Question DELETE key has a strange problem and it's not in the keyboard ?

[RangerBobM]

I've got a bizarre problem with the DELETE key in my Windows 11 system: it works correctly in some situations, but not in others. The problem is definitely not with the keyboard itself; I've swapped in several keyboards and the problem occurs with all of them.

Here's what I'm dealing with:

• DEL won't delete text in any program I use- word processors, simple text editors, email clients, anything. I've tried any program I have and it's always the same thing.
• DEL won't delete files in any file manager I've tried.

However,

• CTRL-ALT-DEL works fine.
• Tapping the DEL key when booting gets into the BIOS.
• Strangest of all, when editing text, CTRL-DEL will delete the next word, even though DEL by itself won't delete characters.

Here's what I've tried:

• Tested with three different keyboards.
• Uninstalled every keyboard that showed up in Device Manager, then rebooted.
• Installed the latest keyboard firmware.
• Consulted the keyboard manufacturer's support line and they couldn't help.

None of that helped. The only other step I can think of is reinstalling Windows and hoping that fixes things. Does anyone have an idea what else I can try? Thanks for any help or advice.

System:

• OS: Windows 11
• CPU: AMD Ryzen 9 7950X
• RAM: 64 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-5600
• PSU: Corsair RM850X
• MOBO: MSI MagB650 Tomahawk WiFi Gaming
• GPU: Asus DUAL OC GeForce RTX 4070 Ti Super
• Usual Keyboard: Das Keyboard Pro w Cherry MX Blue

 

[Aeacus]

DEL won't delete text in any program I use- word processors, simple text editors, email clients, anything. I've tried any program I have and it's always the same thing.

Just for conformation;

When you have blinking cursor at the end of the text and press Del, nothing will happen since Del deletes stuff right from the blinking cursor. Backspace is the one that deletes text left from the blinking cursor.

So, is your blinking cursor on the correct spot?

Another thing to try;
When in text editor (will not work in TH reply area but does work in Wordpad), is when you have blinking cursor somewhere in the middle of the text and you then press Insert once, and then start typing, the letters right from the text (blinking cursor) are deleted as you type. Letters are essentially replaced with what you're typing.
(Usage of this function feels creepy to me.) Pressing Insert again will disable that strange feature.

DEL won't delete files in any file manager I've tried.

Try this command to delete: Shift + Delete.
Look if it works.

If it does, then something is wrong with Recycle Bin in your Win11.
Delete = Sending files to Recycle Bin.
Shift + Delete = Outright deletion of files (no take backs).

 

[RangerBobM]

Thanks for your help!

Just for conformation;

When you have blinking cursor at the end of the text and press Del, nothing will happen since Del deletes stuff right from the blinking cursor. Backspace is the one that deletes text left from the blinking cursor.

So, is your blinking cursor on the correct spot?

Another thing to try;
When in text editor (will not work in TH reply area but does work in Wordpad), is when you have blinking cursor somewhere in the middle of the text and you then press Insert once, and then start typing, the letters right from the text (blinking cursor) are deleted as you type. Letters are essentially replaced with what you're typing. (Usage of this function feels creepy to me.) Pressing Insert again will disable that strange feature.

Thanks, but I've known the difference between Delete and Backspace since MS-DOS days, same with insert and typeover modes. I wish the answer was simple as that. Same thing with DEL and SHIFT-DEL. (I do understand why you asked, and I appreciate the fact that you did.)

Thanks again.

Bob

 

[Aeacus]

Thanks, but I've known the difference between Delete and Backspace since MS-DOS days, same with insert and typeover modes. I wish the answer was simple as that. Same thing with DEL and SHIFT-DEL. (I do understand why you asked, and I appreciate the fact that you did.)

Well, you described your issue and didn't say what other methods you've tried or if you have more in-depth knowledge than basic user. So, me without knowing that, i tried to help out (since there are people out there who overlook obvious things or doesn't have enough knowledge).

