Question Does this kind of memory exist yet? 7000+ MT/S 128GB total?

[audi9111]

Hello everyone,
I'm trying to build a PC and it seems to be impossible to find any kit of 32GB sticks above 5600MT/S
I'm looking to get 7000MT/S or higher but I cannot seem to find any company that does this.
The motherboard I have has 4 slots (It's an Asus Z790), it can take 128GB max but there doesn't seem to be any kind of memory that can handle it.
The CPU I have is a 13th gen i7 (I didn't need an i9 there difference in price for what advantages it offered didn't make sense)
Just trying to figure out how if this memory configuration exists.
Thanks!

I'd like to make a quick edit on this, the official specs for a 13th gen i7 is 5600 MT/s. I know boards can make the ram run at faster speeds with the XMP profile but is it a true 7000 MT/s we are seeing or is the board allowing the ram to run at a higher speed by introducing a different bottleneck that doesn't really give that actual speed?

I've researched this and it's a little conflicting when it comes to answers. Some people say "If the board can support it then it will work because Intel's specs are what is officially guaranteed to work", others say "Yes the board can post a higher speed but The CPU will never allow the memory to operate at a higher frequency so although you see it as higher it's never running higher because the CPU is limited to what it can support"

 

[Darkbreeze]

No, there are not currently any 32GB DIMMs that are 7000 MT/s or higher.

This is the fastest kit using 32GB DIMMs that I am aware of.

PCPartPicker Part List

Memory: Corsair Vengeance 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-6600 CL32 Memory ($324.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $324.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-03-07 18:10 EST-0500


But these are coming very soon.

G.Skill pushes DDR5 to new heights with a DDR5-6800 CL32 memory kit

Not bad. Not bad at all.

www.pcgamer.com

And I've seen mention that there ARE a few 2x32GB kits at 7000MT/s but I do not see them available anywhere at all yet.

 

[Karadjgne]

If you're after 64GB of DDR5, your options are limited. The Alder Lake memory controller struggles with high density configurations, which is why there are very few 2x32GB kits available.

PC Magazine

Can prolly infer from that statement that 64Gb/128Gb kits are going to most likely stay under 6000MT/s for a minute. The sweet spot for Ryzen 7000 series is also 6000MT/s, so I'd hazard a guess that the fast ram like 7200MT/s or even the upcoming 8000MT/s are going to be in the 2x16Gb sizes for the foreseeable future.

 

[audi9111]

Thanks!
Of course this kit is unavailable anywhere in Canada (why would it be)
This PC is not going to be used for gaming, so I am wondering if getting a lower latency ram will run better than a higher latency ram. I am going to want to eliminate any bottleneck possible .
Those 6800MT/s kits were announced in Sept. but are still unavailable.
The fastest I can find is 6400 in Gskill and Corsair

 

[audi9111]

I may go with this

https://www.newegg.ca/g-skill-64gb/..._re=F5-6400J3239G32GX2-_-20-374-432-_-Product

Because the 6600 corsair doesn't seem to exist in canada :\ Unless someone has insight on where I can find it.
I also have read that the higher frequency ram has trouble

I don't suspect there to be that much difference in real world speed between the 6600 and 6400 frequency.
Any thoughts?

 

[Karadjgne]

Latency and speed are 2 different things, and depending on the software depends on the results. Programs like AutoCAD get more use out of speed than latency, OBS gets more use out of latency over speed.
G.Skill 5600 C28 is available as 32GB and 64GB and for many things will be faster overall than Corsair 6000 C40 etc

Figure timings are like walking through a room. Speed is how fast your feet move, latency being how many steps taken. Other timings being how fast you open the door, walk in, close the door, open the next door, walk through etc. So having a Geisha, whose feet physically move very fast can be useless if she takes too many steps to cover the distance between doors, taking too long, but a dude taking long strides can also cover the distance much faster, even if his actual pace is slower.

The better ram has moving feet fast, taking longer so consequently less strides to cover the distance. It's all about throughput, the overall time for data to open the first door until when it walks out the last door.

Also take into consideration the memory controller plays a major part in all this, not everyone can move their feet that fast without tripping, so a slower speed ram, with tighter timings can often be much more stable than higher speed ram with looser timings.

Either way, I don't see 5600/6000MT/s ram as being a 'bottleneck' in anything, software in general wasn't written to use ram optimally at those speeds, almost everything was written last year and was based on 4400MHz-4800MHz yet will still run extremely well on ddr4 2666, since that's a major office pc update that's still relatively recent.

 

[audi9111]

Thanks that's actually very informative.
I'm building this to be the fastest possible on a PC that will primarily be used for hyper-v
So I am going put this in a 13th gen i7 but I'm a little torn over what kind of memory to get. I don't necessarily want the fastest because it's the newest, moreover I want the kind of memory that will give me the best performance overall.
The rest of the components on the PC are good, the motherboard, the nvmes. The rig won't be used for gaming so it's really going to be about getting the maximum performance out of the components.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Latency and speed are 2 different things, and depending on the software depends on the results

Gotta disagree here. The software really has no bearing on true latency, and true latency, in the end, determines how fast the memory operations are able to be completed.

