Question Building a PC Help

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padmjfp

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Currently in the process of figuring out my build and I already have some parts from an old build. I do not game, and I want to spend the least amount of money as possible. I built a PC a while ago with the same hardware except CPU, RAM, MB (I no longer have this PC so I am going off my memory).

The apps I would be running are: zoom, slack, multiple msft apps, visualization tools, and chrome

Previous parts before I returned CPU, MB, RAM:
Current Concerns:
  • High Temps , with the 12900k build, my CPU and GPU temps were consistently over 80C during low-normal work loads
    • My gpu is notorious for getting hot
    • I cranked all my case fans to circulate air, but temps still remained high
  • Bottleneck
    • GPU bottle necking the rest of the hardware, but i dont think it matters in my case since I dont care about high resolution and high frame rates, 720p @ 60htz is fine for me
    • PSU not high enough, but my list says I should be fine especially because I there is still 100W headroom
  • Intel CPU: from what I can tell, this isnt a huge issue since I dont plan on OC and warranty is extended to 5 years (which i will probably replace by then)
  • GPU issues: only need GPU to use 4+ monitors because without it, the 34" curved monitor would use ALOT of ram and push me close to 32GB ram use vs under 20GB without 34" ultrawide
    • On my old setup, after I got the GPU (bought used for a steal, and looked in great condition) 1 of 2 things would happen
      • Install GPU Driver: caused resolution issues on curved monitor, and spent hours trying to debug the issue, and nothing worked, BUT all my monitors would work(34" curved just had resolution issues)
      • Not Install driver: 34" curved had proper resolution, but 1-2 of my other monitors would not even connect
        • I changed up the 24" screens to use discrete graphics, but still caused issues
        • Changed out cables, nothing
What I need to buy: I am pretty set on this because I fortunately live near a Microcenter, and the CPU price/performance on this bundle is noticeably better than AMDs in the same range (likely because those AMD bundles are gears towards gamers).
What I have:
I dont know if I should be worried about the CPU/GPU temps being over 80C under normal-low workloads. But I think my resolution is either 1 or a combination of the following. I want minimize my money spent on the solution.
  • PSU replacement: I'm only considering this, because for some reason, after using 12900k build for 3 weeks it suddenly started went slow (Hardware utilization rates were not even half) All the wattage calculators say the setup would top out at 550W so maybe not the issue
  • GPU replacement: I am ok with getting a used one, but would need help here, because I do not know anything about GPUs since I was using discrete graphics on 4 x 24"
    • Only bought one once I bought a 34" curved - this was a few weeks into having the 12900k build.
    • would ideally want to run 4 monitors on it, 2 of which are 34", if not, I can run the 24" ones on discrete since they barely use CPU & RAM
  • Case replacement: Im guessing the glass front panel isnt ideal for intake fans and may have a high impact on temps (i dont know to be honest)
  • CPU Cooler replacement: would only consider Thermalright AIO because all the other brands are way too expensive (would not want to spend more than $70)
PC Part list for easy reference
 
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Lutfij

Lutfij

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IMHO, I wouldn't invest in anything Intel for the next couple of generations after GamersNexus mentioned that the issue that's now documented on the www was well known by Intel but decided to keep hush hush about it.

You're also not doing yourself a favor by being in the same platform that was known to have bugs/issues with their motherboard BIOS, power limits and their processor fab dept.

The apps I would be running are: zoom, slack, multiple msft apps, visualization tools, and chrome
You'd be easily able to work with said apps on AMD as well.

I dont know if I should be worried about the CPU/GPU temps being over 80C under normal-low workloads. But I think my resolution is either 1 or a combination of the following. I want minimize my money spent on the solution.
I see that this is your case;
https://www.thermaltake.com/view-200-tg-snow-argb-mid-tower-chassis.html
if so, take the front fascia off and see if your temps drop. Following that see if a BIOS update is pending on your motherboard.

Yes I'm trying to salvage your build instead of you going out to spend more money to net the same performance/issue.
 
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padmjfp

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Lutfij said:
IMHO, I wouldn't invest in anything Intel for the next couple of generations after GamersNexus mentioned that the issue that's now documented on the www was well known by Intel but decided to keep hush hush about it.

You're also not doing yourself a favor by being in the same platform that was known to have bugs/issues with their motherboard BIOS, power limits and their processor fab dept.

The apps I would be running are: zoom, slack, multiple msft apps, visualization tools, and chrome
You'd be easily able to work with said apps on AMD as well.

I dont know if I should be worried about the CPU/GPU temps being over 80C under normal-low workloads. But I think my resolution is either 1 or a combination of the following. I want minimize my money spent on the solution.
I see that this is your case;
https://www.thermaltake.com/view-200-tg-snow-argb-mid-tower-chassis.html
if so, take the front fascia off and see if your temps drop. Following that see if a BIOS update is pending on your motherboard.

Yes I'm trying to salvage your build instead of you going out to spend more money to net the same performance/issue.
Click to expand...
Ah I see, I think you’re saying even though there’s been a patch that seems decent, and extended warranty, who knows what other issues there will be between now and 5 years (when I project I will replace my pc).

