Can my computer still play Skyrim?

[Kenny De]

Icon Dedicated Video RAM 1 GB 768 MB

It says it requires 1 gb I only have 768mb and this is a brand new computer we got a few months ago this is ridiculous.

Video Card
Video Card
Minimum: DirectX 9.0c compliant video card with 512 MB of RAM - NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT & ATI Radeon X1800.
You Have: AMD Radeon HD 7660D



Video CardClick here for the latest Video Card drivers.


Features: Minimum attributes of your Video Card

Required

You Have

Icon Pixel Shader version 3.0 5.0
Icon Vertex Shader version 3.0 5.0
Icon Dedicated Video RAM 512 MB 768 MB



Sound Card
Sound Card
Minimum: Yes
You Have: IDT High Definition Audio CODEC



Sound CardClick here for the latest Sound Card drivers.



Free Disk Space
Free Disk Space
Minimum: 6 GB
You Have: 1.8 TB

CPU
CPU
Recommended: Quad-core Intel or AMD CPU
You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics



CPUClick here for the latest CPU drivers.



CPU Speed
CPU Speed
Recommended: Info
You Have: 3.4 GHz






RAM
RAM
Recommended: 4 GB
You Have: 12 GB






OS
OS
Recommended: Windows 7/Vista/XP PC (32 or 64 bit)
You Have: Microsoft Windows 8 (build 9200), 64-bit


Unfortunately your operating system was not available when this product was released, so it is not OFFICIALLY supported. Please review the publisher's website for more information.

WindowsClick here for the latest Windows drivers.



Video Card
Video Card
Recommended: DirectX 9.0c compatible NVIDIA or AMD ATI video card with 1 GB of RAM (NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260 or higher; ATI Radeon HD 4890 or higher)
You Have: AMD Radeon HD 7660D



Video CardClick here for the latest Video Card drivers.


Features: Recommended attributes of your Video Card

Required

You Have

Icon Pixel Shader version 3.0 5.0
Icon Vertex Shader version 3.0 5.0
Icon Dedicated Video RAM 1 GB 768 MB



Sound Card
Sound Card
Recommended: Yes
You Have: IDT High Definition Audio CODEC



Sound CardClick here for the latest Sound Card drivers.



Free Disk Space
Free Disk Space
Recommended: 6 GB
You Have: 1.8 TB


MinimumMinimum
RecommendedRecommended

CPU
CPU
Minimum: Info
You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics



CPUClick here for the latest CPU drivers.



CPU Speed
CPU Speed
Minimum: Dual Core 2.0 GHz or equivalent processor
You Have: 3.4 GHz






RAM
RAM
Minimum: 2 GB
You Have: 12 GB






OS
OS
Minimum: Windows 7/Vista/XP PC (32 or 64 bit)
You Have: Microsoft Windows 8 (build 9200), 64-bit


Unfortunately your operating system was not available when this product was released, so it is not OFFICIALLY supported. Please review the publisher's website for more information.

WindowsClick here for the latest Windows drivers.




This came from securityrequirementslab site.

Please help me figure out how to get this too work this is a waste of my time and money if not.

 

[13thmonkey]

you seem to be using the built in graphics from your processor. have you tried playing skyrim? you may be able to assign more ram to your built in gpu in bios?

 

[Kenny De]

you seem to be using the built in graphics from your processor. have you tried playing skyrim? you may be able to assign more ram to your built in gpu in bios?

I have absolutely no idea what that means im afraid lol Could you please elaborate further on that? Ive heard of the BIOS thing but I don't know what that is. I have not yet tried to play though Im kinda afraid too now considering I apparently do not have enough to play it to begin with. Sighs.

 

[Owlbie]

Yes, you should be able to play it medium-high , with mods you will have to lower graphics and no massive resolutions

 

[Tom Tancredi]

NO it can not play SKYRIM nor other GAMES. A APU (A10) is used for GENERAL COMPUTER USE not gaming. This computer works great for grandma to check email, look at the facebook pics etc. The CPU with built in GPU isn't made nor compatible for gaming. If you plan to play games you need to spend at least $700 or more on a PC. It would be best (based on you reaction) to instead return the PC and take the store credit and get a console instead. Much simplier, less headaches, and you don't really have to maintain it (check drivers updated, match proper GPU to PSU, update windows, run antivirus and malwware scans, opent he case to clear out dust, etc. etc. etc.) like a PC requires constant maintence.

