EU Ends Microsoft Antitrust Probe; Hello Browsers!

[deathblooms2k1]

This is BS. How do I get my web browser listed? I mean I only hold .0000000000000000000000000000001% market share right now, but it's still not fair that my browser gets no advertisement. Anyone know who I need to sue? I just figured I would hop on the band wagon of making money off of other peoples work.

Netscape died because it was worse than IE. That's no fault to microsoft, if your product is decent people will use it. I'm sure Firefox would have much greater market share right now if it was out during the Netscape days. You need to look no further than Google to see this concept.

It would be one thing if Microsoft was paying company's to push their product, that's anti-competitive. But I fail to see how it's a bad thing when Microsoft gives consumers more for less (bundling a Web Browser, wordpad, *gasp* calculator).

 

[widcard]

, Windows 7 use is now at six percent of the entire world market. Great now watch the EU try to call that a violation of EU antitrust rules.

 

[sqhacker]

if this is the case then i better see IE as a choice to install on Mac computers, because if psystar has to stop their sales for infringing on the lisence agreement then the EU is stepping over their bounds and should fairly aproach Mac with the same thing

 

[mlopinto2k1]

Everyone is pissed at this but everyone cries about Explorer. Make up your damn minds.

 

[deathblooms2k1]

[citation][nom]mlopinto2k1[/nom]Everyone is pissed at this but everyone cries about Explorer. Make up your damn minds.[/citation]

I think it's two different things. People aren't pissed about the possibility of IE losing market share, as you said many people dislike IE. People are pissed that a company has lost it's right to do what it want's with it's own product and is being forced to advertise for their competition.

I don't like IE myself, I use firefox. But I still think this is wrong. Like I said it would be an entirely different story if Microsoft was paying other companies to push their product instead of their competitions but as far as I know this is not the case.

 

[stromm]

Wait! How is it that I never knew I didn't have a choice to use a browser other than IE? I want to sue MS for not pointing out to me that I have to use their browser and that I was never allowed to use Netscape and then Firefox as I've always done.

Seriously though. Does this mean that Microsoft is responsible financially for maintaining uptodate versions of those non-MS browsers on it's media? What will happen when new browsers are release? Will MS have to include those as well... When will it stop? What about a notepad replacement or a filesystem replacement or a defragmenter or, or, or.

This is like what's happening with Intel. A small company makes it big and everyone wants a piece of them to the point that the government realizes it can also make money (fines) off that big company so it sues "in the name of" the smaller company. Only those fines don't go to the smaller companies, they go to the government's coffers.

The lesson to be learned it that you don't let your company get TOO big.

 

[AdamB5000]

I might contact the EU because when I purchased my used car the dealer has put Havoline oil in it. I wanted Mobil 1. I had no choice.

Sure, they both work and allow my car to function, but what the hell??

 

[Guest]

[citation][nom]cinergy[/nom]As a professional web developer I can say all IE versions are horrible (8 is almost ok) and cost a ton of money to my company to support them. In Firefox, Chrome, Safari and even in Opera, pretty much everything just works as specified. No hacks needed. Less IE = less headache.[/citation]

Seems like a professional web developer would write their software to work on the most popular web browser, which is I.E., and then port it over to work on the others. You don't develope windows software using a mac...

Question though, if you make a website work on Firefox, will it work on all other bowsers except I.E.? I was always under the assumption that all browsers are different...

 

[CoryInJapan]

although I hate IE and Love using Firefiox. It does sound unfair to MS as Its they're damn OS that THEY made and if THEY want to put THEY're Ineter browser in THEY'RE OS then to bad if you dont like it. ITs THEY'RE damn OS.

Like Forcing walmart.com to have a Price comparison feature on the walmart website with target,Kmart,Sears,Etc.

 

[thackstonns]

If I was Microsoft, I would just pull sales in the EU. I mean come on what are they going to do use Linux or a Mac. It would be two days before the EU dropped this crap. You would have every pc maker that ships overseas banging on thier door. Not to mention the business's that run windows. Dont compete at all.

 

[guythepro]

I pity the users who will get stuck with AOL installed on their system because of this.

 

[IzzyCraft]

Lol
"Opera, Chrome, Safari, Firefox, AOL, Maxthon, K-Meleon, Flock, Avant Browser, Sleipnir, Slim Browser and Internet Explorer."
The real version

Opera, Firefox, Internet Explorer ... people use other browsers idiots...

