Capacitors in PSU are dangerous?

[Guest]

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half_pint wrote:
> "Ken" <___ken3@telia.com> wrote in message
> news:u6c780hp3g4t1cihopoahr0f88bmgintms@4ax.com...
>
>>On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 15:29:18 +0100, Michael Salem <a$-b$1@ms3.org.uk>
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>All Europe use 230V today. UK adapted from 240V to 230V
>>>>and the other countries from 220V to 230 volts.
>>>
>>>Nobody ACTUALLY changed their voltage, at least initially.
>>
>>In Sweden we did change from 220V to 230V a long time ago.
>>Yes I could measure that on my volt meter.
>>230.5V on all 3 phases and 400V between the phases 5 minutes ago.
>
>
> You have 3 phase domestic power supplies in Sweden?
>

You can have it in Australia if you ask for it...


--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

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GB wrote:
> The only PSU I had where the fan failed pretty much melted itself into a
> heap of slag before the rest of it failed. It was only then that I found out
> about the problem. Fortunately, it did not take anything else with it when
> its soul went off to that great electronic warehouse in the sky.

We get them in with noisy fans - bearings stuffed basicly. That's about
it tho. It does happen.

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

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half_pint wrote:
> PLONK for being a twat and an idiot
>
> Q: Why is bottom posting so annoying?
> A: See note at end of file.

PLONK for being a dumbass who *obviously* hasn't read the FAQs for any
technical newsgroup.

<parting shot>
No, /don't/ guess. Electricity kills.

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

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"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au" <"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au"> wrote in message
news:40847a2a@quokka.wn.com.au...
> half_pint wrote:
> > PLONK for being a twat and an idiot
> >
> > Q: Why is bottom posting so annoying?
> > A: See note at end of file.
>
> PLONK for being a dumbass who *obviously* hasn't read the FAQs for any
> technical newsgroup.

PLONK for being a twat who does.

>
> <parting shot>
> No, /don't/ guess. Electricity kills.

Only if you are not wearing rubber soled shoes when I invite you round for
dinner.
I 'guess' you were not expecting that?

>
> --
> -Luke-
> If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
> flying by now.
> But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
> Registered Linux User #345134

 

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VWWall wrote:

> A 0.1 Farad at 300 V is more than a "decent sized" capacitor. For
> example most PC PSUs contain two 470 mfd capacitors each charged to
> about 160 V. The energy stored is 1/2 C E^2 = 1/2 470 x 10^-6 x 160 x160.
> This is about 6 J or 12 J for the two. This would keep a 12 W bulb lit
> for one second.

So what do you call a 5 farad cap?

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

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"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au" wrote:
>
> So what do you call a 5 farad cap?


"Ground".


*TimDaniels*

 

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beav AT wn DoT com DoT au wrote:

> So what do you call a 5 farad cap?

Big?

 

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beav AT wn DoT com DoT au wrote:
> VWWall wrote:
>
>> A 0.1 Farad at 300 V is more than a "decent sized" capacitor.
>> For example most PC PSUs contain two 470 mfd capacitors each
>> charged to about 160 V. The energy stored is 1/2 C E^2 = 1/2
>> 470 x 10^-6 x 160 x160. This is about 6 J or 12 J for the two.
>> This would keep a 12 W bulb lit for one second.
>
> So what do you call a 5 farad cap?

A monster. That would take 1 amp flowing for 5 seconds to charge
to 1 volt. To discharge it in 10 microsecs would require 500,000
amps.

--
Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net)
Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
<http://cbfalconer.home.att.net> USE worldnet address!

 

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half_pint <esboella.nospam@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Care to hazard a guess as to which newsreader 90% of users use?
I have this odd feeling that many users are making use of a certain popular
e-mail client program instead of a dedicated newsreader. Probably explains
all this top-posting we see.

| You might win a coconut.
Mmmmm - coconuts. I like coconuts.

| Need a clue? Click 'help' then 'about'.
What - on 90% of users machines ? That would be one hell of an undertaking
!

| It will even tell you your version number, your's is 6.00.2800.1106
| by the way. :O|
My e-mail headers say that, true, but how do you know I'm not setting them
as I wish ?

| About time you upgrade that old email client to the latest version?
Really ? Why ?

| You won't regret it :O|
Okay, so does the latest version of the e-mail client you think that I am
using have fewer bugs and use less system resources ? Does it work better
and faster ? Does it enable me to send better messages ? If you are
advising me to use different software then fine, but please justify it.

