Computer does not always start correctly

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darkpower212

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Apr 12, 2014
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Hello everyone,

I am having an issue with my main system where it does not seem to boot correctly without repeated attempts (usually the first few attempts result in a black screen but fans spin and the hard drive light is flashing).

What’s weird is that when the computer actually boots correctly it runs perfectly fine.

In fact I am writing this post on it right now.

The issue is hard to describe so I have a video of it available here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oxjoKBwi2Q&feature=youtu.be

Some Notes

As you may be able to see in the video, when the computer fails to post one fan blows at its full speed (do not know which fan)

Sometimes some SATA devices are not detected (this has happened very rarely since I built the computer back in December 2012)

I am not sure if it is booting to windows but there is at least some Hard disc activity.

When the computer fails to boot correctly I noticed that the DPI button on my mouse does not work and my keyboard LED's do not turn on.

System specs,

CPU: Intel core I5 3570K

8GB of Corsair vengeance ram

Motherboard: MSI-Z77A-G45 (with latest BIOS)

Video card: Sapphire HD 7770 OC edition

PSU: Corsair builder series 600w fully modular (recently added to replace a dying PSU)

SATA Devices,

Crucial MX100 128GB SDD

1TB WD black

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

:??:
 
Solution
Ironsounds
Hello... Bio's flash is next ( try different revisions )... then RMA ( you pay one way shipping ) is on my list for you.... I have found MB's Bio's that just won't have stable operation... Battery, Flash, RMA or replacement fixed the problem.

*** important *** check your MB Version, it is painted/written on it... there can be version 1, 2, 3, etc... MB's and the proper BIO's or that MB version is required, when searching for the correct DL... the wrong MB BIO's update could have been the problem from the start for you. "struggling to detect all of the system hardware."
Typically... Some type of hardware/chip was changed, ( cost-performance ) between MB versions.
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thanks for your reply

I did save and exit when the boot was successful but I was wondering if the CMOS battery was dead I thought the computer would still boot but would just go to default settings on start?
 
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Hello... it could be saving corrupted data due to low voltage... the MB needs to examine your Hardware and creates a default profile for it... so it doesn't have to examine it each time it is powered on... thats why Clearing CMOs is helpful when changing hardware etc in it, OR trying fix problems with hardware or bad BIO's settings.
 
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Ok thanks I will try replacing the battery.

Is this the correct type of battery?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Panasonic-CR-2032-Lithium-Coin-Battery/dp/B0027XNA6Y/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics-accessories&ie=UTF8&qid=1450127675&sr=1-1&keywords=cr2032
 
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Ok I have now replaced the battery and am still getting the same issue.

I noticed that leaving the computer a while allows to post there for suggesting that it is struggling to detect all of the system hardware.

I have tried swapping the RAM into different channels and trying each stick on its own. I have also tried removing all hard drives yet again all of this has not helped 🙁.

note that I have also removed my video card and still am having the same problem
 
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Did you thoroughly inspect the components/connectors/slots for damage? Any pins look dull or lackluster? Did any pins look misaligned compared to others? (for example sata/video/PCI connector/slot).

I'm pretty sure you have read these or some stuff that said the same thing. It's some of the stuff i've bookmarked while tinkering recently (as in past few months) with HDD vs SDD/M.2, WIN7 vs WIN10. It seems at this point you may need to thoroughly investigate restoring and or reinstalling options.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10
http://www.thewindowsclub.com/windows-cannot-be-installed-to-this-disk
http://www.howtogeek.com/193669/whats-the-difference-between-gpt-and-mbr-when-partitioning-a-drive/
http://www.howtogeek.com/222532/how-to-repair-corrupted-windows-system-files-with-the-sfc-and-dism-commands/
http://www.howtogeek.com/224342/how-to-clean-install-windows-10/
http://www.howtogeek.com/220986/how-to-use-all-of-windows-10%E2%80%99s-backup-and-recovery-tools/
http://www.howtogeek.com/126016/three-ways-to-access-the-windows-8-boot-options-menu/

I don't want to say this, but it might be time to start packing up everything you can onto an external hard drive. Then take a detailed list of all programs from "programs and features" and then check those against what is present in in c:\program files and c:\ programs files (x86). Then Re-do the whole thing fresh. If I can't fix it with integrated windows tools, recover it with backups or bring back up a known working state with a system image I generally say "F***!!!".

Keep investigating, i'd problably just be farting in the wind with anymore advice. I'm more of the preventative maintenance sort of guy not really much on digging way down into these sorts of problems. They way i've got my stuff set up it's just simply faster and simpler to redo it if i've spent more than a few days on it.

 
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Thanks for your reply however it seems clear to me that reinstalling the OS will not help as the system does not even goto the BIOS indicating a POST failure. (this is still the case even with all SATA devices removed).

as for checking for damage. Yes I did check the pins on the memory Modules and the Graphics card however No damage was observable.


 
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That motherboard does not list a dual/selectable/backup UEFI (EDIT> at least not in an integrated and or second physical chip way<EDIT) . I'm not a 100% on any features not listed but that's a fairly notable spec that should be visible on the board or somewhere in the specs.
http://us.msi.com/product/motherboard/Z77AG45.html#hero-specification

This leads me back to boot failure guard or some other quark.

darkpower212, I suggested reinstalling the OS on the extremely unlikely chance (since it was working) that your UEFI decided it didn't want to play with some deep rooted background software/firmware/hardware after a change or update. Possibly something to do with secure boot (maybe I don't know at this point). The only other thing I can think of is that the motherboard and or UEFI IC itself may be failing. In which case, unless you plan to get the exact same motherboard (will more than likely not matter if it's the same) you may have an even greater headache trying to get it to work.

