News Chinese-developed nuclear battery has a 50-year lifespan — Betavolt BV100 built with Nickel-63 isotope and diamond semiconductor material

[palladin9479]

Quite a few basic errors in the physics here. "High energy electrons" are beta decay, and are stopped by a single sheet of paper. Your "boron-doped concrete" is for absorbing neutrons or protons, while the lead absorbs gamma (and x-rays) -- but Nickel-63's decay mode doesn't emit these. Beam therapy for cancer treatment can be photons (x-rays), electrons, or protons ... that's why composite shielding is used.

For some people, this is what they think when they read "High Energy Electrons"

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-HmWDdmTAE8&ab_channel=MarcosAguiar

 

[palladin9479]

I have only one question:

Would someone please describe and explain what is meant by a "nuclear/atomic battery" and how it works?

Please be aware that I reserve the right to ask more questions thereafter.

Thank you.

It's kinda simple though the world "atomic / nuclear" cause's folks of freak out. There is a low to medium level radioactive isotype wrapped in a sheath. The materials of that sheath will depend but is matched to the radioactive emissions of the isotope and converts those emissions into electricity. It works in much the same way that solar cells work, only instead of using visible / infrared spectrum radiation it use's whatever wavelength that isotope emits.

It is a "battery" in the sense that the isotopes atomic nuclei, like all nuclei, posses Mass Energy (ME) but is unstable and slowly converting that ME into Electro Magnetic Radiation (EMR) via nuclear decay. Because of how ridiculously energy dense ME is, we can get some pretty crazy lifetimes. The downside is that ME is converted is more of an exponentially slowly scale, it takes X times to convert 50%, it'll take double that time to convert the next 50% remaining (25), then double that to convert the next 50% (12.5%) and so forth. You get half the power output by the time you hit the first half life and it only keeps going down until it's no longer usable.

 

[greenreaper]

Many foods are slightly radioactive (bananas and Brazil nuts are particularly potent)

That's why I always let my bananas decay until the radioactive green is all gone. 🍌

 

[Ralston18]

@palladin9479

Thank you.

Believe me I am not one to freak out over atomic/nuclear.

(No offense taken nor intended. )

= = = =

Throughout the thread I could not help but keep thinking of this:

https://www.physics.uoguelph.ca/lemon-power#:~:text=Surprisingly a potato can produce,(one after the other).

More voltage, shorter lifespan, and the waste products could be eaten as well.

🪫

 

[sauve.richard]

All I can say is, I've played enough Fallout games to know that this is a terrible plan for a battery, no matter what anyone says. Don't use actual freaking science to convince me either way, because it won't work.

 

[Observer12]

Chinese company Betavolt has announced an atomic energy battery for consumers, with a touted 50-year lifespan and which uses a diamond semiconductor material.

Chinese-developed nuclear battery has a 50-year lifespan — Betavolt BV100 built with Nickel-63 isotope and diamond semiconductor material : Read more

Great for medical devices and sensors. Medtronic had a nuclear pacemaker back in the 1960/70s. Iran had a similar effort maybe 12 years or so ago. Nice to see this getting much better.

 

[tsh2222]

Nobody questioning the energy density or power to weight? The last nuclear battery startup was a scam, surely that deserves a mention? I honestly expected slightly better here.

 

[wbfox]

From a country that has never, ever, announced complete and total lies about any sort of tech breakthrough in the past 6 months, comes a break through that the article claims no one has done anything similar to since the 1960s, and certainly not with the exact same materials less than 10 years ago....

https://web.archive.org/web/2020102...ype_nuclear_battery_packs_10_times_more_power

Also total and complete coincidence that it happens to output the exact same power as a recently debunked battery, what are the odds?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M5MF6KE-jY

 

[Gururu]

From a country that has never, ever, announced complete and total lies about any sort of tech breakthrough in the past 6 months, comes a break through that the article claims no one has done anything similar to since the 1960s, and certainly not with the exact same materials less than 10 years ago....

https://web.archive.org/web/2020102...ype_nuclear_battery_packs_10_times_more_power

Also total and complete coincidence that it happens to output the exact same power as a recently debunked battery, what are the odds?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5M5MF6KE-jY

Yes that is a good observation. Also, its hard to find anything more on this specific circumstance in American scientific outlets. There is a not too old article on the potential of nuclear batteries and it doesnt put Ni-63 as a great path for doing it. Could also be that more heavily regulated countries are staying away from consumer solutions.
https://pubs.aip.org/aip/apr/articl...igh-power-direct-energy-conversion-by-nuclear

 

[TheOtherOne]

No thank you, Nickel-63 beta decays into Copper-63 releasing a high energy electron. The same type of high energy electrons I use in Cancer treatment, except I have 2 feet of boron doped concrete and lead in front of me when the electron beam is active (granted there is a huge difference in electron flux between what I use and the small amount in the battery, but I guess DNA damage and mutation is considered worth the risk for this company. And their idea to use strontium-90 in future models is simply insane. Strontium-90 is best known as a component of nuclear bomb fallout….This is just a bad idea for any device humans interact with.