 

[13thmonkey]

NO it can not play SKYRIM nor other GAMES. A APU (A10) is used for GENERAL COMPUTER USE not gaming. This computer works great for grandma to check email, look at the facebook pics etc. The CPU with built in GPU isn't made nor compatible for gaming. If you plan to play games you need to spend at least $700 or more on a PC. It would be best (based on you reaction) to instead return the PC and take the store credit and get a console instead. Much simplier, less headaches, and you don't really have to maintain it (check drivers updated, match proper GPU to PSU, update windows, run antivirus and malwware scans, opent he case to clear out dust, etc. etc. etc.) like a PC requires constant maintence.

Tom STFU, the A10's have a mid class GPU built in, it will be enough to play most games at medium at medium resolutions.
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/47257-amd-a10-5700/?page=7
it'll run.

OP just try running it, it'll run slow if it can't cope, you won't break it.

 

[Kenny De]

NO it can not play SKYRIM nor other GAMES. A APU (A10) is used for GENERAL COMPUTER USE not gaming. This computer works great for grandma to check email, look at the facebook pics etc. The CPU with built in GPU isn't made nor compatible for gaming. If you plan to play games you need to spend at least $700 or more on a PC. It would be best (based on you reaction) to instead return the PC and take the store credit and get a console instead. Much simplier, less headaches, and you don't really have to maintain it (check drivers updated, match proper GPU to PSU, update windows, run antivirus and malwware scans, opent he case to clear out dust, etc. etc. etc.) like a PC requires constant maintence.

Tom STFU, the A10's have a mid class GPU built in, it will be enough to play most games at medium at medium resolutions.
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/47257-amd-a10-5700/?page=7
it'll run.

OP just try running it, it'll run slow if it can't cope, you won't break it.

Ty for the helpful responses . I was just curious is it possible to upgrade the graphics card in the future if I would like too do so? I was just curious ty all for the responses much appreciated. Joyous holidays to you all.

 

[13thmonkey]

easy enough to upgrade, but ask us first, 2-3 things to consider when the time comes.

 

[jay2577]

What is the make/model of your computer?
If you bought a pre built computer it might be able to be upgraded.
If you have a power supply unit powerful enough and a spare PCI-Express x16 slot in your motherboard you should be able to add a separate graphics card instead of using the APU's built in graphics. It would give you a better gaming experience.
Please ignore any rude comments as most people on these forums will try and help you the best they can

 

[Tom Tancredi]

NO it can not play SKYRIM nor other GAMES. A APU (A10) is used for GENERAL COMPUTER USE not gaming. This computer works great for grandma to check email, look at the facebook pics etc. The CPU with built in GPU isn't made nor compatible for gaming. If you plan to play games you need to spend at least $700 or more on a PC. It would be best (based on you reaction) to instead return the PC and take the store credit and get a console instead. Much simplier, less headaches, and you don't really have to maintain it (check drivers updated, match proper GPU to PSU, update windows, run antivirus and malwware scans, opent he case to clear out dust, etc. etc. etc.) like a PC requires constant maintence.

Tom STFU, the A10's have a mid class GPU built in, it will be enough to play most games at medium at medium resolutions.
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/47257-amd-a10-5700/?page=7
it'll run.

OP just try running it, it'll run slow if it can't cope, you won't break it.

First off, stop with the fanboy crap. Second those numbers are WAY off, here is Tom's Hardware OWN scores
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/a10-6700-a10-6800k-richland-review,3528-6.html which shows alot different (and I would say more reliable) scores.

I done the research on the A10s, the APUs started out as proving the AMD buy out of ATI to make a single chip was possible http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Accelerated_Processing_Unit . They were first introduced to be low power consumption (damn nice job in that) for low end 'general computing' devices, like tablets and netbooks. The latest iteration is to make 'low cost' PC for the 'general market' on par with the i3-Clarksdale / Sandy Bridge with Integrated Graphics performance level (your A8 and A10s) alternative. I would never recommend an old i3Core for anyone 'gaming', whether with IG or addon card, because the graphics doesn't load the 'game' directly from the drive bypassing the CPU.

