Can't run memory at 1866mhz

[bibbish]

Hi guys,

Hoping you can help! I'm a bit of a novice, so if you have any suggestions please write them as if you were speaking to a child!

Here is my machine:
Mobo: Asrock 970 Extreme4
CPU: AMD FX 8350
RAM: 2x4GB Corsair Vengeance 1866mhz
GPU: XFX HD 7870 DD Edition 2GB
OS: Vista, Service Pack 2

My problem is that when I set my RAM to 1866mhz in the BIOS my PC only boots half the time. Often it has several attempts then sets the RAM to a low frequency before finally showing Windows.

A bit of detail for you. Me and a buddy are both building PCs so he has something very similar, the differences are, he hasn't put in his 7870 graphics card yet and is using an old one while he waits for a cable, my PSU is 650W and his is 750W and he is using Windows 7. Would these things make a difference? He is able to set his RAM to 1866mhz at the moment and the system is stable.

Any advice is appreciated, thanks.

Jason

 

[Tradesman1]

What are your current settings, DRAM timings (both base and advanced) , OC if any, and the system voltages, I wouldn't recommend anything that could damage the components, if they won't run at safe settings, I'll tell you so and we may have to drop the freq to 1600, been working with folks at GSkill (same as here, as a volunteer, so have a fair amount of experience)

 

[Tradesman1]

1 system does not make a rule, there are always some CPUs better than others and will handle sticks better, after helping more than 5-6,000 users on memory forums I've gained a little insight in setting DRAM up with different systems and in particular the CPUs, but apparently you know much more than I, so I'll it it to you to get this system running

Bibbish:
Sorry, I've only been here at Tom's for about a month, but am sort of sick of all the experts that have no idea what they are talking about, I'll let my record speak for itself, here in like 35 days I've accumulated about 90 best answers , mainly for solving problems with DRAM in the Memory area alone, Mr Warner here has at least 5 and has been a member for about 2.5 years...

 

[Tradesman1]

5-6000 or more that I've helped successfully at GSkill, prob many more...I've been here about a month and rec'd those best answers here, and don't really care about the best answers either....I've helped I don't know how many here in that month, often numerous posts to get things stable and running correctly at or as near as possible to spec timings and performance. It get's very frustrating when trying to help someone and have someone else barrel in and start spouting things they have read (often not true, i.e. the 8350 has a native 1866 MC, when it doesn't - check the ref I provided earlier, the AMD BIOS and KERNEL Programming GUIDE, or AMD Freq guide:

http://support.amd.com/us/kbarticles/Pages/ddr3memoryfrequencyguide.aspx

If it was native it should support 1866 in a fully populated mobo, and some do, with 1 or 2 GB sticks, think I've seen about a dozen maybe that ran 4x4GB @ 1866, but not a single one yet w/ 32GB of 1866....and if that is in fact Native, then they should be able to run much faster DRAM, but the sad fact is they can't, while Intel with 'native' 1333 and 1600 MCs, can run up to 2400-3000 sticks fully populated.

I work for the forums for two main reasons, A) to help folks get their rigs running and get the most for their money and B) to help me keep up with all the hardware out there, which helps my systems business (Consulting, building, networking, repairs, upgrades, etc)....RAM has always drawn a particular interest for me, because it's the least understood of the PC components....Even among those who write about it....you see reviews and articles all the time saying things like "This set of DRAM didn't go in and set the XMP settings properly" duh...XMP setting are in the SPD, it's the responsibility of the BIOS to get those settings and implement them, the DRAM doesn't magically wave a wand and make changes and sadly, many BIOSs are ready to do so, which is why you continuously see BIOS updates, oft time a BIOS update will list one or two things, then have 50-75% of the entire update be DRAM updates....Why? Take a look at a QVL, when the mobo makers make their QVLs they use whatever they have on hand, and they 'test' at the mobos boot default values, generally 1333 or 1600, so if 2133 sticks are listed, they were 'tested' at 1333/1600 and most any DRAM will run at basic default values - you can even see what is programmed in the sticks for defaults in CPU-Z,under the SPD tab in the max bandwidth window (which many people insist if the DRAM chip ID), can see more on QVLs and CPU-Z in these info threads:

http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?t=10566
http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?t=10565