Kevin.

| "Kevin Lawton" <kepla@btinternet.com> wrote in message
| news:c61nle$c5h$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
|| half_pint wrote:
||
|||| Bottom posting means you have to loads of unnecessary scrolling to
|||| real oneliner.
||
|| I guess that depends on whether you are using a proper newsreader
|| program or just any old e-mail client to read newsgroups.
||
|| Kevin.

 

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larrymoencurly wrote:
> VWWall <vwall@DEADearthlink.net> wrote in message
>
>> I did not remove the 220 ohm bleeders, but this time constant
>> is about 100 seconds. These bleeders are needed to equalize
>> the voltage between the input capacitors, so it's unlikely
>> they'd be not used to save costs.
>
> Inside my Enermax EV365P-VD (single-fan, 350W, included with an
> Enermax CS-1251-B case), I couldn't find any bleeder resistors
> across the high voltage 680uF capacitors or even empty spaces
> on the circuit board where those resistors could have been
> installed. This is probably a budget version Enermax because I
> saw another 350W Enermax with 820uF capacitors, but I still
> don't understand why there were no bleeders because I've seen
> them in even the cheapest PSUs, including a 300W MaxPower (Key
> Mouse) that could not have possibly met FCC standards (no EMI
> filter, tons of AM radio noise). Should I solder an approx.
> 200K resistor across each of those capacitors in the Enermax?

They are only needed for voltage equalization when capacitors are
mounted in series. In the primary circuit this would be connected
with switching from 115 to 230 v nominal input. If they are used
in a voltage doubler circuit, for 115, no equalization would be
needed. If they are put in series, for 230, equalization is
required.

--
Chuck F (cbfalconer@yahoo.com) (cbfalconer@worldnet.att.net)
Available for consulting/temporary embedded and systems.
<http://cbfalconer.home.att.net> USE worldnet address!

 

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CBFalconer wrote:

> beav AT wn DoT com DoT au wrote:
>
>>VWWall wrote:
>>
>>
>>>A 0.1 Farad at 300 V is more than a "decent sized" capacitor.
>>>For example most PC PSUs contain two 470 mfd capacitors each
>>>charged to about 160 V. The energy stored is 1/2 C E^2 = 1/2
>>>470 x 10^-6 x 160 x160. This is about 6 J or 12 J for the two.
>>>This would keep a 12 W bulb lit for one second.
>>
>>So what do you call a 5 farad cap?
>
>
> A monster.
>
Yep, and there's a 10 on the way...

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

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half_pint wrote:
> Care to hazard a guess as to which newsreader 90% of users use?
> You might win a coconut.
> Need a clue? Click 'help' then 'about'.
> It will even tell you your version number, your's is 6.00.2800.1106
> by the way. :O|
> About time you upgrade that old email client to the latest version?
> You won't regret it :O|

And your's is 6.00.2800.1158, what's your point?
--
~misfit~

> "Kevin Lawton" <kepla@btinternet.com> wrote in message
> news:c61nle$c5h$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
>> half_pint wrote:
>>
>>>> Bottom posting means you have to loads of unnecessary scrolling to
>>>> real oneliner.
>>
>> I guess that depends on whether you are using a proper newsreader
>> program or just any old e-mail client to read newsgroups.
>>
>> Kevin.

 

[jad]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

DIE THREAD DIE....

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

JAD wrote:

> DIE THREAD DIE....

If you think *this* one is silly, check out the Power Led thread....

