[SOLVED] CPU performing way below expectations

[GabeyLeBaby]

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/19651500

I just upgraded from an i3-6100 to an i7-7700 and I am not really seeing any change. After using cinebench i got a result of about 880 and my user bench mark score is quite bad aswell. I have updated my bios for my motherboard to support kabylake and im not sure what to do now. I have not performed a clean install of windows and would prefer to use that as a last resort. Any further information can be provided, thanks

 

[PC Tailor]

Welcome to the forums my friend!

I have not performed a clean install of windows and would prefer to use that as a last resort.

There is a thread a bunch of us have just answered regarding this exact same problem that you may want to consider: https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/ryzen-3600x-poor-perfomance.3517765/
So unfortunately a clean install may be necessary.

Also ae you having any problems outside of just benchmarks? I always take benchmarks with a very heavy pinch of salt. Have you checked if you've gotten gains in your normal usage?

One thing I have noticed is your boost clock is way down, have you modified any BIOS or power settings?
Do you have latest MB/ Chipset drivers?
What is the rest of your system spec (PSU make and model)?
What temperatures are you reaching under load?

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Welcome to the forums my friend!


There is a thread a bunch of us have just answered regarding this exact same problem that you may want to consider: https://forums.tomshardware.com/threads/ryzen-3600x-poor-perfomance.3517765/
So unfortunately a clean install may be necessary.

Also ae you having any problems outside of just benchmarks? I always take benchmarks with a very heavy pinch of salt. Have you checked if you've gotten gains in your normal usage?

One thing I have noticed is your boost clock is way down, have you modified any BIOS or power settings?
Do you have latest MB/ Chipset drivers?
What is the rest of your system spec (PSU make and model)?
What temperatures are you reaching under load?

Thanks for the quick reply, I'm not sure on my boost clock or on how to change it and I have not modified any BIOS or power settings except setting power settings to high performance.

I installed my latest BIOS for my motherboard earlier today after realising it only supported skylake and my new CPU was kabylake. Not sure if chipset drivers are different but I also downloaded a general intel chipset driver from MSI aswell (there wasnt specific versions just one download)

My PSU is an EVGA 430w which after my research I concluded I would have enough power for my components but I may have been wrong so please do correct me if so.

Temperature wise would you suggest an application for this as I dont actively monitor them so I wouldn't know where to go to see them.

Thanks!

 

[PC Tailor]

My PSU is an EVGA 430w which after my research I concluded I would have enough power for my components but I may have been wrong so please do correct me if so.

Problem is not quantity, it's quality. As point 1 explains here: https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...when-selecting-parts-for-a-custom-pc.3510178/ and unfortunately EVGA make a ton of poor quality PSUs.

I wouldn't necessarily expect a PSU problem to present in this way, but it can.

Temperature wise would you suggest an application for this as I dont actively monitor them so I wouldn't know where to go to see them.

HWInfo.

have you enabled High Performance mode in your windows power settings too?
unfortunately, not performing a clean install can cause a wealth of problems, and it is best practice, as there can be lots of residual modules in the background causing conflicts with the new hardware and firmware.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Problem is not quantity, it's quality. As point 1 explains here: https://forums.tomshardware.com/thr...when-selecting-parts-for-a-custom-pc.3510178/ and unfortunately EVGA make a ton of poor quality PSUs.

I wouldn't necessarily expect a PSU problem to present in this way, but it can.


HWInfo.

have you enabled High Performance mode in your windows power settings too?
unfortunately, not performing a clean install can cause a wealth of problems, and it is best practice, as there can be lots of residual modules in the background causing conflicts with the new hardware and firmware.

Oh that was where I enabled high performance mode (in windows), the only thing I have done in the BIOS is updated it. I can fresh install windows its just going to be quite annoying to reinstall games so if nothing else works that is an option. My power supply has been working for 2 years now I think with no noticeable problems from me but I will keep faulty power supply a possibility. I will post an update with temps in a minute.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Oops my temperatures are a bit scary

https://imgur.com/a/7gYWeru

View: https://imgur.com/a/7gYWeru

 

[PC Tailor]

Oops my temperatures are a bit scary

https://imgur.com/a/7gYWeru

View: https://imgur.com/a/7gYWeru

That would explain the turbo boost drop.
CPU is thermal throttling to prevent damage.