Good Job EU now you'll confuse the F out of people who aren't too savy when that many choices.

And what about Manufactures like Dell or w.e I'm pretty sure they'll just shove IE and maybe FF on there.

 

[guythepro]

[citation][nom]cinergy[/nom]As a professional web developer I can say all IE versions are horrible (8 is almost ok) and cost a ton of money to my company to support them. In Firefox, Chrome, Safari and even in Opera, pretty much everything just works as specified. No hacks needed. Less IE = less headache.[/citation]

Microsoft can lose its entire IE8 market share and it will affect you and other developers not in the least. Hacks are only needed for IE6 and 7, and given we're talking about new installs here, IE6 and 7 aren't even on the ballot and thus not an issue.

 

[edilee]

MS needs to grow a pair and fight this antitrust stuff a little harder since it is violating their rights to be competitive. I have never heard of any company in any line of business being forced to include part of a competitor's product within their product or having the option to use another's product within theirs.

And exactly what "market share" of any browser developer is being hurt? Has anyone here paid money for a browser? I am not exactly sure how exactly browser designers make money since I have never paid MS one cent for use of IE or anything related to IE and same goes for Firefox...not a dime to them either. I have never seen any information located in these browsers that would seem like a source of revenue for FF or MS.

MS should play the game hardcore and just ship all OS to the EU with no browser at all installed, no option to choose a certain one, nothing and then see how fast it lasts when no one can get on the net to even get a browser.

 

[neblogai]

Comments here are really funny. Almost no one understands the reason why EU required such option.. So here it is: MS holds monopoly in OS market, thus is able to push a monopoly in browser market as well- even with inferior browser. With this decision other browsers will become more visible and popular, it will make browser market and quality grow (and force MS to develop IE as well). If not for the Firefox project (luckilly, sponsored by IBM/Sun), everyone would still be on IE6/7.
As for the comparison with cars: there is no monopolist in car market, thus there is no reason to regulate it (force the market to be free). Same with other operational systems- as long as their product does not monopolise and hurt the market, market does all the needed regulation itself.

 

[logitic]

[citation][nom]neblogai[/nom]Comments here are really funny. Almost no one understands the reason why EU required such option.. So here it is: MS holds monopoly in OS market, thus is able to push a monopoly in browser market as well- even with inferior browser. With this decision other browsers will become more visible and popular, it will make browser market and quality grow (and force MS to develop IE as well). If not for the Firefox project (luckilly, sponsored by IBM/Sun), everyone would still be on IE6/7.As for the comparison with cars: there is no monopolist in car market, thus there is no reason to regulate it (force the market to be free). Same with other operational systems- as long as their product does not monopolise and hurt the market, market does all the needed regulation itself.[/citation]

That would matter if you had to pay for MS browser.. You don't. It's free. There isn't a penalty for using another browser.

I use Firefox. But I didn't need the EU to push MS to show me other options are out there. I simply looked for them.

It's the precedent of the EU body enforcing a company to sponsor another that is simply ridiculous.

 

[neblogai]

IE is free because MS can't sell it- so charges for it by including the development cost into Windows OS price- which is the main platform, so purchased by 90% of the people. Even if you use Firefox, you paid for IE when you bought Windows.
If you don't understand the problem with such distribution- imagine MS giving you, lets say, 5 decent Microsoft mice and keyboards free with the purchase of their OS. This would of course cost MS, so the price of OS would be higher, but almost noone in the world would buy (and produce) any other mice- because there'd be MS mice everywhere. The development of other mice would stop. Of course, giving away hardware like that is risky and adds to the costs. However, enforcing software is easy and cheap- production costs do not increase with volume of copies- but competition gets destroyed just the same.

 

[thackstonns]

[citation][nom]neblogai[/nom]Comments here are really funny. Almost no one understands the reason why EU required such option.. So here it is: MS holds monopoly in OS market, thus is able to push a monopoly in browser market as well- even with inferior browser. With this decision other browsers will become more visible and popular, it will make browser market and quality grow (and force MS to develop IE as well). If not for the Firefox project (luckilly, sponsored by IBM/Sun), everyone would still be on IE6/7.As for the comparison with cars: there is no monopolist in car market, thus there is no reason to regulate it (force the market to be free). Same with other operational systems- as long as their product does not monopolise and hurt the market, market does all the needed regulation itself.[/citation]

So you are saying That because of Mozilla IE was forced to upgrade thier browser. Looks like competition to me. And just think that happened all without the EU making Microsoft hawk other warez. Maybe the EU should come up with thier own browser, pay for the advertizing for it, and put out pba's instead. Oh wait they are too lazy suing big business for making something for free.