--
-Luke-
If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
flying by now.
But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz@yahoomung.co.nz> wrote in message
news:Mv3hc.106$_s.15750@news.xtra.co.nz...
> half_pint wrote:
> > Care to hazard a guess as to which newsreader 90% of users use?
> > You might win a coconut.
> > Need a clue? Click 'help' then 'about'.
> > It will even tell you your version number, your's is 6.00.2800.1106
> > by the way. :O|
> > About time you upgrade that old email client to the latest version?
> > You won't regret it :O|
>
> And your's is 6.00.2800.1158, what's your point?

My point is that you are an idiot.


> --
> ~misfit~
>
> > "Kevin Lawton" <kepla@btinternet.com> wrote in message
> > news:c61nle$c5h$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> >> half_pint wrote:
> >>
> >>>> Bottom posting means you have to loads of unnecessary scrolling to
> >>>> real oneliner.
> >>
> >> I guess that depends on whether you are using a proper newsreader
> >> program or just any old e-mail client to read newsgroups.
> >>
> >> Kevin.
>
>

 

[Guest]

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"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au" <"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au"> wrote in message
news:4084bf53$1@quokka.wn.com.au...
> CBFalconer wrote:
>
> > beav AT wn DoT com DoT au wrote:
> >
> >>VWWall wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>A 0.1 Farad at 300 V is more than a "decent sized" capacitor.
> >>>For example most PC PSUs contain two 470 mfd capacitors each
> >>>charged to about 160 V. The energy stored is 1/2 C E^2 = 1/2
> >>>470 x 10^-6 x 160 x160. This is about 6 J or 12 J for the two.
> >>>This would keep a 12 W bulb lit for one second.
> >>
> >>So what do you call a 5 farad cap?
> >
> >
> > A monster.
> >
> Yep, and there's a 10 on the way...

Not two in parrallel surely :O|

>
> --
> -Luke-
> If cars had advanced at the same rate as Micr0$oft technology, they'd be
> flying by now.
> But who wants a car that crashes 8 times a day?
> Registered Linux User #345134

 

[Guest]

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"Kevin Lawton" <kepla@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:c62vtp$c5$1@sparta.btinternet.com...
> half_pint <esboella.nospam@yahoo.com> wrote:
> | Care to hazard a guess as to which newsreader 90% of users use?
> I have this odd feeling that many users are making use of a certain
popular
> e-mail client program instead of a dedicated newsreader. Probably explains
> all this top-posting we see.
>
> | You might win a coconut.
> Mmmmm - coconuts. I like coconuts.
>
> | Need a clue? Click 'help' then 'about'.
> What - on 90% of users machines ? That would be one hell of an
undertaking
> !
>
> | It will even tell you your version number, your's is 6.00.2800.1106
> | by the way. :O|
> My e-mail headers say that, true, but how do you know I'm not setting them
> as I wish ?

You have no motive.

>
> | About time you upgrade that old email client to the latest version?
> Really ? Why ?
>
> | You won't regret it :O|
> Okay, so does the latest version of the e-mail client you think that I am
> using have fewer bugs and use less system resources ?


Not in my experience no.

> Does it work better
> and faster ? Does it enable me to send better messages ? If you are
> advising me to use different software then fine, but please justify it.
>
> Kevin.
>
> | "Kevin Lawton" <kepla@btinternet.com> wrote in message
> | news:c61nle$c5h$1@hercules.btinternet.com...
> || half_pint wrote:
> ||
> |||| Bottom posting means you have to loads of unnecessary scrolling to
> |||| real oneliner.
> ||
> || I guess that depends on whether you are using a proper newsreader
> || program or just any old e-mail client to read newsgroups.
> ||
> || Kevin.
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

"ric" wrote:
> Timothy Daniels wrote:
>
> > > > What about the reverse leakage current in the rectifier? Doesn't
> > > > that amount to a bleeder resistor?
> > >
> > > Current path would be...???
> >
> > Backward through the rectifier.
>
> Fine, but where from there? The entire path. There isn't one.


Show me the schematic, I'll show you the path. Remember that
any semiconductor is only a semi-insulator.