What CPU cooler are you using?
I'd try resitting the cooler effectively.
What are you ambient (room) temps?

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

I'm using the cooler I have just received with the i7 so the stock. A friend has just told me the i7 stock cooler is terrible and it may be worth using my old i3 cooler. I am getting thermal paste tomorrow which i can apply either way. I'm not sure how I would resit the cooler and it is currently very hot in my room, currently in England where we are having very hot weather, unfortunately I do not know my exact temperature. ALSO, the results were exactly the same when I first put in the i7 and tested, though I am not sure how fast CPUs heat up so i dont know if this will change anything.

 

[PC Tailor]

A friend has just told me the i7 stock cooler is terrible and it may be worth using my old i3 cooler.

Not necessarily - not sure what TDP cooler the i3 comes with. That and you'll probably find the i3 won't make a difference unless it's TDP was higher rated.

Is that 100 degrees under load?
I'd sooner put my bets that the cooler isn't seated adequately. Any stock cooler shouldn't lead to temperatures that high.

The other problem is you say it is very hot in the room, remember every degree you are over testing environment temperatures, you'll be a degree hotter. In Intel manufacturing, they're typically tested at around 22 degrees - if your room is say, 26 - then you'll see at least 4+ degrees in your environment.

Admittedly the Intel stock coolers aren't great - but they're still made for purpose, so it shouldn't be leading to 100 degrees unless something else was at play.

I'm also UK - I feel the burn too!

I am getting thermal paste tomorrow which i can apply either way

You have thermal paste on currently right?
Either way the actual thermal paste you use won't make much of a difference, how it's applied and how the seater is secured does however. Some people use toothpaste for thermal paste - just replace it more often.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Not necessarily - not sure what TDP cooler the i3 comes with. That and you'll probably find the i3 won't make a difference unless it's TDP was higher rated.

Is that 100 degrees under load?
I'd sooner put my bets that the cooler isn't seated adequately. Any stock cooler shouldn't lead to temperatures that high.

The other problem is you say it is very hot in the room, remember every degree you are over testing environment temperatures, you'll be a degree hotter. In Intel manufacturing, they're typically tested at around 22 degrees - if your room is say, 26 - then you'll see at least 4+ degrees in your environment.

Admittedly the Intel stock coolers aren't great - but they're still made for purpose, so it shouldn't be leading to 100 degrees unless something else was at play.

I'm also UK - I feel the burn too!


You have thermal paste on currently right?
Either way the actual thermal paste you use won't make much of a difference, how it's applied and how the seater is secured does however. Some people use toothpaste for thermal paste - just replace it more often.

Quite embarrassing but no, I have not put on any thermal paste myself but understand that it apparently does come with some on the fan, not sure though. When I put in my CPU cooler I pressed quite hard to the point I thought I might actually break it so stopped but only 1 or 2 pins actually clicked. I tried pressing them all more but nothing would click. The fan is definitely spinning and it is standing upright and has not fallen from the MOBO onto the GPU (few).

EDIT - Sorry forgot to say, my computer is currently running whatever it would normally run with a couple utility applications open such as task manager and system information, also iCUE software. But is also running Rainbow Six Siege which is quite a large game.

 

[PC Tailor]

Quite embarrassing but no, I have not put on any thermal paste myself but understand that it apparently does come with some on the fan, not sure though

Well you absolutely NEED thermal paste. However I would imagine some should have come with the stock cooler.

but only 1 or 2 pins actually clicked. I tried pressing them all more but nothing would click.

There you probably have it - unfortunately it needs to be fully seated, and some pins not fully securing can EASILY cause the temperature problems you are having (understand you tried hard, sometimes it is difficult - but has to be done) may be worth checking if there is anything preventing them from being secured, but they do absolutely need to be fully secured.

