as to how it fits in the pc-q08.
Similarly, I have a 140mm front intake fan and a 120mm top/rear exhaust fan.
The motherboard is a asus strix B760I
As I am writing this, I am running a cpu-z stress test.
All P cores are running at about 4.1 and pushing 100c.
Temperatures are about 98c. with occasional touches to 100c.
The E cores are clocked at 3.3 with no throttling.
The RH1 cooler is running at about 2950 rpm and is not noisy at all.
At 2 feet away, it is a low hum.
The front 140mm intake is running at 980 rpm and is inaudible from more than one foot away. The exhaust fan runs at 1200 rpm and is also quiet from one foot away. I imagine that better quality noctua fans would do a bit better.
Of your choices, I would pick the i9-14900 processor which is a 65w tdp and don't worry about trying to manipulate voltages and such.
I would have no problem using the 14900K either.
When running at less than full load it will turbo up higher.

As it happens, I am also setting up a pc for my wife to learn on.
I use the same B760 motherboard and a i3-13100 which is a 60w processor with 8 threads. It uses the stock RM1 cooler which is 47mm high and will fit in the SF5A case. It also is running the same asus strix B760 motherboard,
The case is a very restrictive lian li PC Q03
https://www.newegg.com/p/N82E16811112372
It has no cooling fans and heat is removed by convection.

I am also now running the same cpu-Z bench test.
All 4 cores of the i3-13100 are running at 85c. with no throttling.
The Rm1 cooler fan is spinning at 3000 rpm and is quiet.
supposedly, the fan is rated at 2400 rpm.
In your SF5A case it would do better.
Noctua makes excellent 92mm fans that run at high rpm, but are quiet and would make all the difference in your case.
If you used a I9, the cooler you will get is the taller RH1 cooler and
you would need to find a smaller RM1 cooler.
On your other options, not so good news:
The noctua L12s is 70mm tall with the fan and you would not want to run without the fan:
https://noctua.at/en/nh-l12s/specification

The axp120 seems to be 52mm tall:

AXP120-X67 – Thermalright

www.thermalright.com www.thermalright.com

as is the an600:
https://www.deepcool.com/company/pressroom/newsrelease/2023/17340.shtml?id=PressRoom
 
  • Like
Reactions: Regev
The AXP120 and AN600 are about 67mm with the fan tho, right? Would fit the 70mm case. So it really is possible to cool the 14900K with 40-70mm coolers without a major hit in performance?

Anyway, my two questions:

1. If I get the non-K 14900, is it possible to undervolt it and/or limit TDP in the BIOS? Is it even CPU-dependent, or motherboard-dependent? I thought K means unlocked multiplier, not unlocked TDP/voltage. I'd like to play a little bit with these, to tune it properly to such small cases.

2. Does the K version come with the beautiful, sleek RH1 cooler, or is it only the non-K version?
 
1. Limiting the voltage is dependent on the capabilities of the motherboard bios.
Z790 bios will allow such fiddling. I am uncertain about the B760 motherboards.
K means unlocked in that you can adjust the multiplier up or down, consistent with the systems cooling capabilities and the presence of a Z790 motherboard.
Also, K suffix models will have a slightly higher native boost clock(6.0 vs. 5.8) to begin with. On any motherboard, you can impact performance by simply reducing the maximum cpu usage from 100% to a lower number.
Windows settings power management has these controls.

2. K suffix processors do not come with any cooler.

You are probably overthinking this.
I suggest you pick either the the small case and one of the non K processors.
See what you learn and use that to do better on the big case if needed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Regev
Thanks. Got one 14900 and one 14700 (both non-K). I'll play with them both.

Where can I find a VRM-quality tier list of B760/Z790/B660/B690 motherboards so that I know which ITX to choose?
 
I don't know that such a tier list exists.
I would go to newegg and look at lga1700 motherboards.
You can filter for ITX chipset, ddr4/5 and so on.
Look at what rear panel components are included.
Most will only have a single 8 pin eps power connector.
I like to see a decently robust heat sink over the VRM section.
Those seeking record overclocks will not be looking at an ITX motherboard.
700 series motherboards are an evolution from the 600 series.
I would pick 700 series on general principles, figuring that any 600 issues will have been resolved.

And... please post your findings.
Feedback from actual users is more helpful than benchmarks.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Regev
Thanks, man. Appreciate it.
Will definitely update.

As for the board, I'm considering these options:

$190: GIGABYTE B760I AORUS PRO
$200: MSI MPG B760I Edge
$217: ASUS ROG Strix Z690-I
$267: GIGABYTE Z790I AORUS Ultra

The Z690 and Z790 ones have a 10+1-VRM, while the B ones have a 8+1 VRM. This makes the Asus Z690-I look like good value here compared to the B760s, but I'm not sure what you mean by "600 issues will have been resolved". Was there anything in particular ? Although, not even sure I need the 10+1 VRM for a non-K CPU.

Which one would you choose, and which DDR5 memories would you pair to it ?
 
Any new motherboard and chipset will have minor glitches.
In time, they get resolved, usually by bios updates.
Also, over time motherboard makers learn how to better refine a motherboard.
Hence the preference for the newer 700 series vs. the previous 600 series.
No doubt, any would work.

I did pick the Asus rog strix B760I which is not on your list.
It works just fine.
 
I'm expecting to dramatically lower the TDP ratings. Curious to the drop in performance in ratio of the heat generated. In one of the videos I linked to, someone got 30% lower performance (ending in a little higher than 12900K) for 70% less wattage (it ran on 90W).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Latest posts

Moderators online

Share this page

COMPANY
RESOURCES
FOLLOW
Top Bottom