 

[PraxGTI]

I run an office with over 400 computers. My domain policies are set up to block any OS other than IE simply because through group policy I can set any and all rules associated with IE and prevent the users from breaking their computers. If it isn't Microsoft, I don't want it on my network.

Windows 7 and IE8 = no problems for every day users.

 

[falchard]

EU is working hard to drive business out of Europe. Thumbs up, they are helping bolster the collapsing US economy.

 

[mrmez]

Am i missing something here???
M$ is in TROUBLE for including its internet browser with Windoze???
wtFFFF!!!!

Thats like going to Ford and saying "nuh uh. Its anti competitive to ONLY put a Ford engine in a Ford car, you have to offer a GM engine too."

Don't get me wrong, i hate IE and think M$ are a bunch of twatwaffles, but this is beyond belief.
Way to go EU. Create a monopoly in currency but outlaw it in browsers.

 

[matobinder]

They didn't make them include Lynx as a browser!

 

[back_by_demand]

Normally I post relatively short posts, but on this occassion I feel I have to rant. EXCESSIVELY!!!

This is the WORST case scenario forcing MS to include Opera, Safari, Chrome, Firefox and half a dozen shit browsers NO-ONE has ever heard of as well in the installation so you pick at the beginning. That sets a legal precedent so anyone with a bit of freeware can force them to have it included. It has happened now so Windows 8 will open the floodgate for shit freeware to be forced upon us.

Imagine during the install you are asked to select your favourite from 12 calculators, 35 notepads, 88 paint programs, 134 solitaires - where does it end....?

Here's a conversation between the EU, MS and the customer...

EU - "You will include alternative versions of all this list of stuff in your OS"

MS - "You are having a laugh right? There's over 12,000,000 programs here"

EU - "Yes, each one has a legitimate claim to be included because it's something you do already"

MS - "Have you any idea how much that will cost?"

EU - "About a billion dollars unless you shape up"

MS - "Whatever you say Jack, here's your library of disks"

Customer - "Jeebus H Christ, this new Windows comes on 14 Blu-Ray disks"

MS - "An engineering feat of genius to compress it that small"

Customer - "After decompressing and installing it's over 700Gb and my machine chugs like a bitch"

EU - "Yes, but you have the ultimate choice to pick whatever you want"

Customer - "Can't I choose to have all this crap elsewhere to download?"

EU - "No, you can't, shut up and do as you are told"

/rant

 

[Guest]

They were not forced to advertise other competing products. As far as i recall, it was M$ itself who proposed this solution as a better alternative to having no browser running on your system at all.

 

[back_by_demand]

[citation][nom]srasiroslayer[/nom]They were not forced to advertise other competing products. As far as i recall, it was M$ itself who proposed this solution as a better alternative to having no browser running on your system at all.[/citation]
OK, with that in mind, here’s the same conversation between MS and the EU, before the customers jump in.

EU – “We want you to remove IE as it is not fair to other browsers”

MS – “But it’s free, and so are theirs, and anyone who wants them can freely use them without restriction or bias”

EU – “We don’t care and if you don’t comply we will fine you a billion dollars”

MS – “OK then matey, whatever you say, here’s a version with IE taken out”

EU – “Thanks”

Customer – “Hooray, no IE on my system, now I can use whatever browser I want, maybe I’ll try Firefox”

MS – “Good luck with that”

Customer – “Hey, I can’t get to the Firefox homepage, how the hell do I download it?”

MS – “You can’t, the EU made us take IE out, you’ll have to get a hard copy on a flash drive or CD from a friend”

Customer – “I’m a bit of a geek so I don’t have any real friends apart from the ones I have on Facebook, which I’m now unable to also access, so I’m totally isolated”

MS – “There is a solution, you can use Windows Update and install IE, when that works you can go to the Mozilla site and download Firefox”

Customer – “That sucks ass big time, the EU are technological retards”

EU – “Yes it does suck ass and we are technological retards, but we really wanted a billion dollars and they called our bluff”