Sounds like perfect recipe for birth of a Superhero. Sign me up for "beta testing"! 😎

 

[gg83]

No thank you, Nickel-63 beta decays into Copper-63 releasing a high energy electron. The same type of high energy electrons I use in Cancer treatment, except I have 2 feet of boron doped concrete and lead in front of me when the electron beam is active (granted there is a huge difference in electron flux between what I use and the small amount in the battery, but I guess DNA damage and mutation is considered worth the risk for this company. And their idea to use strontium-90 in future models is simply insane. Strontium-90 is best known as a component of nuclear bomb fallout….This is just a bad idea for any device humans interact with.

I work with y-90 in Interventional Radiology. It releases beta particles, so only travle a few feet. I wonder if extracting energy from less ionizing radiation. I guess the only place these "batteries" would be good for robots in space.

 

[JeffreyP55]

Chinese company Betavolt has announced an atomic energy battery for consumers, with a touted 50-year lifespan and which uses a diamond semiconductor material.

Chinese-developed nuclear battery has a 50-year lifespan — Betavolt BV100 built with Nickel-63 isotope and diamond semiconductor material : Read more

Ni 63 has a half-life 100.1 years. Half-life doesn't mean half of the life of the radio-nuclide. Spent 34 years in the electronic radiation field. 50 years the Ni63 has not decayed into a stable isotope. So it will be activated a lot longer than 50 years. Maybe ship the crap to Hanford where was waste and radiation devices are stored.
Bad idea from go..

 

[TJ Hooker]

Yes but you are not taking into account the fact that these Ni-63 atoms will be in an ionized state as the battery tech relies on the interactions between an electron hole and the semi-conductor and studies show that negative beta decay is particularly affected by ionization presenting a bound state scenario that promotes the separation of of the neutron into its components and capture of the resulting electron into the 1s, 2s shell. This can bring some Ni-63 atoms within the battery to decay within a month and a half instead of adhering to its “calculated or inferred half-life”

I don't follow as to why the nickel would be ionized. As far as I can tell, the tech relies on the semiconductor absorbing the electron emitted by the nickel beta decay (creating mobile carriers in the semiconductor), I don't see anything about electron holes in the nickel itself. I guess the copper that the nickel decays into would be ionized?

 

[Tanakoi]

50 years the Ni63 has not decayed into a stable isotope. So it will be activated a lot longer than 50 years. Maybe ship the crap to Hanford where was waste and radiation devices are stored.
Bad idea from go..

LOL, the electrons this emits are about as energetic as those from a CRT monitor or television; devices many people spent much of their lives directly in front of. Fears like this are just as irrational as claiming we should stop producing lead-acid batteries, because someone might crack one open and eat the lead plates inside. Worse, actually, as Ni-63 is essentially stable in a few centuries, while that lead remains dangerously toxic for billions upon billions of year. Gasp!

 

[JeffreyP55]

LOL, the electrons this emits are about as energetic as those from a CRT monitor or television; devices many people spent much of their lives directly in front of. Fears like this are just as irrational as claiming we should stop producing lead-acid batteries, because someone might crack one open and eat the lead plates inside. Worse, actually, as Ni-63 is essentially stable in a few centuries, while that lead remains dangerously toxic for billions upon billions of year. Gasp!

It is very easy to shield xray which is what a CRT produces. Ni.63 not sure not so easy. What is the activity of the isotope in the battery? Distance from a CRT is a must. So it is with that stupid battery.

 

[Tanakoi]

Actually high energy electrons can and do penetrate body tissue quite easily within the body, which is why it is used to destroy cancer cells

Missed this earlier, but it demonstrates the dangers of attempting to extend one's knowledge base outside its realm. All electrons are not created equal. The electron beams used in cancer therapy range up to 25MeV, (and they're still only useful for superficial tumors. ) Whereas the electrons emitted by Ni-63 are only 17 KeV (0.017 MeV). Equating the two is like comparing the risk of being hit by a high-speed concrete truck, vs. a slow-walking turtle.

My nuclear chemistry professor taught me a very relevant rule of thumb when it comes to messing with isotopes, it goes like this, “the human physiology has had time to adapt a means to tolerate the radioactive atoms naturally found on Earth, however there are no such mechanisms present to tolerate synthetic isotopes”.

This is quack witch-doctor pseudo-science, sorry. All radioisotopes emit alpha, beta, gamma, or neutrons, and we have a simple, accurate means to equate the relative fluxes and energy-levels to a standardized dose (the roentgen-equivalent man, or (in SI terms) the Gray.

The notion that "synthetic" isotopes are somehow worse than natural ones because we've "evolved to adapt" to radium, thorium, or U-235 would be laughable, were it not outright dangerous. This quack "professor" needs to be fired, then horse-whipped out of town before he gets someone killed.

 

[ex_bubblehead]

And with that it's time to close this. Thank you to all that actually stayed on topic here.