What changed in the system when the issues appeared? Since i don't think this issue was present from the get-go. (Or was it?)
New installed application? Win update? Something else? Because issue is clearly software and not hardware.

 

[RangerBobM]

I'm at a loss. I built this system last November, and everything was working fine until this happened roughly a week ago. Nothing in particular changed in the system that I'm aware of, but just in case I tried a Windows system rollback to an earlier date. Also, as I mentioned in my original post, I checked out three different keyboards; uninstalled every keyboard that showed up in Device Manager and rebooted each time; updated the firmware on my usual keyboard; and consulted that keyboard manufacturer's support line. None of this changed anything. It's gotta be something in the system, not the keyboard, and it's driving me nuts trying to figure out what it is.

Again-- I really do appreciate your help, so I hope I'm not sounding ungrateful.

 

[Aeacus]

and it's driving me nuts trying to figure out what it is.

Windows works in mysterious ways. 🥷

Trial-and-error method eventually, may find the culprit. But it's like looking a small needle in a BIG haystack. And even then, when all resources are exhausted and still nothing, the remaining 1% is always reserved for the ghost in the machine.

I've seen my fare share of Windows anomalies, including hardware anomalies.
Since no explanation can be given as of why it happened, i've classified such events under "ghost in the machine" term. Aka unexplained phenomena.

Spoiler: Optional read: One of my very own ghosts in the machine (click here to read)

I've had unexplained phenomena with my build. And to this date, i, nor anyone else, have been able to get to the bottom of it.

When i 1st bought the parts of my Skylake build (full specs with pics in my sig), i had MSI GTX 1060 Gaming X 3G GPU and for few months, all of it was powered by Seasonic S12II-520 80+ Bronze (best group-regulated PSU ever made).
MSI had dedicated software for the GPU: MSI Gaming App, from where i was able to control the GPU LED and also fan profiles. One of the options was "cooling boost" (or similar named), where the idea was, that software puts the GPU fans at 100% for additional cooling for ~5 seconds, after which, fans wind down to previous RPMs.

But for me, GPU fans remained 100% after selecting that option from MSI Gaming App.
So, when i restarted the system, it caused the GPU fans to ramp up almost to the max and stay at ~80%. Build worked fine otherwise.
3rd restart and now, GPU fans ramped up and stayed at ~60%.
4th restart and GPU fans spin even slower at fixed speeds, ~40% or so. And so forth.
Took me 6 restarts until GPU fans stopped completely and GPU fans worked like it was supposed to (if GPU below 60C, fans RPM is 0).

And it wasn't isolated incident. Every time i did the "cooling boost" from MSI Gaming App, GPU fans were fixed at certain RPM, which dropped gradually with each restart of the PC. I was able to reliably reproduce the issue every single time.

Few months onwards, bought new PC case and PSU: Seasonic PRIME 650 80+Titanium [SSR-650TD]. After system swap and powered by new PSU, the "cooling boost" did work exactly as it was said on the tin - GPU fans ramped up to 100% and after 5 seconds, back to normal. No issues what-so-ever.

I can't even fathom how it was possible, but it was. I've classified it under "ghost in the machine"/"unexplained phenomena" label.

Fastest and easiest fix for you would be clean Win install. That is, if you aren't hell-bent on getting to the bottom of this and figuring out what is going on.

Again-- I really do appreciate your help, so I hope I'm not sounding ungrateful.

It's fine. Since i too doesn't have any good suggestions of what to try. Your issue is so obscure and difficult to figure out from where to even start. I haven't even heard anything like that before, in ~30 years i've dealt with PC hardware issues. But such obscure issues are actually intriguing for me.

Shooting in the dark here;
You've tested several different KBs, but have you also tried out every single USB port on your MoBo, where to plug the KB in? Both the back I/O ones and front panel ones? (Since you haven't said anything about it, hence the question.)