These things particularly come into play with higher freq DRAM and particularly with AMD...Intel has XMP or manual, AMD uses manual setup, sometimes their EOCP or DOCP and occasionally XMP and on some mobos a couple of the OC profiles....but when none of them are ready for a set of sticks one has to go ina manually set them up which includes the voltages changes I try and walk people through (can also entail advanced/secondary timing changes)

DRAM is much like CPUs, you never know what you are getting, and that's why sticks are sold in multiple packages, tolerances are so small and tight you might take 5 'identical' sticks from the same production lot and find that only 2 of them will play together at spec, that's the reason for the sets, they test sticks to work together, CPUs and tolerances are the same, Asus did a study on a few hundred Haswell 4770Ks, of all of them only 10% could run 4.8GHz, 20% could do 4.7, 30% 4.6 and 70% could run 4.5 , so 30% were limited to OCs of 4.4 or less

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/06/01/intel_haswell_i74770k_ipc_overclocking_review/6#.Ua6RSm3m7_k

Also, when I see something out of the ordinary, you as an example 😉 actually your system, I often ask if the person, and I'm asking you, could post up screen shots of CPU-Z, the CPU, SPD and Memory pages so I can get an idea of how your rig is running 1600 sticks on a 955, you must have a good 955 and good sticks, I've seen some that run them most often 1 or 2 GB sticks in a 2 by formation, but knowing what it's running at, the timings (particularly the tRC and tRFC if showing, and voltages can prob help me to help others in a similar situation.


the I know systems and in particular DRAM and know what and how it has to be manipulated to get it stable

 

[bibbish]

Also, when I see something out of the ordinary, you as an example 😉 actually your system, I often ask if the person, and I'm asking you, could post up screen shots of CPU-Z, the CPU, SPD and Memory pages so I can get an idea of how your rig is running 1600 sticks on a 955, you must have a good 955 and good sticks, I've seen some that run them most often 1 or 2 GB sticks in a 2 by formation, but knowing what it's running at, the timings (particularly the tRC and tRFC if showing, and voltages can prob help me to help others in a similar situation.

Sure, I'll be able to get you some screen grabs of that. What do you mean by a 955?

 

[bibbish]

"the same was true when they released the 965 C3 and touted it as running 1600 sticks, those often required an extra + 0.05 to the DRAM and about + 0.10 or more to the MC"

My DDR3 1600 memory is running at it's rated frequency with my Phenom 2 x4 955 C3 at stock voltages, rock solid. It obviously also depends on the motherboard you are using (compatibility reasons and all that) There are thousands of users running similar setups like the OP without these issues. The only time you ever need to raise voltages for your hardware is when going for high to extreme overclocks. And the OP already increased the voltages as you suggested with no luck.

@bibbish Did you make sure that all your power connectors, 8-pin cpu, ATX and both 6-pin PCI-E are all properly connected?
You mentioned that the memory timings in the bios is the same as the timings on the sticker, 9-10-9-27 or 9-9-9-24 Manually change the timings to higher values as follows under DRAM Timing Control: 11-11-11-28

We built the PCs at a friends house. When I got home a few weeks ago, that is when I tried to run my RAM faster and started having problems. I moved it to different slots and took the opportunity to check various things were connected properly. Which connector is the ATX?

Also with setting the timings to 11-11-11-28 why might that work?

 

[bibbish]

@bibbish "Sure, I'll be able to get you some screen grabs of that. What do you mean by a 955?" That post was meant for me, Tradesman1 wants to know how am i able to run my 1600's at it's rated speeds with my Phenom 2 x4 955 processor so you can ignore that.
The ATX is the 24-pin power connector on your motherboard, Just mentioned it to you to make sure that all power cables is properly connected. As for the 11-11-11-28 timings, it could aid in getting your ram to operate more reliably at 1866 and worth doing so just to test.

