Question Blue Screens/PC freezing after adding new ram to system

[Smokey-AUS]

• SPECS:
  • i5-4690k
  • GTX 970
  • 4GB (x2) Mushkin Blackline Frostbyte 1600 MHz DDR3 DIMM (Old Ram)
  • 4GB (x2) HyperX FURY 1600 MHz DDR3 CL10 DIMM (New Ram)

I recently installed 2 new ram sticks (The HyperX sticks)

Once I booted, my PC kept turning its self on and off constantly. I made sure all the ram was slotted in properly and it was, I switched the pair of sticks between channel A and B and it booted. (Maybe I did something wrong at this point? I was just moving stuff around and it seemed to work...)

I then got an American Megatrends screen that said overclocking failed. I had seen this before. The last time I just opened the BIOS, made no changes and exited out and all was fine. This time as I was going through the BIOS I noticed that my D-RAM Frequency was set to DDR3 - 2133 MHz and my RAM is 1600 MHz so I changed it and everything booted normally.

Now once or twice a day I will either get a blue screen or my whole PC will just freeze and I will need to shut it down. So far it has happened 4 times and all while playing games.

Should I have not changed my D-RAM frequency? Is it something else?

I appreciate any help!

 

[cin19]

4GB (x2) Mushkin Blackline Frostbyte 1600 MHz DDR3 DIMM (Old Ram)

4GB (x2) HyperX FURY 1600 MHz DDR3 CL10 DIMM (New Ram)

I think the RAM will cause the problem. 1) you mixed them. 2) The mushkin blackline timeing is the CL9 ( I check it online), and the hyperX is the cl10. So when you mixed them, most of the time you will get the problem.

Now you may try to remove the mushkin one, use the hyper to boot the PC. If you can boot, then go into the BIOS, memory section to set the XMP profile for the RAM. Save and exit, and shut down the PC. Install the mushkin RAM, and boot the PC. If you are lucky, you can boot the PC, otherwise you need to return the hyperX, then the kit memory, like 2X8GB, also sell the mushkin RAM if you want.

 

[Calvin7]

Memory is guaranteed in the form sold. Other combinations you decide to make have no guarantee to be compatible together. Your free to do your own compatibility testing.

Rated specifications are for memory in the form sold. The additional stress on the memory controller caused by the combination of multiple kits often causes the memory to no longer be able to operate at rated specifications. You can also try lowering clock speed, relaxing timings, raising voltages.

 

[Smokey-AUS]

If you are lucky, you can boot the PC, otherwise you need to return the hyperX, then the kit memory, like 2X8GB, also sell the mushkin RAM if you want.

I understood everything up to this point. Are you saying keep the Mushkin RAM and get more RAM that is CL9 and it should work fine? What is a kit memory?

Install the mushkin RAM, and boot the PC. If you are lucky, you can boot the PC

The Mushkin RAM is what I have had for the last 5 years, why would I not be able to boot with it now?

 

[Smokey-AUS]

Memory is guaranteed in the form sold. Other combinations you decide to make have no guarantee to be compatible together. Your free to do your own compatibility testing.

Rated specifications are for memory in the form sold. The additional stress on the memory controller caused by the combination of multiple kits often causes the memory to no longer be able to operate at rated specifications. You can also try lowering clock speed, relaxing timings, raising voltages.

I don't understand what you're talking about at all. I didn't even realise that I was mixing my memory. I thought if both were at 1600 MHz it was all the same. So should I send my new memory back? If so, what do I need to get to make it compatible with my old memory?

 

[jodo_kast2]

Different timings will do that. U could also try to relax the timings on the mushkin and mirror that of the hyper if the montherboard allows such. And i mean ALL the timings. Memtest 86+, and prime 95 should be able to confim stability, but that might take time to iron out. Also DDR3L or DDR3 ? They have different voltages.

edit: pls specify the model of the memories to confirm. maybe even the hyperx can be convinced to work outside of jedec specifications.

 

[cin19]

I mean if you want to use more RAM, buy the kit, like 2X8GB, because you mixed the two set RAM, most of the time it will cause the problem.

If you want to try to use these two set RAM, you have to try to tweak the timing, speed, voltage, etc. If you can't find the way to use the two set RAM, return the hyper, buy the new set RAM ( 2 x 8GB), sell the old Mushkin RAM if you want. Or let the Mushkin RAM set on somewhere, don't mix the RAM.