Basic 101: Data Code is stored (HDD) to be read (RAM) in chunks of data to be processed (CPU) to decide what device (Sounds, GPU, NIC) needs to perform to use that code. All that is BEFORE the GPU is involved, so you can have a R9 / Titan on this computer still going to give LOW graphics to 'can't be played' because the CPU bottlenecks it and can't process the data fast enough for the GPU to render with it.

ANY benchmarks shows the same things: i3/rest of AMD CPUs for general (grandma doing email) usage, i5/AMD 8xxx for moderate gaming level, i7 for performance gaming (and best suited for R9/Titan cards so as not to bottleneck the GPU). That is the facts, look for yourself.

 

[rwpritchett]

Tom, I'm afraid 13thmonkey is correct. The A10-5700 APU can indeed play Skyrim with lowered settings. The A10-5800k, which has the same 7660D graphics, can get 30+ FPS with medium settings at 1920x1080:

Now, the 5800K is a few hundred MHz faster than the 5700, but that's not going to drop the frame rate much. Plus FXAA and AF can be reduced to smooth it out even more if needed.

Also, your claim that an A10-5700 paired with a mid to high-end GPU will "give LOW graphics to 'can't be played' because the CPU bottlenecks" is pure FUD.

Even if the CPU is the bottleneck, as long as you're getting good frame rates that doesn't matter. For example, if an i7-4770k and a R9 gives you 140 fps in Skyrim but the A10-5700 and a R9 only gives you 80 fps, who cares? It will still be smooth.

 

[Kenny De]

NO it can not play SKYRIM nor other GAMES. A APU (A10) is used for GENERAL COMPUTER USE not gaming. This computer works great for grandma to check email, look at the facebook pics etc. The CPU with built in GPU isn't made nor compatible for gaming. If you plan to play games you need to spend at least $700 or more on a PC. It would be best (based on you reaction) to instead return the PC and take the store credit and get a console instead. Much simplier, less headaches, and you don't really have to maintain it (check drivers updated, match proper GPU to PSU, update windows, run antivirus and malwware scans, opent he case to clear out dust, etc. etc. etc.) like a PC requires constant maintence.

Tom STFU, the A10's have a mid class GPU built in, it will be enough to play most games at medium at medium resolutions.
http://hexus.net/tech/reviews/cpu/47257-amd-a10-5700/?page=7
it'll run.

OP just try running it, it'll run slow if it can't cope, you won't break it.

First off, stop with the fanboy crap. Second those numbers are WAY off, here is Tom's Hardware OWN scores
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/a10-6700-a10-6800k-richland-review,3528-6.html which shows alot different (and I would say more reliable) scores.

I done the research on the A10s, the APUs started out as proving the AMD buy out of ATI to make a single chip was possible http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AMD_Accelerated_Processing_Unit . They were first introduced to be low power consumption (damn nice job in that) for low end 'general computing' devices, like tablets and netbooks. The latest iteration is to make 'low cost' PC for the 'general market' on par with the i3-Clarksdale / Sandy Bridge with Integrated Graphics performance level (your A8 and A10s) alternative. I would never recommend an old i3Core for anyone 'gaming', whether with IG or addon card, because the graphics doesn't load the 'game' directly from the drive bypassing the CPU.

Basic 101: Data Code is stored (HDD) to be read (RAM) in chunks of data to be processed (CPU) to decide what device (Sounds, GPU, NIC) needs to perform to use that code. All that is BEFORE the GPU is involved, so you can have a R9 / Titan on this computer still going to give LOW graphics to 'can't be played' because the CPU bottlenecks it and can't process the data fast enough for the GPU to render with it.

ANY benchmarks shows the same things: i3/rest of AMD CPUs for general (grandma doing email) usage, i5/AMD 8xxx for moderate gaming level, i7 for performance gaming (and best suited for R9/Titan cards so as not to bottleneck the GPU). That is the facts, look for yourself.

