Dell Precision T5400 Quad CPU 3.0Ghz vs. Dual Xeon 5520 Quad core

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widget37355

Commendable
Jun 12, 2016
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Hello all! Thanks in advance, this is my first post :)

Looking at cheap entry-level rigs for some gaming. Have a couple options on my local CL. Goal is to be able run Battlefront or similar shooter.

$130 - "Dell Desktop with Xeon 5450 Quad core CPU, 2 Graphic one with dual DVI outputs other dual displayport, 8 Gig DDR2 Memory installed has 8 slots for memory, Windows 10 activated Pro 64 clean install no bloatware on a 160 Gig SATA HD, 850 Watt power supply, CD/DVD read/write drive"

VERSUS

$170 - "Dell Desktop with Dual Xeon 5520 Quad core CPU's 8 total cores, 2 Graphic card one with dual DVI outputs other is dual Display ports 16 Gig DDR3 Memory installed has 8 slots for memory, Windows 10 activated Pro 64 clean install no bloatware on a 750 Gig SATA HD, has room for 3 more, 850 Watt power supply, CD/DVD read/write drive"

Just hoping for advice on the best starting point. I open to spending up to another $200 on a video card, RAM, or etc to be able to play Battlefront level games, hopefully.

Any advice is fully appreciated. I'm looking forward to digging in to one of these two...


Thanks in advance for your time/knowledge,
Newb
 
First thing, late model AMD video cards won't display the old dell BIOS screen which uses VESA mode 103. HD 6xxx,HD7xxx are OK . R series (GCN) won't.
Dell t3400 with single CPU supports CORE2 Extreme and can be software overclocked. The only C2X that can run dual CPU are the QX97xx chips (basically unlocked 400fsb XEONs) very rare and expensive. Other than that you're locked into 5 series XEONs.Find out if they have EUFI, or legacy BIOS your video card will have to match. I don't know what 2 CPUs will do for you. There were some Intel Skulltrail dual CPU motherboards a few years ago. Maybe Google some reviews on those. Determine what kind of memory they need. They might require ECC, buffered, or both. If they have ECC even if they support normal RAM you will have to get rid of the ECC to use it. Go to Dell's website and read the owners manuals. General computer knowledge will not suffice. T3400 single CPU 2 video slots might be a better place to start. It takes normal CPUs and normal memory modules (but supports ECC so may come with that). Newegg had some $116 with$4 shipping. I have no experience with 2 CPUs so maybe someone else can say more about this. But Dells can be tricky, especially workstations ans servers which can be different than PCs in many ways.
 


widget37355,

Buying locally is attractive, but the choices are limited and in the examples mentioned, neither is very promising for gaming. I have a Dell Precision T5400 (2X Xeon X5460 (4-core @ 3.16GHz) / 16GB DDR2-667 ECC / Quadro FX4800, 2X WD RE4) and while these systems are beautifully built, have big power supplies, a lot of expansion slots, are quiet and ultra-reliable, they were made for content creation, precision, and reliability. They were designed just for a different purpose.

Games are single-threaded and don't benefit from all those cores. The Xeon X5450 4-core @ 3.0GHz has an average Passmark rating of 4243 ( and a single threaded performance of 1275. The Xeon E5520 2.27GHz scores 4451 and single-threaded is 1024. That's would have been a very good server CPU at the time, but is not suitable for gaming today.

You might consider one of the 1000's of Dell Optiplex with an i5 2nd generation. For example:

Dell OptiPlex 990 MT PC Computer, Intel Core i5-2500 3.30GHz, 4GB > sold for $125

No HD, but these are well made. Importantly, these use up to 16GB DDR3-1333- twice the speed of the DDR2 and cooler running. The i5-2500 4-core @ 3.33GHz has an average Passmark rating of 6236 and a single threaded performance of 1869- which is still good today. To that system add a 120-128GB SSD for $60, +4GB RAM, and a used GTX 770 and for a reasonable sum have a good gaming system.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

 
I agree with the above except DDR3-1333 is nowhere near twice as fast as DDR2-800. If you search DDR2 vs. DDR3 you will find tests done when DDR3 came out that show DDR2-800 eqauls DDR3-1066. DDR3 has higher latency than DDR2, and the faster you run any memory the more you lose to latency. So those 2 factors combine to make the sperformance scaling not what it would seem. There are low latency DDR3 modules available now. But in the world of old Dell computers with locked BIOS they won't do you any good, and might not run at all. PC2-8500 is much faster than PC3-8500. They came up with those "theoretical ratings" to make DDR3 look faster than it was. Those numbers ignore latency completely. Also for gaming if you have a GPU with 2GB or more DDR5 the system memory speed is not very important. I've seen a test where DDR2-1066 was 2% faster than DDR3-1333. When DDR3 came out it was slower than DDR2. Until you get up to DDR3-1600 I don't think there's much in it one way or the other.
Justajohns T3400 with QX9650 @ 4.15GHz scored Passmark 6240, and supports Crossfire. But the above solution is cheaper and easier.
 