Here is more info about the RAM https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ddr-dram-myths,4155.html#p2

 

[Smokey-AUS]

Different timings will do that. U could also try to relax the timings on the mushkin and mirror that of the hyper if the montherboard allows such. And i mean ALL the timings. Memtest 86+, and prime 95 should be able to confim stability, but that might take time to iron out. Also DDR3L or DDR3 ? They have different voltages.

edit: pls specify the model of the memories to confirm. maybe even the hyperx can be convinced to work outside of jedec specifications.

Okay, I don't know what timings are and how to relax them. The model for the HyperX sticks is this I believe: HX316C10FBK2/8 I don't know if they are DDR3L or DDR3, how would I check that? The model number for the Mushkins is: 997164F

 

[Smokey-AUS]

I mean if you want to use more RAM, buy the kit, like 2X8GB, because you mixed the two set RAM, most of the time it will cause the problem.

If you want to try to use these two set RAM, you have to try to tweak the timing, speed, voltage, etc. If you can't find the way to use the two set RAM, return the hyper, buy the new set RAM ( 2 x 8GB), sell the old Mushkin RAM if you want. Or let the Mushkin RAM set on somewhere, don't mix the RAM.

Here is more info about the RAM https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ddr-dram-myths,4155.html#p2

Ah! Thanks, that was much clearer. I understand you now. How would I go about trying to tweak the timing, speed and voltage? Do you have a resource I could follow for something like that? A guide?

 

[cin19]

First, you may try to use the intel XMP for the memory. Install the lower speed RAM, which is the hyper one.
Boot into the BIOS, in the memory section, use the XMP as profile, save and exit, then shut down the PC. After that, install other set the Mushkin one. And boot the pc to see you can or can't.
1) If you can, done.

2) If you can't. Shut down the pc, remove the Mushkin one. Boot into the BIOS, memory section, manually to set the timing or voltage.
Like hyperX one, it has the 10-10-10 1.5V ( I don't know which exactly timing), and you can set the timing like: 10 (tCL )-10 ( tRCD )-10 ( tRP ) - 30 ( tRAS ) 1.5V. then save and exit, shut down the PC, reinstall the Mushkin one, then reboot the PC. If you still have the same problem, try to the 10-10-10-31, 1.55V, then boot the PC to what happens. If you still have the problem, try lower the speed to 1333Mhz, 10-10-10-30 1.5V.

But before you do it, read more about the RAM timing. And keep in mind, the manual set the timing may or may not work.
https://www.hardwaresecrets.com/understanding-ram-timings/

Or read the RAM ocing guide, you may have some ideas. https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ram-overclocking-guide,4693.html

 

[jodo_kast2]

Okay, I don't know what timings are and how to relax them. The model for the HyperX sticks is this I believe: HX316C10FBK2/8 I don't know if they are DDR3L or DDR3, how would I check that? The model number for the Mushkins is: 997164F

first of a crashcourse what timings are about and difference. Some stuff might make more sense after you read through and gave it some thought. It also goes into DDR3L and makes clear what the actual f__k Jedec is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3_SDRAM

voltages are 1.5V so that means plain DDR3 since the DDR3L variant only uses 1.35V.

https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/HX316C10FBK2_8.pdf
http://www.poweredbymushkin.com/Hom...e/item/133-ddr3-2/1100-997164f#specifications ,

lets assume these are your modules. The Mushkin is the fancy one at that. So lets switch off all XMP stuff, no custom profiles, just plain standart jedec aproved specs. Retire Mushkin memory and try to manually specify 1600Mhz with they hyperX in place. shut down and boot up again with mushkin in place. try to have the Kingston ones in the first and third slot and the mushkins in the second and forth. Boot up and check the individual timings in each bank. CPU-z can help if the bios isn t very forthcoming with these, since we dont know what motherboard you are sailing on. So i ll assume u will be able to change at least the 4 "main" timings ,since there are alot more and make sure they align. It ll involve experimenting alot untill u might find (or not , it will neither be a complete waste of time... at least you got alot of experience out of it.) a harmonic balance between them 2. changing the timings doesn t damage the memories only over-voltage does. Worst case that could happen is a CMos clear needed until you see a massage "bla bla overclock failed, defaults loaded". Good luck. Unless we have a Model and correct rev. of your mobo along we are shooting ducks swimming in an ocean. With slingshots from a Zeppelin ,a good 900 meters from sealevel.

