Carmack: Cloud Significant Part of Landscape

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ProDigit10

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About installing games:
Many games don't need installing! They just need a place on the harddrive to load themselves in!
Many (like eg: farmville or angry birds) you can extract from an archive to whatever directory, and play it from there. No installation needed, just between 10 and 80MB of space (most of it is for the music).
 

ProDigit10

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[citation][nom]sceen311[/nom]I think some people seem to be missing the points. According to AppData Farmville reached 80million players in Feb 2010. Do you know of any non-cloud based games that have reached that many people ever?[/citation]
Not in those numbers, and partly because farmville is distributed over facebook, which only allows it to be played in a java window.
If they allowed a free download of the game, a lot of people would have done so!
But I can compare it to over 10-12 billion of game copies sold that are not cloud based (not to mention another 10-15 billion that are ran on computers illegally).
 

reggieray

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[citation][nom]house70[/nom]Yep... he needs to go back to machining. He's just not that into PC gaming anymore.[/citation]
Right, he use to be the man but has abandoned the PC almost entirely. Some would say he is just moving with the times, I say traitor.
 

reggieray

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[citation][nom]sceen311[/nom]I think some people seem to be missing the points. According to AppData Farmville reached 80million players in Feb 2010. Do you know of any non-cloud based games that have reached that many people ever?[/citation]
I have meat people who like farmville, one was a woman who I went over to fix her PC. She was a typical Windows user that could pick a mouse out of a hardware lineup 4 out of 5 tries.
Enough said about the PC savvy of farmville players.
 

shin0bi272

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Wasnt there an article a little while ago that someone said that PC's were now several generations ahead of consoles? Couldnt the same thing be said about cloud computing? When the cloud can play the latest games on everyone's hardware it will be a contender ... and even then it will be dependent on the internet bandwidth and how fast you upgrade your ipad. Can anyone compare the graphics in lets say oblivion or fall out new vegas to world of warcraft and honestly say the WoW graphics are better? Obviously not... that's the type of graphics and the price you can expect from the cloud... sure millions pay to play it every day but its butt ugly. Id rather pay 50 bucks once and play a much better looking game on my own hardware than pay 9 or 15 dollars a MONTH to play a crappy looking game with a bunch of people who have absolutely no lives.
 

shin0bi272

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[citation][nom]akymi[/nom]Don't mess with things you don't understand. The very fact you even dare to compare WoW to farmwhatevercrap shows how shallow and narrow-minded you are. After five years of q3 something like two years of sc/wc3/aoe and bit over five years in WoW i can easily tell you which game is most skill-based. Oh and if you are terrible at something it doesn't mean it sucks - it means you do_On topic: cloud is like communism - it's a perfect system and because of that it will never work, for humans will never be perfect. It's called cloud for a reason you know...[/citation]
no hes right but the term is usually "casual gaming" only it doesnt fit 100% because people like you take them seriously... even though they are honestly lame and cost you nothing but money and time and friends.

On topic the cloud is like communism... everyone gets the same amount of money (i.e. the same looking game) no matter how hard they work (aka what hardware they have)... Its a race to the bottom to get the most people the least amount of benefit so that everyone is equal in their misery of horrible conditions (graphics). Some perfect system THAT is.
 

hoofhearted

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I am sure all of those farmcrap users are actual individuals and not multiple accounts.

Also, cloud? With all the Sony crap and ISP caps. Not to mention lag. No fn thanks! The only cloud I care about is the one I make after I eat a can of beans and force upon an elevator full of unsuspecting victims. Now that is control baby!

Carmack used to be something, but now he is just retired. Maybe he being synical or maybe he really thinks this way. Either way, when he makes claims like this, he is just alienating the gaming crowd he built his career on.
 

Prey

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Carmack, you've made you contribution to computer gaming, now give it a rest. Just because something is wide spread and free doesn't mean it's accurate or good. You're a pioneer, I'll grant you that, but even pioneers lose touch and become irrelevant.
 

dasper

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[citation][nom]ReggieRay[/nom]I have meat people who like farmville, one was a woman who I went over to fix her PC. She was a typical Windows user that could pick a mouse out of a hardware lineup 4 out of 5 tries.Enough said about the PC savvy of farmville players.[/citation]

A gamer is a gamer. Just because they are computer illiterate does not mean they are not a target for companies to sell games/products to. What I think he is trying to state is probably not even half of the 80 million people who play farmville would download it or buy it at a store but will click to play and some will even drop real world cash into it.

Think of it this way, you make a mindless hack and slash game like Diablo available in a cloud environment, give limited "demo" access for free, privlidged access if you are free but playing with a paid friend (similar to quake live or Blizzards Spawn copy), and full access for paid copies. You will not only market gamers but the computer illiterate gamers as well. Since a cloud based environment can act as a convenience and DRM at the same time, it could be a win win.