But how about malware? Have you done AV scans? (E.g MalwareBytes free version.)

Sadly, no PS/2 port on your MoBo, so can't try PS/2 KB out.

Oh, another idea;
Does the issue happen also when you boot into Safe Mode?
Since that would narrow things down quite a bit, if system (Del key) works fine in Safe Mode.

 

[ARICH5]

Just to clarify. You tried 3 different keyboards and the delete doesnt work in any of them?

 

[kerberos_20]

open on-screen keyboard, try delete key there (can be enabled in taskbar settings - touch keyboard)
does it work?

if yes, install app monitoring your key presses, confirm that delete key is sending correct hexcode (0x2E in windows), or app shows that only delete key was pressed (depends on app you choose)

but my guess is that you have key remapper installed

 

[Moonstick2]

A key remapper is also my first guess. The Del key gets detected in BIOS and combinations, just not when it's run on its own. A Windows installation would fix it, but that feels like a last resort.

Question is how it got remapped. Have you got PowerToys installed? If you have, open Remap Keyboard and see what's in there. Or something else like software that came with the keyboard maybe?

Or it could just somehow be a registry entry that's got inserted or corrupted somehow. You know what, the thing I'd do is install a simple keyboard mapper like SharpKeys or PowerToys for its mapper and try mapping the DEL key to delete. See if that can resolve the issue.

 

[Nigel Spike]

Full size keyboards with numeric keypad have two delete keys. The second is the decimal point key on the numerical keypad, and when Num Lock is off, it works as a delete key. Does this key have the same behavior?

 

[RangerBobM]

Just to clarify. You tried 3 different keyboards and the delete doesnt work in any of them?

Yes- that's why I think the problem is in the system, not the keyboard.

 

[RangerBobM]

Thank you everyone for all your advice. In fact I do have SharpKeys installed to disable CAPSLOCK and INS, so I'm going to try uninstalling the program right now. I'll come back and let everyone know if it works.

Again, thank you all very much.

 

[RangerBobM]

Well, poop. I uninstalled SharpKeys, rebooted, and that didn't fix the problem either. I had such high hopes!

 

[RangerBobM]

Full size keyboards with numeric keypad have two delete keys. The second is the decimal point key on the numerical keypad, and when Num Lock is off, it works as a delete key. Does this key have the same behavior?

Very interesting! I tried your suggestion, and I'm having the same problem with the keypad DEL key. NUMLOCK off, press the decimal point key, nothing happens.

 

[SkyNetRising]

Very interesting! I tried your suggestion, and I'm having the same problem with the keypad DEL key.
NUMLOCK off, press the decimal point key, nothing happens.

Suspect keylogger.
Scan your pc for malware.

Also - try del key behavior in safe mode.

 

[Aeacus]

NUMLOCK off, press the decimal point key, nothing happens.

While Del on KB doesn't work, but can you delete files via context menu?

E.g;
* right-click on any file in file explorer (context menu appears)
* left-click on "Delete".

Does system Deletes the file? If not, there very well could be malware in works, that blocks any file deletion (including itself) by user input.

 

[RangerBobM]

While Del on KB doesn't work, but can you delete files via context menu?

E.g;
* right-click on any file in file explorer (context menu appears)
* left-click on "Delete".

Does system Deletes the file? If not, there very well could be malware in works, that blocks any file deletion (including itself) by user input.

Thanks-- I checked and that works the way it's supposed to.

 

[RangerBobM]

Suspect keylogger.
Scan your pc for malware.

Also - try del key behavior in safe mode.

Interesting development: I ran a full Malwarebytes scan and that reported nothing suspicious.

Then I downloaded Bitdefender and activated the subscription. (I had been relying in Windows Defender.) Clicked "Full system scan" and after a moment I got an error message: "Bitdefender has encountered a problem. If this persists, etc. etc." I shut down and rebooted and tried it again, same error message.

This seems pretty suspicious so I'm running a full system scan with Windows Defender now and waiting to see the results in a couple of hours.