Look Im gonna be completely honest with you whilst I appreciate the advice and information this actually screws me over ultimately in the end.

Suffice it to say when I had a laptop it couldn't play hardly anything not even second life.

In 2009 I got a new computer and it played Second Life perfectly and a few random pc games it couldn't play much either similar to the laptops disadvantages.

I finally got that computer replaced with one that was sold at our local Sams Clubs on a labors day sale weekend and it has been very fast and efficient and its also Windows 8.

A friend of mine ive known since last year has been in the computer business for years and is really good at what he does.

Hes fixed both my and my mas computer numerous times as well as helped make them better.

I asked him about the graphics card and he told me specifically that it should be able to play most games that I was set pretty much.

So now I am left wondering what am I to do about this now?

We are not rich we can not afford another computer that is not gonna happen.

I do not understand why consoles seem to be so much easier when it comes to gaming compared to PC.

The moment you think oh cool I can finally play this game or that game you run into a wall over and over again.Sighs.

I thank everyone here for their help and I genuinely and sincerely mean that but this once again screws me like it has about 3 times already back to back.

I am beginning to really wonder if computers are even worth it anymore the fact that all these games nowadays require so much in order to even play them is realistically not fair .

I was told this could play GTA 4 really well but now im like nah that aint happening either apparently.

I have about 22 pc games up in my closet I have yet to play (except a few)cant find the receipt so I cant take them back and now Im left in the lurch. Just to name a few Dead Island Skyrim Oblivion Game of the Year Duke Nukem Forever Saints Row 2 and the third etc...

I have no idea what to do now ive actually looked this year and Ive seen just how expensive graphics cards are and its really once again not fair.

I shouldn't have to upgrade a BRAND NEW COMPUTER in order to play pc games that is ridiculous and quite frankly pathetic.

Oh well ty all for the info nonetheless.

PCS can't EVER be easy sighs.

 

[Kenny De]

These answers are so confusing lol

 

[Kenny De]

Hmm okay now im confused I just checked my device driver and it said this was my actual graphics card?

AMD Radeon HD 7660D so where does this come into play?

You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics What? Smh.

 

[Tom Tancredi]

....I do not understand why consoles seem to be so much easier when it comes to gaming compared to PC....
I shouldn't have to upgrade a BRAND NEW COMPUTER in order to play pc games that is ridiculous and quite frankly pathetic.

Consoles are CLOSED systems, meaning you can only do one thing with them, play games. So they are fine tuned and only for that function, like a high end sports car, you really aren't worried about gas mileage or how many groceries it can fit in the trunk, you care how fast and how quick it can get to fast, so it is all tuned up for that.

PCs are OPEN system, you can swap parts, use them to do any thing you the end user choose, and ultimately you the end user are responsible for managing. Car analogy again; you buy a Honda Civic because it can fit groceries in the back and you get great gas milage, but you can't offroad in it. What can you do? Well you get tires, suspession, lift kits, and so on, and mod the crap out of it till it meets your needs. This is why consoles are so much easier.

Keeping on this track, say we buy that Honda (not knowing anything about cars, like you don't know anything about computers) and then we wonder why we can't race at the race track. Why is it so slow, why does it take so long to 'get up to speed' like those other cars. Or why aren't you even allowed to race at all, you have four wheels and a steering wheel, you put in gas like those sports cars do, what is the difference?

Take that I just said and replace all the car stuff with computer stuff, why do you need on a 'BRAND NEW COMPUTER' to upgrade to play the games you want, You have the same thing as those other computer? You have a keyboard and Windows? You have Internet like those other computers, what is the difference? Same REASON, you bought something that is one level of use, and instead wish to apply it in a way it wasn't specifically IN THE BOX YOU BOUGHT set up for. The ones that are 'ALL SET IN THE BOX' was those $799-$1200 PCs labelled GAMER'S PC. You made the decision to go with the generic cheap one you say 'on sale' , you got what you paid for.

The moment you think oh cool I can finally play this game or that game you run into a wall over and over again.Sighs.
I thank everyone here for their help and I genuinely and sincerely mean that but this once again screws me like it has about 3 times already back to back.
I am beginning to really wonder if computers are even worth it anymore the fact that all these games nowadays require so much in order to even play them is realistically not fair .

