News HDMI Forum rejects AMD's HDMI 2.1 open-source driver

[Admin]

As HDMI Forum discards AMD's proposal regarding open-source HDMI 2.1 driver, Linux users with advanced monitors are advised to use DisplayPort.

HDMI Forum rejects AMD's HDMI 2.1 open-source driver : Read more

 

[ThomasKinsley]

I anticipate a lone wayward AMD engineer will 'leak' the driver, against all orders from AMD, of course, and anonymously so they cannot find out who it was.

 

[snemarch]

Yet another reason to abolish HDMI and only purchase DisplayPort-capable hardware.

Greedy royalty rent-seekers and Digital Restrictions Management supporters should be shipped off to Siberia.

 

[ezst036]

This is one of those things that through-no-fault-of-their-own advertently or inadvertently ends up holding back open source.

[Someone tries a Linux live CD] *Boots to black screen* "Well it works on Windows, so I don't want to use Linux. None of this junk works."

"But [thing x] works just fine on Windows or my Mac" Yes, but it's not that the driver makers could not figure out how to do it, didn't have the time to do it, etc etc.

"Well, it doesn't work." &%@##!

It's the continual fight against both the chicken and the egg at the same time. AMD are trying to "do the right thing" here. HDMI forum are plain and simply saboteurs. The industry is fraught with them from this standpoint.

 

[Zaranthos]

This is one of those things that through-no-fault-of-their-own advertently or inadvertently ends up holding back open source.

[Someone tries a Linux live CD] *Boots to black screen* "Well it works on Windows, so I don't want to use Linux. None of this junk works."

"But [thing x] works just fine on Windows or my Mac" Yes, but it's not that the driver makers could not figure out how to do it, didn't have the time to do it, etc etc.

"Well, it doesn't work." &%@##!

It's the continual fight against both the chicken and the egg at the same time. AMD are trying to "do the right thing" here. HDMI forum are plain and simply saboteurs. The industry is fraught with them from this standpoint.

True. On the bright side at least some companies are trying now. I read articles like this and make a mental note, go display port for all hardware and stay away from HDMI whenever possible. It only hurts the HDMI spec in the long run, but there is collateral damage to open source along the way like you said. I also watch and see AMD putting in real $ and effort to support open source so I'll buy their products as well. This from someone who barely uses Linux but still wants the option to.

 

[kanewolf]

So, AMD pays fees for their Windows driver, but won't pay fees for the open source?
Probably not the case.
OR was their open source driver rejected because it gave away too many of the proprietary details that AMD had reverse engineered ?
My guess is the latter.

 

[setx]

was their open source driver rejected because it gave away too many of the proprietary details that AMD had reverse engineered ?

AMD bought the license, they didn't reverse-engineering anything.
But they can't publish the code because it would "leak information" on that proprietary garbage.

 

[thisisaname]

HDMI is dead long live Display Port!

 

[kanewolf]

AMD bought the license, they didn't reverse-engineering anything.
But they can't publish the code because it would "leak information" on that proprietary garbage.

Just like other "open source" drivers, there are some parts that are only released as compiled binaries. WIFI radio drivers are this way to comply with the FCC, for example.

 

[Order 66]

HDMI is dead long live Display Port!

It's a shame that TVs don't use DisplayPort though. If you want to use a tv as a monitor, you have to use HDMI.

 

[Joseph_138]

I anticipate a lone wayward AMD engineer will 'leak' the driver, against all orders from AMD, of course, and anonymously so they cannot find out who it was.

AMD would still be held responsible for the leak, and be sued. They have a duty to lock down the driver, now that they've been told not to release it, and failure in that duty will result in a lawsuit, even if a lone employee takes it on themselves to release it, anyway.

 

[suryasans]

Since its founding, HDMI organization has been the main proponent of display that can protect DRM content.

 

[ezst036]

So, AMD pays fees for their Windows driver, but won't pay fees for the open source?
Probably not the case.
OR was their open source driver rejected because it gave away too many of the proprietary details that AMD had reverse engineered ?
My guess is the latter.

Neither option.

DRM. It's all about DRM.

DRM, DRM, DRM. (Just to be clear here)

 

[bit_user]

HDMI is dead long live Display Port!

I wish this were true, but a lot of monitors seem to include more HDMI ports than DP (not to mention TVs, as @Order 66 pointed out).

Also, HDMI kvm switches are cheaper and more plentiful than DisplayPort ones.

 

[MatheusNRei]

It's a shame that TVs don't use DisplayPort though. If you want to use a tv as a monitor, you have to use HDMI.