 

[RangerBobM]

Update: I got BitDefender working after a couple more tries, and after running all night I got the results: no viruses on the machine. That's good news, of course, but it still doesn't bring me any closer to an answer to my question. I'll probably just bite the bullet and reinstall Windows in a few days, when I have more time.

Thanks again to everyone for their helpful suggestions.

 

[LinuxDevice]

It sounds like your key bindings changed. One way of changing key bindings which is not how one would normally think of this as a key binding is to change part of your PC's character set and localization. I don't know on Windows how to change this, but you should very closely look at your "internationalization", "language", and keyboard layout schema. Most users here are UTF-8 character sets, and the majority are "en_US.UTF-8" when including localization (a combination of character set and which of the many UTF-8 glyphs to use).

For reference, UTF-8 is like an 8-bit window which can overlay a lot of character sets. One has a numeric index into a character set, and this fixes the meaning of the character. Depending on if this en_US or British or Australian, this can change slightly, but mostly this overlaps with the old ASCII set. Then you start getting into some other optional characters, e.g., the french l`aigu. Depending on which 8-bit set the language places the UTF-8 template over you might get different meaning (e.g., French with an accent mark versus USA English). UTF-16, which includes kanji characters, simplified Chinese, traditional Chinese, Korean, so on, has far less overlap.

The keyboard goes through a serial UART. It does not say "this is the delete key". What it does is to give a scan code for a key down event, or a key up event. Since booting and going into BIOS works, and since several keyboards work to do this, it seems your keyboard is working. That keyboard is in fact sending the correct scan codes and key up/down events. All that is left is how to interpret those keys.

If that key is to be interpreted as something like the letter 'x', then this is because the table for converting scan codes to an index in the character set points at that meaning. This conversion is apparently incorrect in Windows for you. Maybe it thinks this is a different keyboard layout (e.g., not 101 key QWERTY), or maybe it correctly knows layout, but the table points the conversion between the DEL key scan code and its place in the character set table to something that isn't DEL. Or something else has caught the DEL key down/up events, and not passing it on.

About passing on key events: If you are in a program like Microsoft Word, and somewhere off to the side you have the File Explorer open, then when in File Explorer the F5 key would refresh the list of files. If you were instead in MS Word, and hit F5, the File Explorer app would not refresh. Each application is catching the key events so they don't fall through and become visible to other apps. Something like CTRL-ALT-DEL does fall through, and no app can catch that. So not only could the table of characters somehow be wrong, and not only could the language bindings pick some incorrect meaning, it is also possible that an application could catch that key and keep it from propagating to anywhere else. This is the least likely. My bets are on character set or language localization.

If your delete key sends out the correct scan code (and we know it does), check very very closely for any setting about keyboard layout, character set, or language chosen. Less likely, but also possible, some program might be catching the key binding.

 

[RangerBobM]

It sounds like your key bindings changed. One way of changing key bindings which is not how one would normally think of this as a key binding is to change part of your PC's character set and localization. I don't know on Windows how to change this, but you should very closely look at your "internationalization", "language", and keyboard layout schema. Most users here are UTF-8 character sets, and the majority are "en_US.UTF-8" when including localization (a combination of character set and which of the many UTF-8 glyphs to use). ...

....

OMG, wow! THANK YOU for this detailed response. I really appreciate the way you walked me though the whole process. I 'm going to study it carefully, and reexamine the problem in light of what I've learned from this message.

Again, thank you very much.

 

[Ralston18]

Also:

Go to System > Accessiblity > Keyboard

Many end user configuration settings available.

Take a look for anything that may not be as expected.

Check through other sets of Accessibility options as well.

 

[RangerBobM]

Also:

Go to System > Accessiblity > Keyboard

Many end user configuration settings available.

Take a look for anything that may not be as expected.

Check through other sets of Accessibility options as well.

Thanks-- will do!