Okay 11-11-11-28, it didn't like that at all. Refused to boot and took me a couple attempts to get back to the BIOS. Let's talk voltages and stuff, if you have any more ideas guys! 😀

 

[bibbish]

That's weird should not have happened, have you thought about just running your memory at a lower frequency, at least your PC will be stable and you will be able to use it. You not gonna notice a performance increase running it at 1866 over 1600 unless you run pointless synthetic benchmarks. It's probably just your motherboard not wanting to play nice (COMPATIBILITY ISSUES) eventually Asrock will release a bios update that could fix memory compatibility issues.

EDIT: Report the issue you are having to Asrock http://event.asrock.com/tsd.asp

I think I will have to admit defeat for the time being maybe. I did report it yes, I'm hoping for an email back from them...

 

[bibbish]

Just got this email reply:

The FX CPU support DDR3_1866 only in SingleChannel mode with 2 Modules maximum

http://www.amd.com/us/products/desktop/processors/amdfx/Pages/amdfx-key-architectural-features.aspx



Supports up to DDR3-1866

1866 supported with 1 DPC (DIMM per Channel) in single memory slot motherboard designs


Please place the memory modules in DDR3_A1 and DDR3_A2 or DDR3_B1 and DDR3_B2 and try again.

If you want to use 4 memory modules, please set the DRAM speed to 1600.

So, my question is, if I try say slots A1 and B1 (that's one white slot and one blue slot isn't it?) I'll be in SingleChannel mode. What's better, 1866mhz in SingleChannel mode or 1600mhz in DualChannel mode? 😛

 

[Tradesman1]

As mentioned earlier so much for the native 1866 controller - believe I mentioned it's actuall a 1333 controller, per the AMD Bios and Kernel Programming Guide......the 1866 bit is 'UP TO' which is a far cry from native that AMD likes others to promote

 

[MIJ-VI]

Thank you Tradesman1.

I was settled upon getting two pairs of 1866MHz HyperX Furys for an FX-8350 / M5A88-V EVO combo until I found this thread.

I now understand why G.Skill's four 32GB kits for 880G-based 'boards max. out at 1600MHz.

 

[Tradesman1]

No worries

 

[sourodip]

Wow..that was a nice piece of advice with a lot of experience..
Learned a lot..thanks Tradesman1!

 

[pablorz007]

5-6000 or more that I've helped successfully at GSkill, prob many more...I've been here about a month and rec'd those best answers here, and don't really care about the best answers either....I've helped I don't know how many here in that month, often numerous posts to get things stable and running correctly at or as near as possible to spec timings and performance. It get's very frustrating when trying to help someone and have someone else barrel in and start spouting things they have read (often not true, i.e. the 8350 has a native 1866 MC, when it doesn't - check the ref I provided earlier, the AMD BIOS and KERNEL Programming GUIDE, or AMD Freq guide:

http://support.amd.com/us/kbarticles/Pages/ddr3memoryfrequencyguide.aspx

If it was native it should support 1866 in a fully populated mobo, and some do, with 1 or 2 GB sticks, think I've seen about a dozen maybe that ran 4x4GB @ 1866, but not a single one yet w/ 32GB of 1866....and if that is in fact Native, then they should be able to run much faster DRAM, but the sad fact is they can't, while Intel with 'native' 1333 and 1600 MCs, can run up to 2400-3000 sticks fully populated.