*TimDaniels*

 

[ken]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 16:53:09 +0100, "half_pint"
<esboella.nospam@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>>> All Europe use 230V today. UK adapted from 240V to 230V
>>>> and the other countries from 220V to 230 volts.
>>>
>>> Nobody ACTUALLY changed their voltage, at least initially.
>>
>> In Sweden we did change from 220V to 230V a long time ago.
>> Yes I could measure that on my volt meter.
>> 230.5V on all 3 phases and 400V between the phases 5 minutes ago.
>
> You have 3 phase domestic power supplies in Sweden?

Yes, 3 phase in almoast every house and in my 2-rom flat.
That's standard more than 50 years in Sweden.

 

[ken]

Archived from groups: alt.comp.hardware,alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,uk.comp.homebuilt,alt.comp.hardware.homebuilt (More info?)

On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 02:23:00 +0100, "half_pint"
<esboella.nospam@yahoo.com> wrote:

>>> You have 3 phase domestic power supplies in Sweden?
>>
>> You can have it in Australia if you ask for it...
>
> Is there any point?
> Can you actually buy any domestic apps which use three phase?

Electrical stove in kitchen is normal 3 phase in Sweden
(my stove is 8915W maximum), some washing machines,
heating and other machines to. Electrical heating normally
used to be connected between two fases (400V.
It uses to deliver power to different rooms. One room one phase.

Normal in a flat is 3 x 230V 16A main fuses.
3 x 16A = 11040W at 230V (between phase and zero/earth)
3 x 16A = 19200W at 400V (between phases)

Normal in a one family house is 3 x 230V 25A main fuses.
3 x 25A = 17250W at 230V (between phase and zero/earth)
3 x 25A = 30000W at 400V (between phases)

You can get more power from a 400V 3 phase system.

 

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CBFalconer <cbfalconer@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<40851ADA.448B8E42@yahoo.com>...
> larrymoencurly wrote:

> These bleeders are needed to equalize the voltage between
> the input capacitors,
> >
> > Inside my Enermax EV365P-VD.. I couldn't find any bleeder
> > resistors across the high voltage 680uF capacitors or
> > even empty spaces
> > I still don't understand why there were no bleeders because
> > I've seen them in even the cheapest PSUs
> > Should I solder an approx. 200K resistor across each of
> > those capacitors in the Enermax?
>
> They are only needed for voltage equalization when capacitors are
> mounted in series. In the primary circuit this would be connected
> with switching from 115 to 230 v nominal input. If they are used
> in a voltage doubler circuit, for 115, no equalization would be
> needed. If they are put in series, for 230, equalization is
> required.

This is what I don't understand because while I'm using 115VAC, this
Enermax PSU has a switch for 230VAC operation. I know that when PSUs
are shipped to countries where 230VAC is used, the line fuse is cut to
half the amperage, but are bleeder resistors added for those
countries? In the case of this Enermax there aren't any places on the
circuit board for them.

 

[Guest]

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On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 02:23:00 +0100, "half_pint"
<esboella.nospam@yahoo.com> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>
>"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au" <"beav AT wn DoT com DoT au"> wrote in message
>news:4084759c$1@quokka.wn.com.au...
>> half_pint wrote:
>> > "Ken" <___ken3@telia.com> wrote in message
>> > news:u6c780hp3g4t1cihopoahr0f88bmgintms@4ax.com...
>> >
>> >>On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 15:29:18 +0100, Michael Salem <a$-b$1@ms3.org.uk>
>> >>wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>>>All Europe use 230V today. UK adapted from 240V to 230V
>> >>>>and the other countries from 220V to 230 volts.
>> >>>
>> >>>Nobody ACTUALLY changed their voltage, at least initially.
>> >>
>> >>In Sweden we did change from 220V to 230V a long time ago.
>> >>Yes I could measure that on my volt meter.
>> >>230.5V on all 3 phases and 400V between the phases 5 minutes ago.
>> >
>> >
>> > You have 3 phase domestic power supplies in Sweden?
>> >
>>
>> You can have it in Australia if you ask for it...
>
>Is there any point?
>Can you actually buy any domestic apps which use three phase?

Ducted domestic air conditioning systems often require 3-phase power.


- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 's' from my address when replying by email.