Personally you sound like you should just ditch the PC and just go console. PCs are full of maintenance and care and upkeep and headaches and hardships. You want a simple turn on use solution, CONSOLES fit that criteria.

I was told this could play GTA 4 really well but now im like nah that aint happening either apparently.
I have about 22 pc games up in my closet I have yet to play (except a few)cant find the receipt so I cant take them back and now Im left in the lurch. Just to name a few Dead Island Skyrim Oblivion Game of the Year Duke Nukem Forever Saints Row 2 and the third etc...

Take the PC, take the games, put them all on EBAY, sell them off before XMAS and then get a Console from the money. I think that would be your easiest least headache, that would satisfy your repeated issues.

 

[Tom Tancredi]

Hmm okay now im confused I just checked my device driver and it said this was my actual graphics card?

AMD Radeon HD 7660D so where does this come into play?

You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics What? Smh.

YES, a APU has the GRAPHICS chips built INTO the CPU (brains), but it is for 'general' use (i.e. using Word, checking email, surf websites), not for gaming. What was suggested was to install a second GPU (a card) into the computer and that will 'magically make all your problems go away' IF you want to play on really LOOOOOOWWW settings on VERY LOOOOWWW graphics displays "Metro: Last Light is easily the most demanding title in our suite, requiring us to drop the graphics details to their lowest settings and dial the resolution back to 1280x720. " from weblink provided.

So if all you care about is you 'get to play the game' but looks pretty crappy (especially if you compare it to the YouTube videos on better systems like many people do) and runs like a Flip Book, one at a time, then hey go for it. Personally I can't stand stuttttt tttt ttt tt eeerrrrr sssssttttttttttttoppp............. then play on a lousy looking graphics, my aim sucks back enough I need all the help I can get to 'see' the bad guys.

 

[rolandzhang3]

Hmm okay now im confused I just checked my device driver and it said this was my actual graphics card?

AMD Radeon HD 7660D so where does this come into play?

You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics What? Smh.

The 7660D is your actual GPU, with a decent kit of RAM running in dual channel you'll be fine for playing games at low-medium settings at 720p

If you have a single stick of DDR3-1333 RAM then you'd have much less performance than say, a dual channel set of DDR3-1866 or 2133 memory

The fact that the upcoming AMD Kaveri APUs can handle BF4 at low-medium at 1080p is very impressive

Personally I'd recommend you take into the points stated by rwpritchett and 13thmonkey, AMD included decent graphics with the APUs to lower the cost for a budget gamer or as a nice HTPC that can still handle some games

The 5700 itself is a competent quad core performing on par with an Athlon 750k so bottlenecking would not be a worry with decent mainstream cards such as the 7850/650 Ti Boost and below

Not everyone can afford to put a middle-high end GPU into their budget so that's why these APUs exist, the days of the pathetic Intel Extreme and Intel GMA graphics are over, hell, the Iris Pro 5200 IGPUs from intel perform on par with the dedicated GT 650M laptop GPUs

I'll be leaving this before it becomes a full out flame war

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7aG2R-Fs5E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSmbiGYHNqA

 

[Kenny De]

....I do not understand why consoles seem to be so much easier when it comes to gaming compared to PC....
I shouldn't have to upgrade a BRAND NEW COMPUTER in order to play pc games that is ridiculous and quite frankly pathetic.

Consoles are CLOSED systems, meaning you can only do one thing with them, play games. So they are fine tuned and only for that function, like a high end sports car, you really aren't worried about gas mileage or how many groceries it can fit in the trunk, you care how fast and how quick it can get to fast, so it is all tuned up for that.

PCs are OPEN system, you can swap parts, use them to do any thing you the end user choose, and ultimately you the end user are responsible for managing. Car analogy again; you buy a Honda Civic because it can fit groceries in the back and you get great gas milage, but you can't offroad in it. What can you do? Well you get tires, suspession, lift kits, and so on, and mod the crap out of it till it meets your needs. This is why consoles are so much easier.