...then it gets hit with a DDOS, your game goes down, your info gets hacked, now gold farmers not only steal your account but your identity, company goes bankrupt and you have no physical copy to play on your own anymore, server goes down in 15 years and you cannot play this retro game that you used to love...
 

fyasko

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[citation][nom]tlmck[/nom]Carmack has been throwing darts for several years now hoping something will stick. This is necessary since id can't seem to come up with a decent PC game any more.[/citation]
they did produce the engine for MW2, they still have the best engines IMO. i feeling they give the user is far better than eny FPS i have played on xbox. tryarch's engine is horrible in comparison.
 

akymi

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[citation]i have played more than you. calling wow and farmvill in the same sentance is wrong, but calling wow skill based... no no no no no... calling any current mmo skill based is another no. an mmo, all current ones, are about knowing what button to hit when, which takes no real skill at all, only time. but its more than farmvill, which i never played, but believe to be like an easier version of sim farm[/citation]

I strongly doubt you've played more than me unless you're 40+ but it's of no issue anyhow. EVERY single game is about knowing which button to press and when to press it so your logic (or lack of it on that matter) is flawed. The endgame content of WoW is reached by around 3% of it's player-base so it's easy to explain your lack of understanding for the things you're trying to comment on. Oh and stop confusing skill with knowledge. Knowing how to doesn't make you able to do things.
 

thechief73

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Said it on every cloud news article that is on THW and I'll say it here again... Cloud will NOT!!! work, PERIOD. With ~62% internet penetration in the US and max average 11.5Mb/s and every major ISP adopting bandwidth caps, aging infrastructure and ISP's unwillingness to upgrade while charging higher prices by the year, it is completely and utterly impossible!

I wish these people will pull their heads out of where the sun doesn't shine and get a clue!
 

kastraelie

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[citation][nom]virtualban[/nom]Cloud games will only work because it's the new DRM. You don't get the game to play on your own computer not even for single player games. You need to be connected to the internet, and you can't even save/reload, for real, because your devices will be just the viewers. Games tried to enforce this addictive part into the games by limiting the saves available or having just checkpoint system. It did attract more game time than a free to save game. This is arguably a good idea. I personally think it's bad idea. But the point is, they will control the gamer's experience, and gather all data too and build a better sell model. Even for free games, they will be giving you commercials in game. And will be checking if you are paying attention by how you react in game, since they will be knowing everything. And this control is much more worth than the trouble of streaming content or pre-rendered video, or the lag with both streaming content and video. Worth for the game producers of course.If they get hold of the market, and organize themselves into RIAA forms, and hunt independent content makers for some fort of copyright infringement that the independent artists won't have the resources to defend even if they are in the right. But of course with all this content in the world it is very likely that something you make has already been made. Either spend eternity making sure it's something completely new, or just release it, and deal with the lawsuits.It's a dark future in my eyes. And those with power will not let it go. They will seek it. They got it all figured out already. The resistance as we opposing the cloud right now is futile. Unless we get organized, we will be just the herd they will guide around so we work for them and get fun at their whim.Don't believe me. Think for yourself. Try to put yourself in the place of those with power, and try to see what kind of person has more power, and what kind of person gets to a point when is happy with what he got and just keeps doing what pleases him. The kind of person who has already everything, but still wants more, is the kind of person who I am talking about. Place yourself in those shoes. See how DRM works, how cloud computing, cloud gaming, centralized rendering help your ideas. See how you wish people's computers were just terminals, and you could control their experience and their personal development further. With computers getting everywhere, and anonymity down the drain by all the sensors to check who is doing what, the call of greed will make it happen, because they call it development, and in a way they are right.I still have hope for humanity not to end like this prediction, but I know they are actively thinking how to make it happen, and we are just passively resisting, till we are lured little by little away from choice into comfort of choices being made for us. I know my dad or my fiancee would like cloud computing and cloud gaming. They are most likely to spend money too, and products will be developed for them more. And prices will increase inevitably for the rare offline computers, even if corporations don't go on lawsuit hunts. Companies trying to catch this offline computer market will find it harder and harder to be competitive, and will eventually produce sub-par products or give up completely. It's not just hardware. It's software and games too.I made myself sad. I will go out and play in the sun for a bit. Hope my boss does not mind I take my lunch break early.[/citation]


Games are a byproduct of id's business. They are technology innovators, not not game designers. Yes, they produced some classics back in the day, and Quake II is still one of my favorite games--but again, their focus is technology not games.
 
Well, cloud would be a nice idea if there are ways of implementing it today. For instance, you could log into any computer and continue playing your saved game from home, with the gameplay being handled by the servers and then streamed to you.

However, the above would require a massive upgrade to the internet infrastructure - something North America is sorely lacking. Furthermore it would require all ISPs and telecoms to overturn its current stance regarding infrastructure.
 
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