Does Nvidia Physx matters?

[santi28]

For real,does it matter? all the physx on-off videos in youtube showcasing Physx seems to be endorsed by Nvidia, so doesn't really have any credibility(imo at least). I am new PC enthusiast, the only highend card i ever bought was a GTX280 so I wouldn't know what a high-end ATI could do. I am thinking of going ATI for my new rig(5970 perhaps?), but because fear of of loosing Physx, I am hesitating. Any constructive opinion on this would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you

 

[AMW1011]

Jack sorry, but I just can't take you seriously. I HAVE PhysX, I am not impressed, even in Batman AA. Also when you include the fact that an actual industry standard is here, why the hell do you think PhysX has a future? There are no benefits to PhysX now in any DX11 title. Sure I suppose they could throw in PhysX for those who don't have a DX11 card, but the OP as well as most people on these forums will have one. Not to mention it will not be long before the majority of PC gamers have DX11 cards. And lets not even speak of the extra costs in for developers.

Give me one reason, any reason, that PhysX has a future, or that it has advantages over an industry standard even though it is proprietary. Give me one reason, that's all I ask.

You can quote old sources all you want and you can point to a handful, or less, of products and act like they aren't just there to cash in on the hype NOW. It doesn't matter, nor do I care, common sense and market trends will win out.

If you love vaporware and dead tech. then I'm happy for you. If you think flying papers, or ANYTHING, in a single game is worth $65, I'm happy for you. Just don't try to justify it by telling me that I am wrong. I'm sorry if I would never make a $65 investment for some cheap effects in a single game, hell I wouldn't pay that for a huge graphical difference in a single game, especially with little replay value and no multiplayer.

 

[sabot00]

Well , quoting THG, it sure seems like they were a lot more impressed with PhysX in Batman than they were with DX11 in Dirt 2 .... I recall reading, "once you turn PhysX on, you won't turn it off" and "DX11 has marginal impact on gameplay while taking a colossal hit on performance".

So whaddya think is going to happen to all those bug bucks executives at Asus and EVGA who have just released PhysX only hardware....PhysX only GFX cards, PhysX specific MoBos .....I'm gonna guess that these industry insiders who get paid lotsa money to know what they are doing will be on the unemployment line in 6 months. I guess they shoulda consulted with you first before they made this major decisions which will have a major impact on their company's bottom line .

I am less concerned with promoting one company over another than I am in in helping people enjoy themselves. If you think $65 investment is a huge waste, I'm sorry....to me and all the 1,000 + posters over at:

http://www.ngohq.com/graphic-cards/16223-nvidia-disables-physx-when-ati-card-is-present-28.html#post82812

All these ATI owners apparently found the $65 well worth it....tho it seems most when in bigger and bought better cards.

You realize when they turn PhysX on they use a dedicated card for it, if you turned DX11 on and added another card in CF you're not going to lose performance.

DX11 is like DX9.0c & DX10.1, it has the ability to increase performance, better lighting & texture compression can greatly increase performance.
DiRT 2 tacked on DX11 support in the last 2 months of development, why are you only using that game Jack? Afraid AvP/STALKER: CoP will debunk your view?

 

[Mousemonkey]

Do AvP and Stalker have DX11 physic's then?

 

[strangestranger]

???

 

[JackNaylorPE]

You realize when they turn PhysX on they use a dedicated card for it, if you turned DX11 on and added another card in CF you're not going to lose performance.

Apparently THG didn't as they used both single cards and dedicated in the review.

DX11 is like DX9.0c & DX10.1, it has the ability to increase performance, better lighting & texture compression can greatly increase performance.

o you saying DX10 had the ability to do something but just never did it ?

DiRT 2 tacked on DX11 support in the last 2 months of development, why are you only using that game Jack?

Is there a THG STALKER AvP review that I missed ?

 

[Mousemonkey]

???

Well the threads about PhysX and I want to know how those two games are going to debunk anyone's view.

 

[sabot00]

Jack's view is that DX11 is very demanding, even more than PhysX, turning DX11 on in either AvP or STALKER doesn't cost much performance.

 

[Mousemonkey]

Jack's view is that DX11 is very demanding, even more than PhysX, turning DX11 on in either AvP or STALKER doesn't cost much performance.

Oh OK, so how demanding would a DX11 game be if it also used Nvidia's PhysX?