In effect the heatsink and CPU is a quite a delicate combination with the thermal paste - the thermal paste acts as an excellent conduit for the heat to rapidly transfer to the heat sink, and also helps cover any potential air pockets, in order to achieve this, the cooler also has to sit flush and with some pressure to the CPU, again, you prevent potential air pockets for example - otherwise the thermal performance is severely detrimented.

I would identify why the cooler wasn't securing, but try your best to secure it. The intel ones can be a nightmare I know, but a cooler that isn't fully secure easily leads to the problem you're facing unfortunately!

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Well you absolutely NEED thermal paste. However I would imagine some should have come with the stock cooler.


There you probably have it - unfortunately it needs to be fully seated, and some pins not fully securing can EASILY cause the temperature problems you are having (understand you tried hard, sometimes it is difficult - but has to be done) may be worth checking if there is anything preventing them from being secured, but they do absolutely need to be fully secured.

In effect the heatsink and CPU is a quite a delicate combination with the thermal paste - the thermal paste acts as an excellent conduit for the heat to rapidly transfer to the heat sink, and also helps cover any potential air pockets, in order to achieve this, the cooler also has to sit flush and with some pressure to the CPU, again, you prevent potential air pockets for example - otherwise the thermal performance is severely detrimented.

I would identify why the cooler wasn't securing, but try your best to secure it. The intel ones can be a nightmare I know, but a cooler that isn't fully secure easily leads to the problem you're facing unfortunately!

Ok, thank you very much for your continued support! Unfortunately I will have to apply thermal paste and attempt a remount of the cooler tomorrow as it is late but ill be sure to update my status after I have done these things tomorrow.

Thank you very much for helping me pinpoint this issue! Feel quite stupid that I didn't check my temperatures lol.

 

[PC Tailor]

Ok, thank you very much for your continued support! Unfortunately I will have to apply thermal paste and attempt a remount of the cooler tomorrow as it is late but ill be sure to update my status after I have done these things tomorrow.

Thank you very much for helping me pinpoint this issue! Feel quite stupid that I didn't check my temperatures lol.

Don't feel stupid at all - we all start somewhere, and when we've started we all make mistakes or miss things. All. The. Time.

Happy to help my friend.

 

[Phaaze88]

@GabeyLeBaby When you reinstall the Intel stock cooler, do it diagonally, or in a 'X' formation.
Top-left pin and bottom-right pin at the same time - make sure they CLICK.
Then do the same with the other two.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Don't feel stupid at all - we all start somewhere, and when we've started we all make mistakes or miss things. All. The. Time.

Happy to help my friend.

@GabeyLeBaby When you reinstall the Intel stock cooler, do it diagonally, or in a 'X' formation.
Top-left pin and bottom-right pin at the same time - make sure they CLICK.
Then do the same with the other two.

Thank you both, I just refitted the cooler and managed to get three pins to click so that I could hear and feel the click, the fourth had an audible click like noise but no feel, no matter how hard I pushed after that it would not click. I booted my computer and found my idle temps to be around 50c-65c. While this is better, is it good?

I also re-benchmarked and saw an improvement I had not before, https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/19663253 .

https://imgur.com/a/javqX1W

View: https://imgur.com/a/javqX1W

 

[PC Tailor]

65 idle is still high.
50 idle is reasonable.

Is it prolonged at that temperature or just random spikes?
The turbo boost is now there - however looks to me like there is still thermal throttling or power saving settings in place - I'd expect another 0.2GHz out of the 7700 based on how userbenchmark records things, not every core may boost to 4.2 - but userbench usually shows it.

However it does show you had lots of background CPU usage, so you'll want to clear that up as far as possible before retesting to see.

Easiest way to test would be to check the temperatures under load - if you start reaching 85+ degrees- then it's something to look at.

What's air flow like in your case?

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

65 idle is still high.
50 idle is reasonable.

Is it prolonged at that temperature or just random spikes?
The turbo boost is now there - however looks to me like there is still thermal throttling or power saving settings in place - I'd expect another 0.2GHz out of the 7700 based on how userbenchmark records things, not every core may boost to 4.2 - but userbench usually shows it.