There is one: https://www.philips.ae/c-p/559M1RYV_89/momentum-4k-hdr-display-with-ambiglow

Although I can't find it for sale in my country.

 

[Order 66]

There is one: https://www.philips.ae/c-p/559M1RYV_89/momentum-4k-hdr-display-with-ambiglow

Although I can't find it for sale in my country.

I was referring to the US, and I'm not sure if that would be available in the US, but it's interesting for sure.

 

[bit_user]

DRM. It's all about DRM.

DRM, DRM, DRM. (Just to be clear here)

But DisplayPort also has DRM, so it's probably not that!

The article says:

"in 2021 the HDMI Forum restricted public access to its specifications. This move was to ensure that only authorized manufacturers and developers can access the technical details required to implement HDMI features in their products (and pay royalties to developers of respective technologies)."
​

It's no joke that HDMI support has been getting implemented in products by unlicensed or non- royalty-paying entities (mostly in East Asia, I think...), so I can understand the desire to put a stop to that.

 

[MatheusNRei]

​

It's no joke that HDMI support has been getting implemented in products by unlicensed or non- royalty-paying entities (mostly in East Asia, I think...), so I can understand the desire to put a stop to that.

True, but that approach is like gaming DRM such as Denuvo, it does more harm that good in the long run.

 

[bit_user]

True, but that approach is like gaming DRM such as Denuvo, it does more harm that good in the long run.

That's just the nature of the beast, unfortunately. HDMI has always required hardware makers to pay royalties. Fortunately, DisplayPort took a different approach.

 

[snemarch]

Just like other "open source" drivers, there are some parts that are only released as compiled binaries. WIFI radio drivers are this way to comply with the FCC, for example.

And this is pretty awful.

I'm OK with a few things being opaque binary blobs, like CPU microcode patches. I can probably be convinced that it's OK **parts** of WiFi or GPU functionality requires blobs – there might be trade secrets, and it's better to have updateable firmware than baking all the secrets into hardware...

But there's too much of this stuff. And in some cases it's outright insane, like the case of Rasbperry Pi: the "main" ARM processor isn't actually in control, initialization as well as some runtime stuff being run by a closed firmware blob on the VPU.

 

[digitalgriffin]

It's all about the money. (Royalties) This is why Display Port was created by computer mfg's. It's because none of them wanted to pay the royalties for HDMI Use. (There's a charge for every port that is HDMI)

 

[digitalgriffin]

Yet another reason to abolish HDMI and only purchase DisplayPort-capable hardware.

Greedy royalty rent-seekers and Digital Restrictions Management supporters should be shipped off to Siberia.

While I agree royalties are somewhat evil here (Blatent money grab)

Royalties help with:

1. Paying for research of future versions
2. Pays for testing to assure compliance
3. Without licensing, there is no penalty for violating standards. Anybody can slap a "HDMI V2.1 ready" on their box if it's compliant or not. That can damage the standards image.

We used to make a product that was used world wide and cost tens of hundreds of thousand per unit sale. It was deeply thermodynamicly engineered, and every time we made a rating change to the software, we had to pay a licensing fee to say we are certified. The board in question would physically rate the said product in a lab and see if our results matched. If not we failed. And every submission cost BUCKU bucks.

Not only did it have to be performant as to the #'s, but be accurate weight wise (within 5%) before the object was built. (Architects needs this information when doing load analysis) Contractors need it for crane counterweights, billing, and shipping requirements.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Support DisplayPort in everyway possible, DO NOT buy devices with HDMI if you can avoid it.

 

[UnforcedERROR]

It's a shame that TVs don't use DisplayPort though. If you want to use a tv as a monitor, you have to use HDMI.

TVs don't use DisplayPort because HDMI, theoretically, simplifies setups.

The reality is much different, of course. Video and audio in the same signal path, along with copyright protection, makes everything less convenient. The myriad of issues users run into because of the all-in-one solution are boundless, mostly to do with equipment handshakes.

Still, video and audio connections being separated are always the easier route, and situations like this only serve to illustrate the shortcomings of HDMI. AMD made the right call for having 2.1 on their cards, but garbage like this ruins that for everyone.

 

[snemarch]

TVs don't use DisplayPort because HDMI, theoretically, simplifies setups.

The reality is much different, of course. Video and audio in the same signal path, along with copyright protection, makes everything less convenient. The myriad of issues users run into because of the all-in-one solution are boundless, mostly to do with equipment handshakes.

Still, video and audio connections being separated are always the easier route, and situations like this only serve to illustrate the shortcomings of HDMI. AMD made the right call for having 2.1 on their cards, but garbage like this ruins that for everyone.

FWIW, DisplayPort also carries audio.