Also @cin19 pointed at a interesting read u might want take up aswell,

Understanding RAM Timings | Hardware Secrets

www.hardwaresecrets.com

 

[Smokey-AUS]

first of a crashcourse what timings are about and difference. Some stuff might make more sense after you read through and gave it some thought. It also goes into DDR3L and makes clear what the actual f__k Jedec is.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDR3_SDRAM

voltages are 1.5V so that means plain DDR3 since the DDR3L variant only uses 1.35V.

https://www.kingston.com/dataSheets/HX316C10FBK2_8.pdf
http://www.poweredbymushkin.com/Hom...e/item/133-ddr3-2/1100-997164f#specifications ,

lets assume these are your modules. The Mushkin is the fancy one at that. So lets switch off all XMP stuff, no custom profiles, just plain standart jedec aproved specs. Retire Mushkin memory and try to manually specify 1600Mhz with they hyperX in place. shut down and boot up again with mushkin in place. try to have the Kingston ones in the first and third slot and the mushkins in the second and forth. Boot up and check the individual timings in each bank. CPU-z can help if the bios isn t very forthcoming with these, since we dont know what motherboard you are sailing on. So i ll assume u will be able to change at least the 4 "main" timings ,since there are alot more and make sure they align. It ll involve experimenting alot untill u might find (or not , it will neither be a complete waste of time... at least you got alot of experience out of it.) a harmonic balance between them 2. changing the timings doesn t damage the memories only over-voltage does. Worst case that could happen is a CMos clear needed until you see a massage "bla bla overclock failed, defaults loaded". Good luck. Unless we have a Model and correct rev. of your mobo along we are shooting ducks swimming in an ocean. With slingshots from a Zeppelin ,a good 900 meters from sealevel.

Also @cin19 pointed at a interesting read u might want take up aswell,

Understanding RAM Timings | Hardware Secrets

www.hardwaresecrets.com

Thanks for this. I've spoken to some mates and most have said don't go through the hassle. I should just return the HyperX sticks, sell the Mushkins and get a 16 GB kit. Which I'm happy to do, I just want the easiest and fastest solution. Do you agree? Will doing that just solve this issue?

 

[jodo_kast2]

Thanks for this. I've spoken to some mates and most have said don't go through the hassle. I should just return the HyperX sticks, sell the Mushkins and get a 16 GB kit. Which I'm happy to do, I just want the easiest and fastest solution. Do you agree? Will doing that just solve this issue?

defo, should solve the issue in itself since you are no longer mixing modules , if that was the issue in the first place. Usually the warranty doesn t cover incompatibility issues tho. But if per chance one of them turns out defective ,they do get changed. Not sure how policies are in your region tho so , if you can ... go for it. Can't hurt to get your Motherboards bios up to date beforehand the new sticks arrive just in case. And some manufactors specify wich memory modules have been tested and are confirmed working, make sure the sticks you get are one of them to avoid further hassle.

 

[Smokey-AUS]

defo, should solve the issue in itself since you are no longer mixing modules , if that was the issue in the first place. Usually the warranty doesn t cover incompatibility issues tho. But if per chance one of them turns out defective ,they do get changed. Not sure how policies are in your region tho so , if you can ... go for it. Can't hurt to get your Motherboards bios up to date beforehand the new sticks arrive just in case. And some manufactors specify wich memory modules have been tested and are confirmed working, make sure the sticks you get are one of them to avoid further hassle.

Thanks! The HyperXs were from Amazon and they have really straight forward customer service so I would be surprised if they didn't take them back. If they don't, I can just go to a hand in shop with both pairs and get a 16GB kit no problem.

Well that's most likely the end of this thread! Thanks for the help everyone <3

 

[Smokey-AUS]

We decided at the end of this thread that I should just get a 16 GB kit and not go through the hassle of trying to get my mixed ram to work. I'm still going to do that but it's going to take a couple weeks.

So for the mean time I wanted to just go back to my 8GB/2 Mushkin sticks because they shouldn't be crashing or causing blue screens as I've used them for the past 5 years with no problems.

However, they are still causing blue screens. I went into the BIOS and changed my profile to XMP which is the default I believe and it changed my DRAM frequency back to 2133 MHz. So, I think everything is back to what it has been for the last 5 years but I'm still getting blue screens at least once a day. What do you guys think is going on here?