However it does show you had lots of background CPU usage, so you'll want to clear that up as far as possible before retesting to see.

Easiest way to test would be to check the temperatures under load - if you start reaching 85+ degrees- then it's something to look at.

What's air flow like in your case?

My PC case is quite large with big pockets of empty space inside, I think it has a total of 4 case fans (3 at front 1 at back) and the CPU fan. My case is placed ontop of my desk so airflow should be ok. When refitting the cooler I noticed the thermal paste had not spread like it had on the i3 and this was because it was not mounted correctly (i think) as most of it was still on the fan with a few small drops on the CPU, I say this because im not sure how long it will take if it is now correctly mounted to spread the thermal paste from the fan. Currently i'm idling around 50c, when playing a game I saw it go to about 70-75. After closing the game it fluctuated between 50-70 until just now staying around 50 every time I check (this is with no game open)

Edit- 50c is idling with 1-4% load

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/19663675

after closing all open applications (including my temperature monitor so I could get my best results)

Quite happy that it is now definitely a temperature issue and not hardware. After the benchmark I opened the monitoring software and found it was back to 50c idle.

 

[PC Tailor]

Looks like the CPU is operating much more normally now.
Whilst I'm not a fan of benchmarks, they do help point out obvious elements, and the GPU seems low. Userbench does compare it against overclocked units, but the fact remains.

Have you monitored GPU temps too (I may be covering old ground).
This could also be where a poor PSU can have a bigger effect.

 

[mitch074]

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/19663675

after closing all open applications (including my temperature monitor so I could get my best results)

Quite happy that it is now definitely a temperature issue and not hardware. After the benchmark I opened the monitoring software and found it was back to 50c idle.

That's heat throttling taken care of, now you still have to find why it runs with sub-par performance. After you updated your BIOS, it must have reverted to factory settings - make sure you've loaded XMP settings, as it is your RAM isn't running at full speed - you have a 1066 MHz (2133 double data rate) RAM clock reported, this kit should report something like 1500 MHz (3000 double data rate) - as it is, you're cutting off 33% of your RAM performance - which, overall, can lead to your system running 5-20% slower than it should.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

Looks like the CPU is operating much more normally now.
Whilst I'm not a fan of benchmarks, they do help point out obvious elements, and the GPU seems low. Userbench does compare it against overclocked units, but the fact remains.

Have you monitored GPU temps too (I may be covering old ground).
This could also be where a poor PSU can have a bigger effect.

Whilst I have not been actively monitoring the GPU like I have the CPU I did occasionally glance over and saw also about 50c idle. Whilst the CPU and motherboard was overheating yesterday the GPU kept its cool all the same. Right now its 50c with the fan turning itself off and on. My 1060 came factory overclocked (not sure how much). Though I did not buy it from this website, relatively sure this is my model - https://www.overclockers.co.uk/evga...PvJnXMaVhF9boTcJfVKfLZPPg-q_0XnRoCmhsQAvD_BwE

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

That's heat throttling taken care of, now you still have to find why it runs with sub-par performance. After you updated your BIOS, it must have reverted to factory settings - make sure you've loaded XMP settings, as it is your RAM isn't running at full speed - you have a 1066 MHz (2133 double data rate) RAM clock reported, this kit should report something like 1500 MHz (3000 double data rate) - as it is, you're cutting off 33% of your RAM performance - which, overall, can lead to your system running 5-20% slower than it should.

Thanks for the reply, what are XMP settings and how would I enabled these?

 

[Phaaze88]

XMP is not possible on your H110M motherboard.
That's a feature for Z-series mobos. The ram is stuck with 2133mhz.

 

[GabeyLeBaby]

XMP is not possible on your H110M motherboard.
That's a feature for Z-series mobos. The ram is stuck with 2133mhz.

Oh okay, thanks anyway

 

[mitch074]

XMP is not possible on your H110M motherboard.
That's a feature for Z-series mobos. The ram is stuck with 2133mhz.

Ah - I thought Z only unlocked CPU overclock. I didn't think Intel would be dumb enough to lock RAM clocks too on lower tier chipsets. Happy I went with AMD.