You don't have to try to resurrect your current OS disk though just yet. Assuming that once in the system it works right and you have successfully flashed the most current UEFI. You can try a mock re-do if you want to thoroughly check it.

If possible acquire all UEFI version for you motherboard in an upgrade ready state (refer to MSI for this). A regular blank SATA HDD (either one you are able to do a simple volume format when you can get into the OS or a spare). Also an installation disk or other media of WIN7 or higher (the product key will not matter for this).

The following are i'm sure things you know and have ready done but...

With a known good CMOS bat (which you now have) and the system shutdown (remember antistatic tactics).

1*Switch off the PSU and/or unplug the power cable
2*Allow it to sit a good two minutes
3*Disconnect all cables/wires except for the ATX power, CPU power and system panel header (literally everything else, no USB anything, no PS2 anything, no Ethernet anything, no video cable nothing)
4*Remove ALL hardware and peripherals except for the CPU/Cooler
5*Press and hold the CLR CMOS button for about 10 seconds
6*Remove the bat then put in back in.
7*Reconnect the monitor cable (nothing else yet) and make sure it is in auto detect mode and or set to the type of input you will be connecting to the MB
8*Plug the power cord back into the PSU and/or flip the switch on and wait about 15 seconds
9*Turn the computer on via the power button (like normal)

You should (quickly) get some sort of message alluding to a ram issue (which you would expect), If so...

10*Hold down power button untill it shuts off.
11*Turn the power switch off on the PSU (let sit for 10~20secs)
12* Put a single stick of ram in and refer to *8 and *9

If not...
Try resetting connectors and try again. If it continues to do nothing first try regardless of video over and over you got a MB problem.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You should (quickly) get some sort of message alluding to no bootable media or the like (but nothing about ram), If so..

Refer to *10 and *11

Plug in a keyboard and keyboard only (preferably a PS2 style). Refer to *8 and *9 while pressing F2 (or stated key buy MSI to enter UEFI)

If not...
Systematically try the same single stick in any other slot one buy one until all slots are checked. If still nothing try the same thing with a second stick. If still nothing try both sticks at once in ether the two black slots or the two blue slots or vise/versa. If still nothing you have a RAM and or DIMM slot/interface problem.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You should (quickly) enter the UEFI, If so...

Refer to *10 and *11

Connect up a plain old regular formated and blank HDD, be sure to use SATA port "SATA_0"

If not...
you have a UEFI problem (current suspected problem). At this point attempt to install a different UEFI starting from the initial release and moving up at failed attempts if any (Refer to MSI on how to upgrade/install/flash UEFI). If no options allow you to successfully enter UEFI or UEFI update consistently you have a UEFI chip and or associated controller/hardware problem.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Refer to *8 and *9 while pressing F2 (or stated key buy MSI to enter UEFI)

Make sure the HDD is seen within the UEFI

*13 press reset button

If not...
press reset button again and enter UEFI again to check if it sees it now (may need to do it multiple times). If still nothing try a different SATA cable. If still nothing try a different HDD that does not contained an OS. If still nothing try a different SATA port/s, if still nothing check UEFI settings and try again. If still nothing you have SATA controller problem and or UEFI persistent problem. Try upgrading the next UEFI version as stated in the previous section and try again. If still nothing you have a MB problem.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You should (quickly) get some sort of message alluding to cannot boot from device please insert installation disk or the like, If so..

Refer to *10 and *11

A: Connect up your optical drive and use any other SATA_X port, Refer to *8 and *9, then open the optical drive and insert the installation disk and refer to *13.

B: insert media containing and installation ISO then refer to *8 and 9*

At this point you should get the good old windows is copying files or the like. Attempt to install the selected OS just like you are doing a fresh build and let it go all the way thought. If the installation was successful, the system seems to be stable and you can reliably enter UEFI and change the settings it should be good to go. On a seemingly working system, connect to the internet and be sure to put MS security essentials on it for some minimum protection. Get all the updates (may take a long time and many restarts to complete) and attempt to reinstall various hardware/software where possible and see if you can bring your system back up to a "clean working state".

If you can essentially bring your computer back to where it was, then you may need to thoroughly investigate reset and or reinstall options as before mentioned for the original OS disk.

If not...
You potentially have a user end unidentifiable problem that will require the systematic replacement of what cannot be confirmed to work properly (such as the motherboard and subsequently a re install of the OS).
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I "think" I got all of that in the right order but i've done this so many times over the years it's hard to actually list it out in a logical order. Good luck.
 
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Hello... Bio's flash is next ( try different revisions )... then RMA ( you pay one way shipping ) is on my list for you.... I have found MB's Bio's that just won't have stable operation... Battery, Flash, RMA or replacement fixed the problem.

*** important *** check your MB Version, it is painted/written on it... there can be version 1, 2, 3, etc... MB's and the proper BIO's or that MB version is required, when searching for the correct DL... the wrong MB BIO's update could have been the problem from the start for you. "struggling to detect all of the system hardware."
Typically... Some type of hardware/chip was changed, ( cost-performance ) between MB versions.
 
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Solution


OK i will try re flashing :)
 
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