Here are 2 computers the one on the left is a 9 year old Dell BTX T3400 with QX9650 @ 4.16GHz and 8GB DDR2-800 RAM.
The left is 8core AMD @ 4.36GHz and 16GB DDR3 memory. Both are running the same HD7950 video card. The one withDDR2 scores higher.
It's total nonsense to tell people to replace their whole computer because it has DDR2 memory. Spend an extra $30 on he video card if your worried about it. You'll be way ahead.

http://www.3dmark.com/compare/fs/8650000/fs/6679081#
The T3400 has scored 7500 with 2-HD7850s.

I hope Justajohn doesn't mind me using his example. We've helped each other out with the Dell BTX O/C issue.
 


SoNic67,

Name the games that would run faster on a dual 4-core system with a (Passmark) single-thread rating of 1024 (E5520) or 1275 (X5450) than a single 4-core with a single-thread rating of 1869 (i5-2500).

BB





 



williamp,

I agree that RAM latency is important, but experientially so is general architecture, memory bandwidth and clock speed. As the OP was interested in specific systems, it's worth noting that the highest Passmark rating for memory of a T5400 with dual Xeon X5450's is 879 and the highest for any Dell using an E5520 is 1908. For comparison, the highest memory rating of an Optiplex 990 with an i5-2500 is 2389.

When I mentioned DDR3-1333 being "twice as fast", I was referring to the T5400 / X5450 which is using DDR2-667 (FSB = 1333) and believe that a system with a memory with a rating of 2389 will have be experienced as more responsive than a system with a rating of 879 regardless of latency. As you mentioned, the GPU power is going to disguise perceived latency.

I have three systems with DDR2- a Precision 390 (Xeon X3230 / 8GB / Quadro K600), Precision T5400 (2X Xeon X5460 / 16GB / Quadro FX 4800), and I'm writing this at the moment on a Dimension E520 (E6700 / 6GB/ GT 440). The problem I have with DDR2 is that under stress it runs very hot. The T5400 has a memory fan and even so, I've had RAM temperatures during rendering of 92C (the T5400 has sensors).

I've not told anyone to replace their system based on having DDR2 RAM. The idea was that the OP could have better performance for the same or less cost by selecting from a generation or two newer technology.

This is associated with the generally higher performance of a newer generation of CPU's, greater memory bandwidth / capacity, motherboards, etc. Besides the higher capabilities of a 2nd generation i5 to X5000 or E5500 Xeon A DDR3-1333 system has more memory performance potential than DDR2-667, 800, or 1066. This is based on experience with DDR2-667 and DDR3-1333 (Precision T3500, T5500), 1600 (HP z420), and 1866 (HP z420) plus benchmark results.

I see you have a hot rod E520- CPU of 4493, memory rating of 993- well done. How did you overclock the QX6800? The E520's are really nicely made.

Cheers,

BambiBoom

HP z420 > Xeon E5-1660 v2 (6-core @ 3.7 /4.0GHz) / 32GB DDR3-1866 / Quadro K4200 (4GB) / Samsung SM951 M.2 256GB AHCI / Intel 730 480GB/ Seagate Constellation ES.3 1TB

Passmark> Rating: 5581 / CPU: 14046 / 2D: 838 / 3D: 4694 / Mem: 2777 / Disk: 11559
 
The suggestion that DDR2 made a sytem obsolete was made by someone else today. To see this twice in one day reminds me of the days when any BTX question was answered with "Get an ATX" PROBLEM SOLVED. You are one of the people who helped change that. You will notice I agreed with your advice about the newer system. But you should also mention that some newer Dells are built with single channel memory installed, and even with DDR31600 that is very slow. I just fixed one last week cost-$20 to go from 4GB single to 8GB DDR3-1600 dual channel. In BTX software overclocking the memory bus remains the same. So heat isn't an issue.
The fact is that DDR2 800 is only about 10% slower than DDR3 1333. Not twice as fast, not 50% faster. And that memory speed isn't that big of a factor in gaming performance anymore. A good overclock and GPU upgrade will more than make up for it. Also most Dells that support DDR3 have a 95W CPU limit that rules out Core2 extreme overclocking. (T3400 excepted). I actually avoid them due to that.
I know your advice is usually good, and based on actual experiance. But tests done on the X38 chipset that supports both memory types shows DDR2 is just as fast as DDR3 in the older computers being discussed here. It is incorrect to tell people otherwise. Let the memory vendors who came up with the PC3-8500 is faster than PC2-6400 lie do that . At least they have a "motive".


My E520 is running QX6800 @ 3.72GHZ, with R9-285ITX. It scores 7004 in Firestrike (58%). My PSU and GPU can be moved forward later if needed.
I wrote an article here at Tom's "Overclocking Dell BTX Computers" The T3400 has a lot more potential than the E520. I'm building one now.
I must give thanks to Kisianik, and Justajohn for the work they've done on the locked BIOS overclocking issue. I think we were all helpful to each other.

The fastest XEON T3400 at Geekbench3 scores 5919 multicpore. My E520 is already at 6829 (Dell DM061 there 02/14/2016). The only place it scored higher was memory speed.
I'm running Linux right now so I can't look it up, but my Windows Experience score is equally limited by CPU , and memory speed. GPU and SSD being both higher.
 
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