Basically a lot has happened and I don’t have a CPU or MB right now, still have DDR5 32gb sticks. I just figured any other bundle out there, getting the microcenter bundle just makes sense, because I can just sell one of my ram kits.

Mixrocenter bundles: I wanted to spend less than $400 for MB, ram, CPU, but the specs on the 14700k bundle seemed to justify the extra $80 vs 12900k bundle. Do you have any recommendations from the microcenter bundles? Or any cpu/mb combo in 300-350 range (can be outside micrometer)

Edit:
Also, by taking the front glass off, would I need to worry about dust getting into the system and negatively affecting the lifespan of the hardware?

Though I want to minimize my cost, but I don’t want to do it at the expense of the overall health/longevity of the system. So if I need to dole
Out an extra 60-70$ to not heavily cut corners at the expense of the system, that is ok with me
 
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geofelt

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Price/performance is comparable between intel/amd.
If you are familiar with Intel, I would stick with that.

Changing to amd makes you need to get ram compatibility right.
AMD depends on fast ram for performance.

The key for current gen intel is to update your motherboard bios to currency.
That sets the default to normal voltages and intel standards.

Your parts list is reasonable.

I would buy a better quality psu, one with a 7 or 10 year warranty.
And, one in the 750-850w range.
It will only use the power depended of it, regardless of the max capability.
It will loaf in the most efficient middle third of it's range.

Your case is a very good one for air cooling and your selected cooler is reasonable.
The bios update will keep voltages under control.
It is excessive voltages that cause damage and generate heat.

Do you know that aio coolers do not last forever?
In time, the mechanical pump fails or gets clogged.
Or, air intrudes through the tubes and the unit must be replaced.
Think 5 years.
And, 280 sized aio units have about the same cooling potential as the cooler you selected.
 
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padmjfp

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padmjfp

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logainofhades said:
Just take the front glass long enough to test if the thermals improve. I would consider a different case, with a mesh front, for better airflow. That GPU doesn't have much in the way of heatsink, so expect higher temps from it regardless.
Click to expand...
Good idea, this may be hard to answer, but do you think be better to 1. get a mesh case, or 2. get one of these thermalright AIOs?

I saw that my current cooler has pretty good performance, I just dont know if AIOs perform better in crammed builds, because my case is basically as small as it gets for atx. Also, the only option for the AIO would be in the front, where the glass is.
 
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padmjfp

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geofelt said:
Price/performance is comparable between intel/amd.
If you are familiar with Intel, I would stick with that.

Changing to amd makes you need to get ram compatibility right.
AMD depends on fast ram for performance.

The key for current gen intel is to update your motherboard bios to currency.
That sets the default to normal voltages and intel standards.

Your parts list is reasonable.

I would buy a better quality psu, one with a 7 or 10 year warranty.
And, one in the 750-850w range.
It will only use the power depended of it, regardless of the max capability.
It will loaf in the most efficient middle third of it's range.

Your case is a very good one for air cooling and your selected cooler is reasonable.
The bios update will keep voltages under control.
It is excessive voltages that cause damage and generate heat.

Do you know that aio coolers do not last forever?
In time, the mechanical pump fails or gets clogged.
Or, air intrudes through the tubes and the unit must be replaced.
Think 5 years.
And, 280 sized aio units have about the same cooling potential as the cooler you selected.
Click to expand...
Is the main difference when selecting ram, is to see if they support XMP and Expo? Because I still have brand new sticks cause I had to RMA my other ones, but I just saw on the case it only mentioned XMP and not Expo.

For the PSU upgrade, what would the reason for the upgrade be? Because I thought the bronze, gold, plat ratings only dealt with how efficiently converts power from the wall to the system. Also because I thought the wattage calcs were based on max power needed, I dont plan on getting any resource demanding gpu in the future.

The case has glass front panel though, are you saying glass front panel cases are good for air coolers? And yeah, I understand that about AIOs, 5 years is plenty for me, and would only consider getting 360mm because I think my temps are pretty high under light/normal loads
 
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Lucky_SLS

Lucky_SLS

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padmjfp said:
Thank you, the 7900x looks like a pretty solid pick, but the mother board seems to have complete hit or miss reviews. Do you know if the MB issues is because its AM5, and that its just a newer platform?
Click to expand...

If the bad reviews are about ram compatibility, AM5 has come a long way. Just update the BIOS to the latest release and you should be able to run the ram at 6000 CL32 speed.

I would not trust Deepcool in the US. They are restricted by the US gov to sell its products there.

Try this one instead: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/zkWJ7P/thermalright-phantom-spirit-6617-cfm-cpu-cooler-ps120
 
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geofelt

geofelt

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padmjfp said:
Good idea, this may be hard to answer, but do you think be better to 1. get a mesh case, or 2. get one of these thermalright AIOs?

I saw that my current cooler has pretty good performance, I just dont know if AIOs perform better in crammed builds, because my case is basically as small as it gets for atx. Also, the only option for the AIO would be in the front, where the glass is.
Click to expand...
aio cooling is still air cooling.
The only difference is where the heat exchange takes place.
Look at the comparable radiator sizes; most of the time a twin tower air cooler will perform similar to a two fan aio.
And, if you mount the radiator in front, the heated air will be used to cool the graphics card.