I work for the forums for two main reasons, A) to help folks get their rigs running and get the most for their money and B) to help me keep up with all the hardware out there, which helps my systems business (Consulting, building, networking, repairs, upgrades, etc)....RAM has always drawn a particular interest for me, because it's the least understood of the PC components....Even among those who write about it....you see reviews and articles all the time saying things like "This set of DRAM didn't go in and set the XMP settings properly" duh...XMP setting are in the SPD, it's the responsibility of the BIOS to get those settings and implement them, the DRAM doesn't magically wave a wand and make changes and sadly, many BIOSs are ready to do so, which is why you continuously see BIOS updates, oft time a BIOS update will list one or two things, then have 50-75% of the entire update be DRAM updates....Why? Take a look at a QVL, when the mobo makers make their QVLs they use whatever they have on hand, and they 'test' at the mobos boot default values, generally 1333 or 1600, so if 2133 sticks are listed, they were 'tested' at 1333/1600 and most any DRAM will run at basic default values - you can even see what is programmed in the sticks for defaults in CPU-Z,under the SPD tab in the max bandwidth window (which many people insist if the DRAM chip ID), can see more on QVLs and CPU-Z in these info threads:

http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?t=10566
http://www.gskill.us/forum/showthread.php?t=10565

These things particularly come into play with higher freq DRAM and particularly with AMD...Intel has XMP or manual, AMD uses manual setup, sometimes their EOCP or DOCP and occasionally XMP and on some mobos a couple of the OC profiles....but when none of them are ready for a set of sticks one has to go ina manually set them up which includes the voltages changes I try and walk people through (can also entail advanced/secondary timing changes)

DRAM is much like CPUs, you never know what you are getting, and that's why sticks are sold in multiple packages, tolerances are so small and tight you might take 5 'identical' sticks from the same production lot and find that only 2 of them will play together at spec, that's the reason for the sets, they test sticks to work together, CPUs and tolerances are the same, Asus did a study on a few hundred Haswell 4770Ks, of all of them only 10% could run 4.8GHz, 20% could do 4.7, 30% 4.6 and 70% could run 4.5 , so 30% were limited to OCs of 4.4 or less

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2013/06/01/intel_haswell_i74770k_ipc_overclocking_review/6#.Ua6RSm3m7_k

Also, when I see something out of the ordinary, you as an example 😉 actually your system, I often ask if the person, and I'm asking you, could post up screen shots of CPU-Z, the CPU, SPD and Memory pages so I can get an idea of how your rig is running 1600 sticks on a 955, you must have a good 955 and good sticks, I've seen some that run them most often 1 or 2 GB sticks in a 2 by formation, but knowing what it's running at, the timings (particularly the tRC and tRFC if showing, and voltages can prob help me to help others in a similar situation.


the I know systems and in particular DRAM and know what and how it has to be manipulated to get it stable

Oh My God!! Nice information! Thanks
i'm getting crazy reading about Ram.
I'm better oriented, now im like this mate. look. tell me what you see.

 

[Tradesman1]

Look in your BIOS for DOCP, EOCP or XMP and try enabing that then select the 1866 Freq, your running at1400 at the moment

 

[cousamis]

I have listen many of you with problem when you play steam or many other games with DDR3 1866 and application crash. Is not problem of the application or VGA drivers or any other equipment you connect to your pc. Download any program that can helps to find out your memories latency and go to your motherboard BIOS and pass manually all latencies of your memory and don't forget as well to pass manually the VOLTAGE of your memories. If you set your BIOS to auto reading your memories for sure your will fall from 1866 to 1600. I downloaded AIDA64 and found out all the latencies that my memories have as well the most important the VOLTAGE of my memories when they are active on 1866 volt. This is all. Stop crashes and steam games play perfect. (Don't forget to pass all the latencies that your motherboard refers. Not only the 9-9-9-10-9 BUT ALL that AIDA64 gives you under each memory frequency.(VOLTAGE IS THE MOST IMPORTANTE)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOT ONLY TO PASS THE MEMORY LATENCIES.

 

[MIJ-VI]

Contextually related to the subject matter of this thread:

Sep 25, 2013
High Speed RAM - Is it Worth it? DDR3 1333MHz vs 2400MHz Test - YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWgzA2C61z4