EDIT: Few hours later:

It's now happening almost constantly when I try to play a game. I have no idea whats going on. I had a look in the BIOS, my DRAM Freq. is at 2133 MHz but my sticks run at 1600 MHz... so that seems wrong to me to set them to 2133 but that's just what was set by default. The voltage kept jumping from 1.5 V to 1.6 V so I guess it's set at 1.5 V (I don't really know)

Disclaimer: Please use layman's terms in replies as I have no idea what I'm doing

I could really use some help!

Also, RIP Kobe

 

[Smokey-AUS]

I ran this command in CMD and found this:

C:\WINDOWS\system32>wmic MEMORYCHIP get BankLabel, Capacity, DeviceLocator, MemoryType, TypeDetail, Speed

BankLabel Capacity DeviceLocator MemoryType Speed TypeDetail
BANK 1 4294967296 DIMM_A2 24 2133 128
BANK 3 4294967296 DIMM_B2 24 2133 128

2 things,

According to this my speed is 2133 MHz, I don't know if this is reading what has been set in BIOS or what the RAM should run at. I have it set at 1600 MHz right now so it has to be showing what the RAM should be running at. This confuses me as on the physically RAM it says 1600 MHz but here it says 2133...

Also, it says BANK 1 and BANK 3. Do I have them in the right slots? Does that make a difference?

+ Update on the voltage, it's 1.6V and set at 1.6V

I'm learning a lot about ram here! But not really finding any results

 

[cin19]

Sorry, just read the conversations.

And I checked back the RAM specifications. The hyper is the lower speed one, sorry again.

The Mushkin is the 2133mhz with 10-12-12-28, the HyperX is 1600mhz with 10-10-10.
https://www.newegg.com/mushkin-enhanced-8gb-240-pin-ddr3-udimm/p/N82E16820226608

https://www.newegg.com/hyperx-8gb-240-pin-ddr3-sdram/p/N82E16820104446

So you should use the HyperX to boot into the BIOS, first to set the xmp for the RAM, save and exit, shut down the PC. Then add these Mushkin, boot the pc to see what happens.
If you can boot up the PC, you are fine.
If you still have the problem, shut down the PC, remove the Mushkin RAM, use the HyperX to boot into the BIOS, set the timing 1600mhz with 10-10-10-30 1,5V, boot the PC again. If you can use the PC. Shut down it, add the Mushkin RAM again. reboot the PC again to see what happens.

And you may or may not boot it up. If you can't, I know it is not fun, but you have to remove the RAM again, set the timing to 1600mhz with 10-10-10-31, 1.55V. Try again, if you still have problem, try 1600mhz 11-11-11-33, 1.5v, or 1600mhz with 11-11-11-33 1.55v, etc. Or even lower the speed to 1333mhz with 10-10-10-30, 1.5V.

 

[Smokey-AUS]

Sorry, just read the conversations.

And I checked back the RAM specifications. The hyper is the lower speed one, sorry again.

The Mushkin is the 2133mhz with 10-12-12-28, the HyperX is 1600mhz with 10-10-10.
https://www.newegg.com/mushkin-enhanced-8gb-240-pin-ddr3-udimm/p/N82E16820226608

https://www.newegg.com/hyperx-8gb-240-pin-ddr3-sdram/p/N82E16820104446

So you should use the HyperX to boot into the BIOS, first to set the xmp for the RAM, save and exit, shut down the PC. Then add these Mushkin, boot the pc to see what happens.
If you can boot up the PC, you are fine.
If you still have the problem, shut down the PC, remove the Mushkin RAM, use the HyperX to boot into the BIOS, set the timing 1600mhz with 10-10-10-30 1,5V, boot the PC again. If you can use the PC. Shut down it, add the Mushkin RAM again. reboot the PC again to see what happens.

And you may or may not boot it up. If you can't, I know it is not fun, but you have to remove the RAM again, set the timing to 1600mhz with 10-10-10-31, 1.55V. Try again, if you still have problem, try 1600mhz 11-11-11-33, 1.5v, or 1600mhz with 11-11-11-33 1.55v, etc. Or even lower the speed to 1333mhz with 10-10-10-30, 1.5V.

Yesterday I updated my BIOS, I haven't done that since 2015. I set the profile to XMP and everything on auto with the Mushkins and didn't crash once for about 5 hours of gaming. If it continues working I'm just going to touch nothing until I have my 16 GB kit If the problem comes back I'll give this a go.

Thanks anyway, I'm just happy that updating the BIOS has fixed the issue, hopefully!

I'll keep everyone posted but, anyone reading this in the future that's having the same issue. Try updating your BIOS.