On ram, ram faster than stock will need to be overclocked to reach the advertised performance.
This is normal.
XMP is an intel term, EXPO is the amd equivalent.
In a supported motherboard invoking either will retrieve the optimum specs to use.
(specs of speed, timings and voltage)
Otherwise, you have to specify the specs yourself.
High end processors have the potential to run faster when overclocked, but the actual difference is not that great. Most gamers use the turbo mechanism which boosts a couple of cores past what an all core overclock could do.

You might find this article interesting:
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/intel-core-13900k-cooling-tested
 
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logainofhades

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padmjfp

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Lucky_SLS said:
If the bad reviews are about ram compatibility, AM5 has come a long way. Just update the BIOS to the latest release and you should be able to run the ram at 6000 CL32 speed.

I would not trust Deepcool in the US. They are restricted by the US gov to sell its products there.

Try this one instead: https://pcpartpicker.com/product/zkWJ7P/thermalright-phantom-spirit-6617-cfm-cpu-cooler-ps120
Click to expand...
Ah I see, its been some time, and was wondering if you still feel the same way about the intel chips: im guessing yes, but wanted to double check. I looked through news and havent really seen any issues since the patch from intel.

Im currently considering this AMD bundle and this intel bundle and trying to figure out if the $50 is worth it based on nano benchmarks. The AMD bundle seems to be low rated because the MB is not plug and play

Im also trying to figure out the following things and wanted to see if you could help.
  • The only things i look for in a MB is what speeds it can reach with XMP/EXPO: i dont want to even consider manually OCing the system
    • The number display outputs, which i dont think really matters since I have a gpu and dont need to worry about that
    • Would an AMD chip work better with my AMD GPU? I kept having issues with the curved 34" and worried i might run into issues similar to the ones i had in the past
    • I genuinely cant tell if one MB is better between the two bundles, im assuming theyre some what basic MBs and the variance is small
  • From what I can tell I dont think i NEED multi threading that much, at least not enough to heavily favor intel
Are you also saying not to use my current Deepcool cooler? because I still have that from the previous build.
 
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padmjfp

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geofelt said:
aio cooling is still air cooling.
The only difference is where the heat exchange takes place.
Look at the comparable radiator sizes; most of the time a twin tower air cooler will perform similar to a two fan aio.
And, if you mount the radiator in front, the heated air will be used to cool the graphics card.

On ram, ram faster than stock will need to be overclocked to reach the advertised performance.
This is normal.
XMP is an intel term, EXPO is the amd equivalent.
In a supported motherboard invoking either will retrieve the optimum specs to use.
(specs of speed, timings and voltage)
Otherwise, you have to specify the specs yourself.
High end processors have the potential to run faster when overclocked, but the actual difference is not that great. Most gamers use the turbo mechanism which boosts a couple of cores past what an all core overclock could do.

You might find this article interesting:
https://www.tomshardware.com/features/intel-core-13900k-cooling-tested
Click to expand...
I would only consider a 3 fan AIO, and the article shows thermalright as a brand is decent, but did not test 3 fan thermalright aio. But the other issue is if i end up getting an AIO, the temp differences might be marginal, since the GPU is the hottest component, and by blowing hot/warm air into it is kind of useless right?

Honestly, i dont want to deal with or risk overclocking thats not ready out the box like XMP and EXPO (not sure if this is even OC).
 
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Lucky_SLS

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The mobo has a basic 8 phase VRM in the AMD bundle. The Intel one has 50A caps in the VRMs (Intel draws more power as well). Both are pretty basic, Yes.

The Intel patch is not a robust one

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqyaiTUaH9A


If you already have the cooler, it is fine.

In both systems, you can enable XMP ram profiles and choose PBO 2 for AMD or Intel performance mode (150W) in the Z790. I would suggest AMD, maybe Intel bartlett lake when it comes out next year.

There is no known advantage of AMD CPU/mobo + AMD GPU combo. Go with the one you want.
 
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padmjfp

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Lucky_SLS said:
The mobo has a basic 8 phase VRM in the AMD bundle. The Intel one has 50A caps in the VRMs (Intel draws more power as well). Both are pretty basic, Yes.

The Intel patch is not a robust one

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqyaiTUaH9A


If you already have the cooler, it is fine.

In both systems, you can enable XMP ram profiles and choose PBO 2 for AMD or Intel performance mode (150W) in the Z790. I would suggest AMD, maybe Intel bartlett lake when it comes out next year.

There is no known advantage of AMD CPU/mobo + AMD GPU combo. Go with the one you want.
Click to expand...
Appreciate it, I ended up going with the 7900x even though it was marginally better in performance vs 7700x. GPU temps stay at 90c (but looks normal for the gpu I have) and CPU temps are consistently around 60C which seems to be fine. I tried with taking front panel off, and then with panel on, The panel made marginal diff in temps, so I thought it would be better to keep the pc covered trading off for slightly higher temps

Thanks for the help.
 
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