 

[notty22]

There haven't been enough looks at AvP dx11 usage, looks, performance benefit or hit. I've read some are having trouble with dx11.exe, but with PC games , don't know if its the end user in those cases. People panic.

 

[strangestranger]

Oh OK, so how demanding would a DX11 game be if it also used Nvidia's PhysX?

me metro2033 would appear to answer that I believe.

 

[sabot00]

A game using DX11 & PhysX at the same time would actually not be able to test either API's performance.

GTX 260 in Batman AA:

Without PhysX (Control):

105-42=63. 63/105 = 0.6 = 60% drop in performance.
In other words, the performance (FPS) is 40% of what it was without PhysX.

HD 5870 in STALKER: Call of Pripyat

DX11:

DX10.1:

DX10:

DX9:

Link:
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,700136/Stalker-Call-of-Pripyat-Benchmarks-from-DirectX-9-to-DirectX-11/Practice/

Average changes:

DX11 / DX9:
Day - 44/108 = .41 = 41% DX11 performs worse, 59% drop
Night - 38/119 = .32 = 32% DX11 performs worse, 68% drop
Rain - 41/128 = .32 = 32% DX11 performs worse, 68% drop
SunShafts - 29/54 = .54 = 54% DX11 performs worse, 46% drop

DX11/DX10:
Day - 44/38 = 1.16 = 116% DX11 performs better, 16% gain
Night - 38/33 = 1.15 = 115% DX11 performs better, 15% gain
Rain - 41/35 = 1.17 = 117% DX11 performs better, 17% gain
SunShafts - 29/27 = 1.07 = 107% DX11 performs better, 7% gain

DX11/DX10.1:
Day - 44/37 = 1.19 = 119% DX11 performs better, 19% gain
Night - 38/33 = 1.15 = 115% DX11 performs better, 15% gain
Rain - 41/34 = 1.21 = 121% DX11 performs better, 21% gain
SunShafts - 29/26 = 1.12 = 112% DX11 performs better, 12% gain

The differences between DirectX 9 and DirectX 10/11 as well as DirectX 10 and DirectX 11 are quite obvious.

DX11 only performs worse than DX9 (around 60.25% worse), while being better than DX10 (13.75%), and DX10.1 (16.75%)

 

[Mousemonkey]

me metro2033 would appear to answer that I believe.

March 16th IIRC, it could be good but then again I've read that it's heavily scripted so how that's going to translate in the game play we'll have to wait and see and I haven't seen anything that states it's going to incorporate PhysX.

A game using DX11 & PhysX at the same time would actually not be able to test either API's performance.

What!!, how so? As we don't have such a game yet how are benchies from games that are not both DX11 and using PhysX going to prove anything?

 

[sabot00]

If you bench the game while running both PhysX & DX11 then you can't blame performance on either API as there are 2 variables.

 

[Mousemonkey]

If you bench the game while running both PhysX & DX11 then you can't blame performance on either API as there are 2 variables.

So what game has both a DX11 path and Nvidia's PhysX?

 

[sabot00]

None yet that I know of.

 

[JAYDEEJOHN]

How bout using the gaames we do have using the same HW? Then compare "costs"?

 

[Mousemonkey]

None yet that I know of.

My point exactly, you can't say how it's going to be based on the benchies you posted earlier and yet you say that neither API would be tested.

 

[sabot00]

My point is that DX11 improvements in STALKER & PhysX in Batman AA are similarly noticeable, while PhysX tanks a huge performance hit DX11 does not.

 

[bystander]

Both DX11 and PhysX improve performance, BUT both either is used to improve eyecandy they can also hurt performance. It's all a matter of how the developer uses it.

 

[JackNaylorPE]

My point is that DX11 improvements in STALKER & PhysX in Batman AA are similarly noticeable, while PhysX tanks a huge performance hit DX11 does not.

In the Dirt2 review, THG describes the performance hit as "colossal" .... and I'm afraid, with all of DX11's power, the games of XMas 2011 will humble any card made in 2010....which make sme nervous about $700 GFX card investments

Is there a side by side video for STALKER that I can look at that shows the same scenes side by side like there is for Batman on the firingsquad site. I been anxious to see just what a developer can do w/DX11 .... I didn't expect that to be before this time next year.