Keeping on this track, say we buy that Honda (not knowing anything about cars, like you don't know anything about computers) and then we wonder why we can't race at the race track. Why is it so slow, why does it take so long to 'get up to speed' like those other cars. Or why aren't you even allowed to race at all, you have four wheels and a steering wheel, you put in gas like those sports cars do, what is the difference?

Take that I just said and replace all the car stuff with computer stuff, why do you need on a 'BRAND NEW COMPUTER' to upgrade to play the games you want, You have the same thing as those other computer? You have a keyboard and Windows? You have Internet like those other computers, what is the difference? Same REASON, you bought something that is one level of use, and instead wish to apply it in a way it wasn't specifically IN THE BOX YOU BOUGHT set up for. The ones that are 'ALL SET IN THE BOX' was those $799-$1200 PCs labelled GAMER'S PC. You made the decision to go with the generic cheap one you say 'on sale' , you got what you paid for.

The moment you think oh cool I can finally play this game or that game you run into a wall over and over again.Sighs.
I thank everyone here for their help and I genuinely and sincerely mean that but this once again screws me like it has about 3 times already back to back.
I am beginning to really wonder if computers are even worth it anymore the fact that all these games nowadays require so much in order to even play them is realistically not fair .

Personally you sound like you should just ditch the PC and just go console. PCs are full of maintenance and care and upkeep and headaches and hardships. You want a simple turn on use solution, CONSOLES fit that criteria.

I was told this could play GTA 4 really well but now im like nah that aint happening either apparently.
I have about 22 pc games up in my closet I have yet to play (except a few)cant find the receipt so I cant take them back and now Im left in the lurch. Just to name a few Dead Island Skyrim Oblivion Game of the Year Duke Nukem Forever Saints Row 2 and the third etc...

Take the PC, take the games, put them all on EBAY, sell them off before XMAS and then get a Console from the money. I think that would be your easiest least headache, that would satisfy your repeated issues.

You made the decision to go with the generic cheap one you say 'on sale' , you got what you paid for.


Comments like that are neither helpful nor constructive .

 

[Kenny De]

Hmm okay now im confused I just checked my device driver and it said this was my actual graphics card?

AMD Radeon HD 7660D so where does this come into play?

You Have: AMD A10-5700 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics What? Smh.

The 7660D is your actual GPU, with a decent kit of RAM running in dual channel you'll be fine for playing games at low-medium settings at 720p

If you have a single stick of DDR3-1333 RAM then you'd have much less performance than say, a dual channel set of DDR3-1866 or 2133 memory

The fact that the upcoming AMD Kaveri APUs can handle BF4 at low-medium at 1080p is very impressive

Personally I'd recommend you take into the points stated by rwpritchett and 13thmonkey, AMD included decent graphics with the APUs to lower the cost for a budget gamer or as a nice HTPC that can still handle some games

The 5700 itself is a competent quad core performing on par with an Athlon 750k so bottlenecking would not be a worry with decent mainstream cards such as the 7850/650 Ti Boost and below

Not everyone can afford to put a middle-high end GPU into their budget so that's why these APUs exist, the days of the pathetic Intel Extreme and Intel GMA graphics are over, hell, the Iris Pro 5200 IGPUs from intel perform on par with the dedicated GT 650M laptop GPUs

I'll be leaving this before it becomes a full out flame war

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H7aG2R-Fs5E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pSmbiGYHNqA

Ty so much for all the information Im gonna check out those videos Id like to learn more about this .

I just watched the first video it looks beautiful .

Medium looks quite nicer as well. Ty for these demonstrations much appreciated.

 

[13thmonkey]

Glad you found something useful in all this. The moral of the story is try to run something, it'll be slow if you don't have enough power, but it won't break anything.

when you are ready to upgrade then get in touch, and we'll tell you what you can and cannot do, and what is worth it.

 

[rolandzhang3]

It really depends on your RAM kit on how well these games run, one of my friends decided to cheap out with a single stick of DDR3-1333 and consequently has extremely sluggish performance in games up until I lent him my GTX 550 Ti :lol:

Even with integrated graphics, just running a game will not damage anything since it's not a stress test. It's mostly a matter of tweaking settings until you get a playable result. And if not, there is always room for expansion/upgrades unless your system is quite a few years out of date