As originally handed down to me by Computronix and as I have often passed along, it looks something like this. Obviously, this was based on DDR4 parameters, but should hold true for pretty much any memory configuration for the most part.

Memory specifications and overclocking can be very deceiving. If you're unaware, here's the formula for "True Latency":

1 / Frequency (not DDR) x Latency = True Latency (nanoseconds).

Stock 3200 @ 14 is faster than Stock 3600 @ 16:

1 / 1.600GHz x 14 = 8.75nS
1 / 1.800GHz x 16 = 8.89nS

Stable Overclock with 3733 @ 16 is faster:

3733 @ 16 is 1 / 1.867GHz x 16 = 8.57nS

By calculating True Latency, when experimenting with memory overclocking, it becomes much easier to determine with greater consistency, where you might expect to find that elusive fuzzy-grey edge of stability.

Accept for applying excessive or prohibitive voltages above 1.35, which can potentially damage your processor's IMC, even with the best chips, any Frequency / Timing combinations that result in True Latencies below about 8.5'ish to 8.4'ish MAY be unstable, or unbootable.

So yes, if you can find a somewhat slower kit with really good timings OR very good quality that allows you to significantly tighten the timings manually, then that very low (Mostly gonna point to the CL latency here) latency will often make the memory operations faster than significantly higher frequency kits in terms of true latency, which basically dictates how fast your memory operations will be. There are of course OTHER factors involving some of the other timings as well but tightening timings and overclocking are an entirely separate conversation.

 

[Darkbreeze]

Thanks that's actually very informative.
I'm building this to be the fastest possible on a PC that will primarily be used for hyper-v
So I am going put this in a 13th gen i7 but I'm a little torn over what kind of memory to get. I don't necessarily want the fastest because it's the newest, moreover I want the kind of memory that will give me the best performance overall.
The rest of the components on the PC are good, the motherboard, the nvmes. The rig won't be used for gaming so it's really going to be about getting the maximum performance out of the components.

The "best performance overall" is the one that is stable. If you can find a kit that's between 6000 and 6600MT/s with fairly low latency it's probably going to be very close to the overall true latency of any 7000MT/s kit you find which almost certainly will NOT be low latency simply because those speeds are new, on the cutting edge of the process development, and will not have had time to mature in order for manufacturers to develop low latency versions of those kits and likely won't for quite some time.

 

[Karadjgne]

@Darkbreeze This is a hard subject, mainly because I really can't explain my thoughts well on it. But you basically said what I was trying to say.
To take ddr3, since I did the calculations on that year's ago, 1600/9 is hundredths of nanoseconds slower throughput than 1866/10, and again for 2133/12. Meaning for most things there's zero definable difference. CT defined 'true latency' as the time of entry to the time of exit, throughput.

There are some programs, including some games, that do benefit from the faster frequency, the larger bandwidth, so the program itself responds better or gets higher fps. Just as there are programs that responded better, were more stable on the lower frequency, smaller bandwidth.

Even though for most, there was zero definable difference between the 3. With today's Ryzens, there's been the same with 3600/16 and 3200/14, some memory controllers preferring the 3200 over the 3600, even though what goes in and what comes out, is almost identical in terms of actual time.

1600/8 is faster overall than 1866/10 by a visible margin, boot times, windows files opening times etc. They benefitted from the lower timings more than the faster speeds. AutoCad, ms flight benefit in the other direction.

But as you also pointed out, CL isn't the only timing.

 

[audi9111]

Ok so, all that being said what is a "good" CL for something in the 6000 to 6600 range?
The Gskill I looked at above has these CLs

• CAS Latency 32-39-39-102

Are these acceptable for tight timings?

 

[Darkbreeze]

For speeds over 6000MT/s it is unlikely yet that you will find any kits with lower than CL32, so yes, those should be pretty good. Be sure not to go with any of the Trident Z5 "Neos" kits, as those are intended for Ryzen/AMD platforms. The regular Trident Z5 kits and the Ripjaws kits are good.

 

[audi9111]

Hello,
So I ended up buying gskill 6400 128gb (4x 32)
When I apply XMP to my asus z790 plus wifi board the machine does not boot. It doesn't like XMP enabled no matter what profile i pick.
The memory is ddr5 6400
cl 32-39-39-102 1.4v
I applied the latest bios for that motherboard to which the release notes say

TUF GAMING Z790-PLUS WIFI BIOS 0812
Version 08129.35 MB
2023/02/24
"1. Improve system performance
2. Support high-capacity DDR5 memory kits"


But nothing can get it to load properly. I don't know how to set the settings manually though
Is that a possibility?
It seems the memory is currently running at 4800

Any ideas?

 

[Karadjgne]

Xmp is a generic setting that covers like 95% of users, but that does leave some who may require a manual tweak, it has to do with everything from the memory controller in the cpu, the board, board design, tolerances etc, so it's very hit-or-miss and not specific to any one setup.

Set xmp. Scroll down, you'll see a 1.4v set for dram voltage, somewhere, try changing that to 1.43v.

Also, you can look for VCCIO and VCCSA, and if they have an option for offset, add 0.05v - 0.1v.

Those should be the Only settings that may require bumping.

 

[Darkbreeze]

What is the EXACT model of the memory kit you went with?